Panic Growing as 10 Scientists Mysteriously Die or Vanish

10 missing scientists with access to. classified stuff. Do you think that this. is connected or totally random? >> Well, I hope it's random. So, pretty serious stuff. Are aliens real? Uh, they're real, but I haven't seen. them in and and they're not being kept. in uh What is it? >> Area 51. >> Area 51. My husband is missing. Okay. >> and he's it's been about 3 hours. and I have some [music] indication that.

he must have planned not to be found. We. have at least 10 scientists, some dead, some missing, all with apparent ties to. nuclear [music] space technology, and. now the FBI and the White House are. investigating. So, is this just a string. of unfortunate disconnected [music]. coincidences or is something else going. on? Is something far more sinister, far. more serious, going on? We're going to. try to break it all down for you with. the latest updates right now. Welcome to.

Sidebar, presented by Law&Crime. I'm. Jesse Weber. A retired two-star Air Force general. walks out of his house in the middle of. the day. William Neil McCasland, 68. years old. For 34 years, he worked on. some of the most sensitive technology. the US military has, reportedly. astronautical engineering, space. acquisition, the National Reconnaissance. Office. We're talking about the spy. satellites. And eventually, he took. command of the Air Force Research. Laboratory at Wright-Patterson Air Force.

Base in Ohio. The same Wright-Patterson. that people believe have claimed for. decades stores debris from the Roswell. incident. That has been a conspiracy. theory. And this is the same base where, according to his wife, McCasland had. access to, in her words, some highly. classified programs and information. So, when a man like that walks out and. doesn't come back, obviously people. notice. Apparently left his phone on the. counter, his prescription glasses, his. smart watch. Apparently changed his. clothes into something his wife couldn't. even identify, and then nothing. No.

sightings, no video, no answers. His. wife calls 911 just hours after he. disappeared. We have that call, by the. way, the audio that we were the first to. release. We heard this before anyone. else had. Here's what you told the. dispatcher. My husband is missing. Okay. >> and he's it's been about 3 hours and I. have some indication that. he must have planned not to be found. He's left his phone, he changed his. clothes into I don't know what.

He turned it off and left it behind, which seems kind of deliberate cuz he's. always got his phone. So, apparently. turns it off, leaves it behind, seems. kind of deliberate because he's always. got his phone. But, here's the thing. McCasland isn't the only one. Since. 2023, at least 10 people who are tied to. US nuclear and aerospace research have. either died or disappeared. This is. according to the House Oversight. Committee, which announced an. investigation last month. A NASA JPL.

scientist who studied comets and. asteroids died in 2023. The cause? Never. publicly disclosed. A rocket scientist. who reportedly invented a space-age. metal used in advanced missiles vanished. while hiking in California. Family says. she was just a regular person. An MIT. physicist on the brink of. revolutionizing fusion energy shot to. death in his own home. His 12-year-old. daughter found him. Astrophysicist who. helped discover water on distant planets. shot dead front porch in the desert.

And those are just some of the names. When a reporter asked President Donald. Trump about this, here's what he had to. say. 10 missing scientists with access to. classified stuff, nuclear material, aerospace, they've all gone missing or. turned up dead in the last couple. months. Based on what you've been. briefed, what do you think is happening. here? And do you think that this is. connected or totally random? >> Well, I hope it's random, but we're. going to know in the next week and a. half. I just left the meeting on that. stuff, Jack. So,

pretty serious stuff, but we're going to. be. hopefully, I don't know, coincidence. [music] if you want it whatever you want. to call it, but some of them were very. important people and we're going to look. at it over the next uh uh. So, some lawmakers right now say it. could be a foreign operation. The FBI is. now spearheading the effort to look for. connections. The White House is. investigating. And there are other. people, including some of the families, that say this is just a coincidence. People die, the scientists are human.

beings, that's it. They point that out. People go missing, this is life. But. again, you have the government looking. into this. So, we're going to lay out what we know, what we don't know, what the government. isn't saying. And I want to bring on a. uh private investigator who worked as a. police sergeant and FBI counterterrorism. veteran. He was a Las Vegas uh shooting. responder, and he's going to walk us. through what we should be thinking about. in terms of this investigation. Now, according to the House Oversight. Committee, which apparently sent letters. to the Department of Energy, the. Department of War, the FBI, NASA, at.

