Little Girl Locked in Closet for Months Starved to Death: Lawsuit

The day. that DCS took her back. was the hardest day I'd ever experienced. in my life knowing where she was going. >> When 5-year-old Kinsley Wely arrived at. an Indianapolis hospital in 2024, medical personnel said she weighed less. than she had when she was just two. [music] She was covered in lice and. feces. You could see her bones through. her skin and her hair was [music]. falling out. Officials say little. Kinsley starved to death locked in a. closet inside of a trailer home. And.

now, [music] as some of her closest. relatives who were supposed to love and. protect her are facing felony charges, [music]. her grandfather wants to make sure to. hold DCS accountable for its. investigation into Kinsley's well-being, or lack thereof. Welcome to Sidebar, [music] presented by Law and Crime. I'm. Jesse Weber. Now, here's the truth. We wouldn't. [music] be able to cover a story like. this if it wasn't for the incredible. support that we get from our sponsor, Morgan and Morgan. I'm talking about. America's largest personal injury law. firm. I'm talking about a firm with over.

a,000 attorneys who have recovered $25. billion for more than 500,000 clients. Think about that. In fact, in the past. few months alone, a client in Florida. received $12 million when insurance. offered just $350,000. Out in. Pennsylvania, another client was awarded. $26 million. That is 40 times the. insurers's offer. Morgan and Morgan. They make it easy to fight for what you. deserve. You can even start a claim from. your phone. So, if you're injured, you. can start a claim at. forthepeople.com/lcsidebar. You can click the link below or you can. scan the QR code on screen.

The paternal grandfather of an Indiana. 5-year-old who died last year has filed. a lawsuit against the state's Department. of Child Services, claiming an action by. nearly a dozen people allowed his. granddaughter to slip through the cracks. and ultimately into her grave. We're. talking about Kinsley Welty. Seems she. never had a chance. From the time she. was born, her mother was the subject of. multiple DCS investigations, including. when Kinsley was just one month old. And. according to court records, her mom,

Tony Mccclure, was actually convicted of. felony child neglect. But Kinsley and. her siblings were repeatedly returned to. Mccclure's care. This is according to. her grandfather, Brian Wely. And despite. multiple people knowing about the. conditions that Kinsley was living in, that's the allegation. They allegedly. didn't stop it and didn't report it. So. now Mccclure, her mother Tammy Hollley, and her living boyfriend Ryan Smith, they all face charges with Mccclure. expected to go on trial next year for. murder. And we got our hands on dozens. of pages of court documents that lay out.

the allegations against the three. defendants, as well as a brand new. lawsuit that was filed by Brian Wely. that names not only Mccclure and Smith. and Hollyley, but also specific DCS case. workers who allegedly not only dropped. the ball, but maybe never had it in the. first place. So, to help me talk about. this, I want to welcome on Indiana trial. attorney Andrew Baldwin. Thank you so. much for coming back onto the show to. talk about this. You know, I hate that. we have to talk about these stories that. involve alleged abuse against the most. vulnerable people in our society, but it.

is important to know what these. defendants allegedly did to Kinsley. So, to make sense of these charges against. the defendants as well as the. allegations made in the grandfather's. lawsuit, have you been following the. case? What are your initial thoughts on. this? >> I I was in trial last week and so I I. did not see anything on the news about. anything. We trial lawyers are usually. keeping our head down on what we're. dealing with. Then you read this uh the. the lawsuit, the allegations contained.

in it. And then that led me to the. probable cause affidavit of the other. defendants, the mom and the boyfriend. and the grandma. And it's some of the. most horrific details that you could. ever imagine. It's one of those cases. when you're a defense lawyer and and the. general public asks you all the time, "How do you defend these people?" And. [snorts] you always have your pat. answers. you know, I'm defending the. Constitution and whatever, but then you. get this type of case and I I don't know. that I could represent this woman if the. allegations are true. I would because. I'm a defense lawyer, but boy would it.

be tough. >> That's saying something because let's. talk about that. According to this. probable cause affidavit for Mccclure's. arrest on April 9th, 2024, Officer Ryan. Wright responded to a death. investigation at this trailer park and. saw paramedics performing CPR on Kinsley. inside the home. The affidavit says, quote, Officer Wright advised that. Kinsley's mother, Tony Mccclure, 29. years old, stated she had just picked up. Kinsley after she spent the last one and. a half months with her father, BW.

Officer Wright advised Tony, stated. Kinsley had a headache and that her legs. had been trembling. Tony stated that. when they arrived home, Kinsley. collapsed onto the floor. Officer Wright. stated Tony called for emergency. services after approximately 20, 30. minutes. Officer Wright observed a. bruise on Kinsley's face and noted that. it appeared Kinsley was malnourished. So, the paramedics rushed this little. girl to the hospital, but doctors. confirmed she was dead. The damage to. this child's body that was noted by. hospital personnel is heartbreaking.