least 10 individuals with ties to US. nuclear secrets or rocket technology. have died or mysteriously vanished in. recent years. And by the end of April, Congressman Eric Burlison put the number. at 13. Here's what the committee said in. their press release, quote, "These. deaths and disappearances may represent. a grave threat to US national security. and to US personnel with access to. scientific secrets." But, here's the. challenge for anyone trying to connect. the dots. It's that these cases span. more than 3 years. They stretch across.

multiple states. And the circumstances? They're all over the map. So, I want to. go case by case. The earliest case on. the committee's list is July 2023, Michael David Hicks, 59 years old. According to the American Astronomical. Society, he worked at NASA's Jet. Propulsion Laboratory, JPL, for nearly. 25 years specializing in comets and. asteroids. He served on the DART project. and the Deep Space One mission. His. cause of death?

Never publicly disclosed. His daughter, Julia Hicks, told CNN she. doesn't understand the connections or. the connection between her father's. death and the other cases, saying, "I. can't help but laugh about it. But at. the same time, it's getting serious.". 1 year later, July 2024, Frank Meiwald, 61 years old, German-born researcher at. JPL. According to his obituary, he had. an illustrious career in space and. science research. His cause of death? Also never Also never publicly. disclosed. Daily Mail reported there's.

no record of an autopsy even ever taking. place. We'll talk about if that's. unusual. All right, real quick. I'm sure you guys. have seen all the headlines about how so. many Americans are struggling with debt. right now. But then it shows up, you. know, it shows up in your own numbers, rising balances, fees, minimum payments. that stretch out for years. It doesn't. need to stay that way, though. No. Today's sponsor, PDS Debt, has helped. hundreds of thousands escape debt, reduce what they owe, and take back. control. So, whether it's credit cards. or personal loans or medical bills, PDS.

Debt has customized options to help you. pay off debt faster. No minimum credit. score required. They look beyond the. numbers and they design personalized. plans to help put money back where it. belongs, in your pocket. Plus, they're. A+ rated by the Better Business Bureau. Every month you wait is just going to. cost you more. But, your way out starts. right now. When the numbers are clear, act. Take back control in 30 seconds. Get your free personalized assessment. and the best option for you at. pdsdebt.com/sidebar.

That's pdsdebt.com/sidebar. pdsdebt.com/sidebar. May 2025, Anthony Chavez, 78 years old, retiree, worked as a foreman at the Los. Alamos National Laboratory. Same lab. that developed, you know, the atomic. bomb. According to Los Alamos police, he. disappeared from his New Mexico home, left behind his car, his phone, his. wallet, his keys. Exhaustive searches. turned up nothing, no signs of foul. play, no indication he was planning to. leave. His friend, Carl Buckland, told.

CNN it's about time authorities are. looking into it. Month later, June 2025, two people, both tied to sensitive. research, both missing. First, Melissa. Casias, 53 years old, an administrative. assistant at Los Alamos National. Laboratory. According to New Mexico. State Police, she was last seen walking. along a highway. Her keys, phone, purse. were found inside her home. Her phone. had been factory reset. Her daughter. told NBC's Dateline her mother had been. going through a huge huge huge amount of.

stress. Monica Jaramillo Reza, 60 years. old, director of materials processing at. NASA's Jet Propulsion Laboratory. According to LA Mag, she disappeared. while hiking in the Angeles National. Forest with two people from her yoga. group. Searchers found no trace of her. Here's what her family told LA Mag, quote, "She was just a regular person. who had a family." They also said no one. from the White House or the FBI has ever. contacted them about her disappearance. Now, here's a detail that reporters. uncovered. According to Newsweek and the.

Daily Mail, Reza invented something. called Mondaloy. It's apparently a. space-age metal that's used in advanced. missile and rocket engines. And her work. was funded by the Air Force Research. Laboratory, the same lab that a retired. general named William McCasland had. apparently once commanded. We're going. to come back to that. August 2025, Steven Garcia, 48 years old, a. government contractor at the Kansas City. National Security Campus in Albuquerque,

according to the Daily Mail. That. facility manufactures more than 80% of. the non-nuclear. components that go into America's. nuclear weapons. Garcia was a property. custodian there, so they gave him top. security clearance, broad access to. classified equipment. He was last seen. leaving his Albuquerque home on foot. carrying only a handgun. Again, sound a. little familiar? December 2025, Nuno. Loureiro, 47 years old, Portuguese. professor of nuclear science and. engineering at MIT. He was the director.

of MIT's Plasma Science and Fusion. Center working on fusion energy. According to a detailed account from. journalist Jessica Reed Kraus based on. police reports and surveillance footage, here's what happened. This was a big. case. December 15th, the man named. Claudio Valente parked a gray Nissan. Sentra near Loureiro's Brookline, Massachusetts home, lingered for hours, wore a yellow reflective safety vest, carried a box with a barcode. At around. 8:30 p.m., Loureiro's 12-year-old. daughter heard the doorbell. She ran to.

answer it. Her father followed behind, told her to come back inside, and. according to the report, she then heard. three or four gunshots. And when she ran. back to the entry foyer, she found her. father lying on the ground in a pool of. blood. And Valente fled with his. headlights off, and we know that he also. carried out that mass shooting at Brown. University. Two students killed, 11. wounded. After 5 days on the run, he. died from a self-inflicted gunshot wound. inside a storage unit in Salem, New. Hampshire. Now, authorities later.

confirmed that Valente had attended the. same university program as Loureiro in. Portugal between 1995 and 2000. February. 2026, Carl Gromer, 67 years old, Canadian-born astrophysicist at Caltech. According to his colleagues, he helped. discover water on a distant planet. He. identified galactic streams that. reshaped how scientists map the cosmos. Just after 6:00 a.m. on February 16th, according to the Los Angeles County. Sheriff's Department, Gromer was found.

on his front porch. This is in Llano, California, 75 miles north of Los. Angeles, suffering from a gunshot wound. Pronounced dead at the scene. 29-year-old named Freddy Snyder was. arrested and charged with murder, carjacking, burglary. He's being held on. a $2 million bail. Now, police haven't released a motive. It's unclear if the two men knew each. other or if the shooting was targeted. But then, February 27th the same month, William McCaslin, the retired two-star.

general we told you about the top. And. according to the Bernalillo County. Sheriff's Office, a repairman showed up. at his home at around 10:00 a.m. His. wife left for a doctor's appointment at. 11:10. She returned home at 12:04, and. he was gone. Again, left his phone, glasses, smartwatch, changed his clothes. His .38. caliber revolver was missing. His wife. told the dispatcher he had said if his. brain and body kept deteriorating, he. didn't want to live like that. She also. told CNN, "It seems quite unlikely that. he was taken to extract very dated. secrets from him.".

But still, weeks turned into months, no. sightings, no video, no answers. March. 2026, Jason Thomas, 48 years old, pharmaceutical researcher at Novartis. working on cancer treatments. According. to reports, his body was found face down. in a lake in Wakefield, Massachusetts. Both of his parents had died in quick. succession shortly before he went. missing. Official cause of death not. confirmed. And then there's other cases. that the committee is still apparently. looking at. Matthew James Sullivan, former Air Force intelligence officer.

According to the New York Post, he died. of an accidental drug overdose in May. 2024 just weeks after he reportedly. agreed to testify before Congress about. government UFO programs. Congressman. Eric Burlison told Fox News he died by. suicide, called it suspicious saying he. was scheduled to come in for an. interview within 2 weeks. He had. suspiciously, implying he went out on. his own terms. Amy Estrogen, 34 years old, founder of. the Institute for Exotic Science in. Huntsville, Alabama, specializing in. quantum computing and gravity.

modification. According to Rolling. Stone, she revealed in a rambling 2020. interview that she had plans to disclose. information about UFOs and. extraterrestrials and was allegedly. receiving threats as a result. She died. in 2022. Her family told CNN, "People. should realize that scientists die also. and not make too much of this." Joshua. LeBlanc, 29 years old, NASA nuclear. scientist died in a car crash in Alabama. last year. Ning Li, an anti-gravity. physicist who died in 2021 at age 79.