Quote, "It appeared Kinsley was severely. malnourished. Kinsley was thin and her. eyes were sunken. Kinsley had what. appeared to be fecal matter on various. parts of her body, including the bottom. of her feet and in her hair. The fecal. matter had matted to her hair and to the. bottom of her feet. Kinsley had what. appeared to be lice or other similar. type tiny insects crawling on her face. and in her hair. Kinsley's hair was very. short in length and appeared very thin. There were also what appeared to be. bites or other unknown soores on.

Kinsley's abdomen area. The 5-year-old. had reportedly weighed just 21 lbs when. she died. Andrew, there's one thing. about testimony. There's one thing this. story versus this story, but how. critical is information provided by. medical professionals, doctors, first. responders when you're trying to. understand what happened to a small. child like this? it can be very very. important and usually is the the most. important thing um outside of. confessions and so forth which kind of. exist in this case but it is to paint. the picture at trial of what this child.

went through having a doctor in his suit. come up and swear under oath he's going. to tell the truth and then details with. photographs pointing to the different. pieces of fecal matter or whatever you. know the the bugs and the lice I mean. the jury will not be able to tolerate. that I'm is telling you is you'd like to. think you can win a case, but this might. be one that is unwinable. >> Well, let me ask you that. If evidence. is presented of photos of injuries or. testimony from expert witnesses, is that. enough when you're dealing with a.

vulnerable victim like this, when you're. dealing with someone this young, not an. adult, right? The alternative. explanations, I think, become limited. If you present photos of those injuries. and testimony, what is the defense? I. mean, is there anything more prosecutors. need to present? Do defense attorneys. present their own medical experts to say. there's alternative explanations for how. these injuries happen? Because if you're. talking about lice and you're talking. about fecal matter, there's the. caregivers are responsible. No.

>> Yeah. And the emaciated body as well. And she weighed 20ome pounds at age. five. Yeah. The only defense you're. going to have is the pointing the finger. at somebody else defense. And and the. mom Tony tried to do that initially by. pointing the finger at a dad that had in. the end you find out she had just flat. out lied to the police. She pointed the. finger and said, "This child Kinsley has. been with the dad for the last number of. months. I had no knowledge of what was. going on at his house." Then you find. out that she just flat out lied. So, if.

you if you are defense lawyer and you do. not have the ability to point the finger. at anybody else and you get the medical. evidence, it's one of those cases where. you really just need to sit down with. your client and have a a come to Jesus. talk about the the right moral thing to. do. >> Let's talk about that because when a. detective did an interview with Mccclure. at the hospital, she said that Kinsley. is one of the children that she has with. her ex BW, who we now know is Bradley. Welty. Now, Mccclure also had a child. who was just a few months old with her. boyfriend at the time, Ryan Smith.

Mccclure told officers that Welty had. wanted Kinsley to come stay with him, so. she agreed and met up with him at a. McDonald's. And according to Mccclure, she spoke with Kinsley while she was. away, but it was only through audio. calls. Bradley reportedly called her. after several weeks to say he had a work. commitment out of town, couldn't watch. Kinsley anymore, so they met back up the. same McDonald's. This is according to. Mccclure. And that is reportedly when. she realized what a bad state Kinsley. was in. But get this, another detective. was at the trailer where McCclure and.

Smith had been living with the kids. And. Mccclure's mother, so Tammy Hollley, her. grandmother, and her great aunt, they. showed up. And it turns out they were. told a much different story. What they. heard, according to the affidavit, was. that Kinsley had fallen in the bathtub. when Mccclure had momentarily walked. away. When Mccclure came back, Kinsley. was reportedly underwater and had. drowned. So Tammy claimed that Mccclure. tried to do CPR, but it was. unsuccessful. And the women also told. the detective that Bradley Wely was not.

involved. The affidavit states, "Tammy. stated Kinsley's father, BW, was not. involved and had not been involved with. Kinsley for some time. Tammy stated BW. had not had contact with any of the. children because he was in and out of. rehab." Tammy stated BW would not even. know what the children would look like, and she did not know where BW was. located. Tammy also stated the children. had been staying with Tony's boyfriend. Ryan for some time. So, according to the. police, all the people involved in this. situation couldn't seem to keep their. stories straight. Mccclure said Kinsley. had been with their biological father.