after being struck by a car. Both names submitted by Congressman. Burlison for scrutiny. So, 13 people in total, right? 10 of. them being investigated by the. committee, tied to nuclear research, aerospace, classified programs. stretching from 2021 to 2026, spread. across the country. Some lawmakers say. it's a foreign operation. The FBI now. leading the effort to look for. connections. Susan McCaslin Wilkerson, so the general's wife even joked about. the UFO theory. She wrote on Facebook, "With absolutely no sign of him, maybe.

the best hypothesis is that aliens. beamed him up to the mothership.". However, no sightings of a mothership. hovering above the Sandia Mountains have. been reported. And by the way, it's not. just online conspiracy theorists asking. questions about UFOs. Former President. Barack Obama was asked on a podcast, "Are aliens real?". Responded, "They're real, but I haven't. seen them. They're not being kept in. Area 51. There's no underground facility. unless there's this enormous conspiracy. and they hid it from the President of. the United States." That got a lot of. attention. So, Obama later clarified on.

Instagram. He said, "Statistically, the. universe is so vast that the odds are. good there's life out there, but the. distances between solar systems are so. great that the chances we've been. visited by aliens is low." And he added, "I saw no evidence during my presidency. that extraterrestrials have made contact. with us." Really? So, where does an. investigator even start with something. like this? How do you tell the. difference between a pattern and a. coincidence between espionage and just. tragedy? So, this is where we need. somebody who has done this work, who.

knows this. I want to bring on Ashton. Pack, private investigator. Ashton, thank you so much for taking the time to. talk about this. First of all, how significant is it now the FBI, the. president, the House Oversight. Committee, they're all looking into. this? I think it's significant. I think it's a. it's very warranted. I think at the end. of the day, a complex, full-blown FBI investigation. by the nation's, you know, best. investigators is very needed for this. situation. I don't know that correlation equals.

causation. I don't know that they're. I don't believe they're all related, but. I think there's some definite weirdness. going on here, some X-Files kind of. stuff, if you would have it at that. Well, it's definitely weird. I think we. can make a conclusion it's definitely. weird. If it's connected or not, that's. what I want to explore. But when the. FBI, it's announced that it's. spearheading the effort to look for. connections, what does that mean? What. are they doing operationally behind the. scene to potentially connect the dots? And it feels like if you're looking into. so many different cases, you know, that.

could take some time. Yeah, there's a saying, you know, where. I came from when I was in law. enforcement and when I was on the FBI. task force as a local investigator, you. know, you can have the information fast. or you can have the information right. You cannot have both. And I think that's part of the world of, you know, several generations who have, you know, every 48, 45-minute, you know, CSI show or whatever. SVU, you know, it's all the cases. cleanly wrapped up in that time frame. It's just not the real real world. And.

so, FBI is, you know, the world's. premier law federal law enforcement. entity. They have. just an amazing amount of knowledgeable. investigators. Plus, they have the. tools. And what they're going to look at. is, you know, the main concern here is. this some kind of foreign. counterintelligence, foreign. nation-state conducting some kind of. targeted assassination or kidnappings of. our people. I think that's the first and. foremost concern. Let's explore that. because you had former FBI Assistant. Director Chris Swecker told the Daily. Mail, "China, Russia, Iran, North Korea, they all have motive." Congressman.

Burlison said, "We're in competition. with China, Russia, and Iran on nuclear. technology, advanced weapons, and space. Meanwhile, our top scientists keep. vanishing." So, you know, throughout this you'll say, you know, correlation, causation. I am. curious though if this was a foreign. entity or foreign entities, they had to imagine this would get. picked up. Now, then again, it was. really only the McCaslin episode that. really. started getting the ball rolling and. everybody looking into these things. from, you know, years prior. So, it does.

make me wonder, is this common work from. foreign intelligence agencies or foreign. governments? Um because on one hand, it's bringing a. lot of attention. And if they did want. to kidnap scientists or take scientists. or make them disappear, whatever it. might be, is this the way that they. would. do that? Is this operation. or operations. seem common? Well, I know when our when we're talking. about foreign nation-states that that.

are the enemy of the United States, you. know, we we probably have done and. worked with other. countries to do targeted. generally America, the United States. will not do targeted assassination. Um for the most part. Uh but not to say. that, you know, kind of using proxies or. that our our allies in other places of. the world will. And so, you know, we. have to there's that moral line there of. what do we, you know, what do we say we. can and cannot do under the the rules of. engagement in the United States. Those.

are questions to be answered in the. highest, you know, highest halls of. Washington, D.C. where the. you know, the elected officials and. those career bureaucrats are are making. decisions that affect the American. people to safeguard this country. Um. but I I think that. yeah, I mean, if you're a foreign. nation-state, first of all, why why do. you want to target our our people? Is. there motive? And if so, how would you. go about doing that? I don't know that. this is the way that you would do it. Again, I don't think everything here is. connected. I've looked at, you know, many of these cases. Personally, I think.

there's three cases that are very, very. unique and interesting. I think that. that should be the focus. And I don't want to give up sources and. methods, but I think if it's not already. happening, they're probably having some. kind of a foreign. like a counterintelligence. uh. you know, case set up, a system set up to kind of. keep an eye on the people who are with. us still. I'll just leave it at that. Oh, interesting. So, you mean other. high clearance scientists and engineers,

you think they're keeping an eye on them. now to see if there's anything. that should be happening? Well, I think common sense would dictate. that in lieu of recent events. Again, I. don't want to give up sources and. methods, but and and you know, look, you. know, people within the highest ranks of. our federal government and the federal. law enforcement and the intelligence. community, they're not stupid people. They have. They have a lot of tripwires and rings. of security around certain things in our. country that we have to safeguard,

especially when it comes to advanced. technology and nuclear technology. So, there's many safeguards already in. place, but you know, I I would be I. would I would want to think common sense. would rule the moment here. So, in other. words, when you look at this, even. though you have multiple people, nuclear. aerospace research, but disappearances, killings, maybe natural causes, suicides, accidents, whatever it may be, you believe there are some that are. automatically being ruled out and just. because. they have a common connection. or or they're in a common industry, you.

you can separate that out, whereas there. other ones that may may be connected in. some way. Correct. I I I think you can rule out. several of these cases fairly quickly. Um there were some homicides, some. murders that occurred, arrests were. made, you know, they they they they were. able to go back. Again, I I would still. investigate just because people are. asking questions and when you have. congressional leadership on the hill. sending letters to the, you know, director of the FBI, let's just do what.

the FBI does best. Let's just put this. all to rest. Now, again, are they going to trust and like what. they have to hear from this. investigation once the FBI gets it done. cuz again, it will not be done in a. couple weeks. This takes a long time. And they can throw teams of people at. this along with technology as well as. some other programs they have in place. But for me personally, I think the most. interesting, you know, the case I would. really focus on are the three folks tied. to Los Alamos. You know, you know, that. place is a very very.

that's basically where all nuclear. technology in our country emanated from. That's the kind of the birthplace of our. nuclear era. And so, I just feel that there's too. much correlation there, but there's. yeah, there's going to be a lot of these. cases here where you're going to be able. to kind of go, all right, it looks. weird, but we were able to, you know, dig down into the facts and figure out. what was going on here. This person was. an unfortunate victim of a crime and. that was put to bed pretty quickly. The. McCaslin one is the thing that started. everything and I think it's very. strange, right? You got a retired. two-star general, allegedly walks out of. his house, leaves his phone, glasses,

allegedly changes his clothes, vanishes. His wife says he talked about maybe, you. know, having these darker thoughts if. his health kept deteriorating. She also says he seemed very deliberate, that he planned not to be found, had. this revolver with him. The sheriff said. he wouldn't normally hike with a weapon. He was very active guy. Wife told the. the 911 dispatcher he had said, "If my. brain and body keeps deteriorating, I. don't, you know, want to live like. that.". And we know that his name appears in.

these hacked WikiLeaks emails about. Wright-Patterson and Roswell. He. consulted for Tom DeLonge on UFO. research. The McCaslin one I have to. imagine is where they start. What stands. out to you about that? What do you What. do you think about that one? Well, you just have such a high-ranking, you know, member of former member or. current member of the United States at. two-star general. Um but look, if the guy was in pain or. he was having issues with his health, you know, and he and he walks off, goes.