for weeks. Kinsley's mother, Tammy, told. police that would never have happened. Mccclure reportedly told a DCS case. worker, who just so happened to visit. the morning of Kinsley's death, that the. little girl was with her grandparents. And when police got in touch with. Mccclure's boyfriend who had the other. children, he said the kids had been with. him for several days and then admitted. that that was a lie that Tammy told him. to tell. So, it's a complete mess here, Andrew. And how does that affect. everything when you're having these. multiple stories? >> Well, I mean, if you're a prosecutor, it. just makes things so much easier um that. you can point to the fact that lying.

shows intentionality. The lead count on. the mom is murder, and you need. intentionality there. And when you are. lying, you know that you have done. something wrong. And I think that you. know the mom telling the boyfriend to. tell one lie. Now the grandma, her name. is Tammy Hollyy, that's the grandmother. of the deceased child. I don't know if. she's scurrying at that point or she. just didn't know which lie to tell, but. she basically told the police, "Yeah, my.

daughter lied to you." I don't know if. she used those words, but everybody's. starting to scatter now, it looks like. And probably what's going on is uh you. know what's what's really interesting to. me is ultimately the mom who's charged. with murder, she basically confesses. Had she not done that and just remained. quiet, the other two that are now. charged with F1 and in Indiana that's 20. to 40 years. That's the the boyfriend. Ryan Smith and the grandma who are are. charged with neglect causing death. If.

the mom would have shut up and not said. anything, they would be more valuable. they being the boyfriend and the. grandma. But I don't think the. prosecutors even need them anymore. The. the gr the the mom has has confessed. basically and said, "I did wrong and now. they're all going to, you know, boil. together." I think uh in this case, >> yeah, that that's a really good point. Um because there are other aspects to. this, right? We talked about physical. evidence. What does the physical. evidence show? So, while all this is. going on, you had crime scene. technicians that were going over this.

trailer with a fine tooth comb in the. back bedroom. They saw bunk beds where. it appeared two children had been. sleeping or slept. There was a large. dresser in front of the closet in that. room. And when they moved it out of the. way to open the door, the sights, the. smells horrific. The carpeted closet was. full of human waste. A horrific part of. this affidavit reads, "There had been. what appeared to be small handprints on. the interior of the closet door. These.

handprints appeared to be marked with. fecal matter. So when Mccclure spoke. with detectives about that closet, she. claimed to them that one of her sons had. a seizure disorder and when his seizures. occurred, he would use the bathroom in. the closet. But in fact, investigators. believe that Kinsley was kept in there. almost constantly for around 5 months. The day after Kinsley died, Mccclure. went with detectives to the police. station for an interview where they say. that she waved her Miranda rightites. And detectives wrote, quote, "Eventually, Tony admitted that she had.

lied to detectives about the version of. events with BW. Tony stated BW was not. involved in any manner and that he had. not been involved with the children for. over one year." Tony stated BW likely. had no knowledge that Kinsley had even. died. The affidavit goes into a lot of. detail about what Mccclure had to say. during that interview, but I want to. highlight some of the most maybe. shocking things revealed during this. conversation. Like quote, "Tony stated. she and Kinsley did not share a. connection or bond. Tony stated she was.

not going to lie. Kinsley told her that. she wanted to die just prior to her. death." And this one is particularly. chilling. Tony explained that she never. looked at Kinsley close enough to see. the bugs on Kinsley. Now, according to. police, Mccclure kept Kinsley locked in. that closet almost all the time. She. said Kinsley would talk to herself in. there and often yelled out that she was. hungry or thirsty. Mccclure even said. during her interview that saying she was. hungry or thirsty was Kinsley's slogan. Mccclure also made it clear in her.

interview with detectives that she. didn't want Kinsley around anymore. Quote, Tony admitted she had given up on. Kinsley. Tony repeated that she had. failed Kinsley. Tony stated she knew. that everything she had done to Kinsley. was wrong. Mccclure also threw her own. mother under the bus. The affidavit. states Tony felt that Tammy shared some. of the responsibility for what happened. to Kinsley because she knew everything, but she never helped or did anything. You know, Andrew, aside from just the. human aspect of this and how horrific it. is for me to read it from a legal point.

of view, after saying all this after. her, you know, Miranda rights were. waved, it's like she's checking every. one of the elements for the charges. here, right? In order what prosecutors. need to prove. >> Yeah, exactly. When you were reading. that, that's exactly what I was doing. And I was thinking, well, they got that, they got that. And then murder's hard to. prove intent uh sometimes. But when she. says, I didn't want her around. Well, that's all the jury needs because even. if a jury thinks, I don't know if they. proved intent, I want her found guilty. of murder. That's the task of the. defense lawyer is to somehow get the.