for a long hike with a pistol and. nothing else. It very well could be that. that, you know, he decided he didn't. want to be on Earth anymore and that was. his decision to make. Yeah, I think it. still needs to be investigated. You. know, the ties to Tom DeLonge and and. Roswell and all that stuff, what's the point of killing this person. if that was the case? I mean, this. information has already been out for. decades. I mean, Bob Lazar leaked all. this in the late '80s to George Knapp. here in Las Vegas, you know, via via the. news here. Uh and and of course, you. know, he wasn't unalived. And so, what.

what would be the motive here? Is there. something more to it? Does the Does the. announcement of the disclosure of UFO. UAP materials and then he disappears? Obviously, people are going to make. connections even though there has been. no established connection, but that's. what you're going to That's I think the. counterargument to that would be is like. the timing of this was really. interesting. >> [snorts]. >> Yeah, yeah, the timing is interesting. Look, I'm an I'm a theory of Occam's. razor guy. You know, the simplest. explanation is usually the correct one. We can't have everything be a conspiracy.

because then we miss out and we are. blinded or can't see the forest for the. trees into the real conspiracies cuz. real conspiracies do exist. They have. existed over time. Uh we live in this. day and age too where our I think our. technology and our internet fuels the. frenzy of conspiracy theories. So, if. the general was having a lot of health. problems and just happen to have, you. know, a stellar. amazing incredible career that had links. to potential extraterrestrial or. ultraterrestrial is the other word I'm.

hearing and and the and the biologics. tied to that and the weird things we're. seeing in the sky that we hear our. government actually acknowledging. finally and talking about. I I don't. know that it's going to be correlated to. that. It's just it it's going to have to. be investigated ultimately. It takes. time and that's where that investigation. will hopefully, you know, answer these. questions that we have. You mentioned. connections. I mean, McCaslin apparently. oversaw funding for Monica Ressa's. missile metal project. Ressa, Hicks, Maywald, they all worked at JPL. Cassius. Chavez, they both worked at Los Alamos.

So, you talk about exploring these. things. How do they explore it? And by. the way, are they going to get. roadblocks if you're talking about high. clearance, top secret, confidential. information? How much and I I I know I. keep repeating this question, but how. much. do you think investigators will get the. full story about what work they were. involved in, what they were doing, what. the connections were because I think. that's a key component to this. Yeah, it's a good question. I mean, ultimately, you know, every you know, your frontline FBI all all the members.

of the FBI are top secret cleared. Uh. agents can be read into uh. SAP programs or or special access. programs which, you know, that's how they. compartmentalize these programs, especially in our, you know, anything. nuclear, missile technology, advanced. weaponry. So, it but you're right. I mean, at the. end of the day if if the agent. ultimately what's classified about. having to investigate basically a. missing person's case here? What what. what clearances do you need? What SAP. programs do you need to be read into? Um there might be a few things that, you. know, the agents have to be read into,

but ultimately, what are we trying to. do? We're trying to figure out if a. nation-state or nefarious actors are. targeting people within certain programs. of our weapon systems of our military. and our government. And so, I I don't. know that you're going to need to have a. huge amount of people getting read into. certain programs. Uh I'm sure maybe. there there should be some, but at the. end of the day, was there a homicide? Was this person. uh you know, killed at the hands of. another human being nefariously? I don't know what what clearances you.

would need to have that to answer those. questions. Mm. Let me ask you about a. couple people. So, Nuno Lererro, MIT. fusion scientist, apparently killed by a. former classmate from Portugal who also. committed a mass shooting at Brown. University. This is a big case. Shooter's dead. No known motive. Put. that one there. Carl Gromer, astrophysicist, shot on his front porch. Suspect arrested. No known connection. between them. Do you look at cases like. that and say, move on? Those aren't ones. we need to explore any further?

Well, I think you can you can look into. it. It's just time and budget. That's. what, you know, is the FBI they're going. to set up a special program for this, a. special case number. And how how much time do we allow, you know, the investigators to dig into. these cases when it's pretty, you know, if it looks on the surface that it was. random acts of violence. I think the. Brown shooting one it it that could be. that could be interesting. I would like. to to dig down into that suspect's. world, see where his ties were. I see a. giant link chart in a giant fusion.

center at the FBI somewhere where. they're going to start putting everybody. up on basically like a board where these. analysts are going to start plugging in. and that will kind of help the. investigators kind of see the links and. see who's tied to what. Ultimately, I. think, again, you know, correlation. doesn't always equal causation. The. person shot by the active shooter from. Brown, the person shot in the, you know, front foyer of his apartment, suspects. in custody, arrested, had committed. crimes that day. I think those can be put to bed pretty. quickly, but again, I I don't know how.

far down you dig. Some people will never. be satisfied with the answer. They want. to see conspiracy. They want to see a. vast, you know, X-Files world out there. that that, you know, we just don't know. and the government is lying to us. That's, you know, ultimately, what I think some. people just want. What about the timing? So, the House Oversight Committee. announced its investigation April 20th. The White House press secretary said. she would look into it on April 15th. The president said he'd have answers in. a week and a half. Later said so far. there's not much of a connection. What.

do you make of the public statements? I I think they're just statements to the. press that are just made. I don't think. the president, you know, no disrespect. to the president, but you can't know. these answers in a week and a half. You. can get a You can get a top-tier brief. You know, not a top-tier, but you can. get a brief after a week and a half of, "Hey, this is kind of where we're going. and this is what we think we want to do. with these cases." But you're not going. to know in a week and a half. I don't think you could have the entire. FBI digging up, you know, spending all. their energy on just one thing and get. answers in a week and a half. Again, you.

can have it right or you can have it. fast. You just can't You can't have. both. Mhm. You know, the families, Julie. Hicks, Richard Estridge, Susan McCaslin. Wilkerson, they seem to all be pushing. back against the conspiracy theories. Like they're saying, you know, people. die, scientists die, they're human. beings, people go missing, it's not. connected. How much do investigators. take that into account, what the. families are saying? They should absolutely take it into. account. You know, families know best.

What do strangers on the internet know? We think we know a lot, but we but we. really don't know the deep downs uh. secrets of people's lives. Scientists do. pass away, scientists do unalive. themselves, people in the military, unfortunately, you know, these things. happen. Uh again, I'm not saying that we. shouldn't investigate, but it you know, when the family like I saw one lady, her. her her dad was a part of this, and. she's just she just [snorts] doesn't. understand it because she knows exactly. what her dad went through, what happened. to him, and how he. ended up passing. Um it has it's hard.

for the victims because they have to. rehash all this again. They're you know, there's a part of the grieving and. mourning process, and now all of a. sudden their loved ones are in the. limelight, and it [clears throat] gets. tied into these conspiracy theories, and. and this is how now people are making a. living, you know, like what we're here. talking about right now. You know, they. they get frustrated as victims. So, I I. feel very bad for those folks. But. again, you know, if you have the. slightest chance that foreign nation. states, foreign actors, or or just. terrorism in general could be targeting. our people, our scientists, we need to.

look into that. Yeah, and I think it's important to. separate fact from fiction, right? It's. important to cover this. It's obviously. you want to cover it because the the. government of the United States is. talking about and investigating it, but. also trying to figure out what's at. stake here. I mean, I guess there's. parts of it that you mean you said weird. or strange, right? So, some of these. people reportedly died of natural. causes. Um but when you look at. something like Hicks died of. cardiovascular disease, according to the. LA medical examiner, but the cause was.

never widely reported until the Times. got the records, or Frank Maywall, no no. no autopsy on record, that's per the. Daily Mail. They're saying this, um you know, do are those kinds of. things that bother you that we don't. have more details about that, or is that. normal? No, I think it's pretty normal. Most. people who pass away, there's not an. autopsy. Um they're expensive. Uh if. there's autopsies are usually done for, you know, homicides, suspicious,

unknown, you know, something weird. But. if somebody has a medical episode and. passes away, there's usually not an. autopsy done. Uh death records don't. necessarily just get uploaded into some. public database where everyone can go. and look. You'd have to do a a Freedom. of Information Act request to get that. information. So, it's not usually placed. into a public record or open-source. information where people can go and. readily access that. And that's for. privacy reasons. For again, you know, I've lost loved ones. I don't. necessarily want their death record, you. know, out on the internet for all to. see.

Amy Estredge uh worked on quantum. computing, gravity modification, apparently said she was getting threats. over UFO disclosure. She. turns up dead at 34, no cause of death. released. Her father, former NASA. scientist, says, you know, there's. nothing more to see here, really. Matthew Sullivan, Air Force intelligence. officer, agrees to testify before. Congress about the UFO program, and 2. weeks later, he's dead of an accidental. overdose. Now, Congressman Burlison has. been pushing for a year. The FBI.

seemingly won't confirm or deny if. they're investigating. So again, these. these issues I mean, it does also become. a question. Why do you think that is? I. mean, how much do you think we're going. to know? How much do you think we're. going to know about the investigation or. the end results of this? Yeah, I. again, it's going to take time. And in the meantime, uh life continues. to happen, and all the other things in life that we. have to talk about and report about will. occur. And a couple years down the road. when they release this, you know,

after-action report, will we still be. curious about everything? And still will. we still want to know all the stuff. about this current incident that's. occurring right now? Uh people say they don't you know, people say all the time they're not. feeling like they want to unalive. themselves, and then they do it. I saw. that throughout my career in law. enforcement, unfortunately. I saw people. who said, "Oh no, no, I'm fine." And the. next day, they they changed their minds. Um you know, I I I I think uh. you know, you would be surprised how. many people have secrets. What It's.

like, you know, he somebody actually. overdoses on pills. This happens all the time in this. country. This This is hundreds of. thousands of people a year losing their. lives. This just happens to be an an Air. Force intelligence officer. This happens. to be the the daughter of a and she was. a scientist, and her dad was a scientist. tied to the NASA space program. So, I guess I guess I guess the the the. bigger one is like how people just. disappear, right? Like if you're talking. about Maccallum or Garcia, one thing for. people to go off grid, but you know, how.

how how can you do that? How and and and. you know, even if you're dealing with a. situation if somebody did something to. themselves, you don't find the body? I. mean, how difficult is it? I mean, there's one thing to say that you're. talking about disappearance of people in. the same industry, that in and of itself. is strange, but if they can't be found, or there's no evidence of what happened. to them, that's the part I think that. makes people a little curious. Well, I and I think that should be the. focus of trying to get the answers from.

the investigators, but I will preface. with this. If you go walk out into you. know, if you walk into the Angeles. National Forest outside of this second. most populated city in America, and you. disappear, uh let's say you you you. let's say nothing nefarious happened. with you. You you fell, you had a. medical episode, or you or you took. chose to end your life, it's very good chances that your body. will not be found. Uh I don't think. people who realize, you know, how mother.

nature uh. kind of self-cleanses the area. If. you've never been hunting, as a hunter, I can tell you that uh. the thing that, you know, the thing that. passes away is not there 24 hours, not. even 12 hours later. It's been. completely pulled apart by, you know, coyotes, cougars, whatever's out in that. area. If you walk out of your house in. Albuquerque, New Mexico, and you go walk. out into the high desert, there's a very good chance that your. body won't be found. And down the road, you never know, some hunter, ATV rider, will find a wallet, will find the gun,

will find something, and then our. answers, you know, our our questions are. then answered. So, I again, you know, now if you walk out into the city, and. you're in the big city, and you just. disappear off the face of the planet, that's a little bit weird, and that's. where I want to see but that's what I. want to see the investigation try to. answer. Like, hey, we're we're pretty. sure that this person did certain. something to themselves out in the. wilderness, and the wilderness did what. the wilderness does, and it kind of has. this self-cleaning system in place. It's. a very, very unfortunate thing to think. about, but you know, No, it's not a.

Disney movie. Mother nature doesn't care. about that you're either you're a homo. sapien or you're a horse. You know, the. the system there scavengers are going to. get you no matter what if you go down. I. appreciate making that point. It's a. good point to make. Um all right, Ashton. Pack, we'll see where this goes. Thank. you so much for taking the time, sir. Thank you so much. It was good to see. you guys. That's all we have for you. right now here on Sidebar. Everybody, thank you so much for joining us, and as. always, please subscribe on YouTube, Apple Podcast, Spotify, wherever you. should get your podcast. You can also. check us out on NBC's Peacock as well.

If you want to follow me, X, Instagram, [music] my NewsNation show, Jesse Weber. Live, Monday through Friday, 11:00 p.m. Eastern. I'll see you next time, everybody.