jury to really focus on the. constitutional principle of proof beyond. a reasonable doubt. And intent can be. very hard to to be proven. She was. feeding her. It just wasn't a lot. She. was giving her water, but it wasn't as. regular. I mean, these are the things. that you're left with as a defense. lawyer, and it really sucks, frankly, to. be in that position. But sometimes. you'll get one juror, just one that'll. say, "I don't know if we proved intent. or maybe more than one, but they really. want to find guilt." Well, then you get. that little nugget there of I I didn't. even want her around anymore. And then,

hey, that's enough for me as a jury. guilty of murder. I mean, I think this. is going to be a very, very tall task. for whoever is handling the defense. It's very very very difficult to say. that after a criminal defendant. allegedly admits to these things after. being read her Miranda rights or after. waving Miranda rightites that that. interview should be thrown out. I mean. what would they have to show that she. completely didn't know what she was. doing or that detectives manipulated her. in some way? I mean that feels like a. tall task right? >> It's a Yeah. don't the only thing that. they could really hope for is in in.

Indiana when you are in a police station. u they it is required under the rules to. videotape that or audio tape it and you. hope that maybe the video or audio tape. just didn't happen because the the. police weren't thinking very clearly or. something because they were so outraged. about what they saw but short of that. this is something we in our office are. challenging all the time trying to. figure out how can we toss out this. confession and I'd say like one out of. maybe a hundred times two out of a. hundred something like that you're. successful. The other times they're. going to find a reason the judge will in.

the court of appeals to keep that. confession intact. >> Now, police say Ryan Smith agreed to. come in on the same day that they. interviewed Mccclure and he also waved. his rights and spoke with detectives. Quote, Ryan stated Tony decided it would. be best to put Kinsley into the closet. because it was safer for everyone else. Ryan stated she started to put Kinsley. into the closet around Thanksgiving of. 2023. Ryan stated that in the last three. to four months, he had only observed. Kinsley out of the closet about 10. times. Ryan stated he did not seek any. medical attention for Kinsley because of.

his love for Tony. Now, both Mccclure. and Smith, they were arrested that day, April 10th, 2024. Investigators. interviewed Kinsley's two brothers, one. who was four, another who was six. They. used various words to describe the. closet that Kinsley was kept in, including time out, the cage, the. corner. The four-year-old told police. Ryan was mad and he smacked Kinsley when. she was on time out in the cage. Bruises. around her right eye and cheekbone were. noted during Kinsley's autopsy. The. six-year-old identified in the affidavit.

as BW said when she was in the closet, Kinsley was given one sandwich a day. Quote, BW stated Kinsley would ask their. mother for a drink, but his mother never. got her a drink. BW explained his mother. did not go to Kinsley when she asked for. her, and if she did, she would tell. Kinsley no when she asked for a drink. BW also said that Kinsley had to stay in. the closet and wasn't allowed to have. food or toys because she was quote bad. Now, the affidavit also indicates that. Kinsley's grandmother, who we've been. talking about, Tammy Hollsley, knew. about what was going on and allegedly.

contributed to that abuse. After Kinsley. died, DCS got a report from the director. of food services at a local school. district. She said that Hollyley had. been a food services manager in an. elementary school and had talked to. employees there about her granddaughter. According to an employee who did an. interview with police, quote, Tammy said. that while Kinsley was staying the night. at her home, in order for Tammy to. sleep, she had to tie the child to the. bed. She did this because Kinsley would. not stay in bed as she wanted to get up. to eat and drink. I mean, if these.

allegations are true, can you blame her? Hley later admitted to officers, according to the affidavit, that she. used duct tape to try to keep Kinsley in. bed, but that the little girl kept. getting out of it, so she finally gave. up. Hollyley also allegedly talked about. a time that they had all gone to a party. at a family member's home. This was just. days before Kinsley died. Quote, Tammy. stated as soon as Tony arrived, she. immediately told Kinsley to go to the. corner because she was in trouble. Tammy. stated Kinsley had to stand up and. remained faced directly into the corner. Tammy stated Kinsley remained like that.

for as long as she was at the party. Now, the next day was the solar eclipse, and Hollyley stated everyone came to her. house to watch it, but that Kinsley was. forced to stand in the corner for hours. again. And just days later, Kinsley. would be dead. In their interviews with. law enforcement, all three defendants, as well as others who had interactions. with the family, like Smith's mom and. cousin and Kinsley, they apparently said. that they knew something was wrong, but. didn't report it to anyone. So, what. charges do the three defendants now. face? Well, Mccclure is charged with.

murder, criminal confinement resulting. in serious bodily injury, and battery on. a person less than 14 years old. The. trial is scheduled for early next year. Smith is charged with three counts of. neglect of a dependent resulting in. death, as well as criminal confinement. resulting in serious bodily injury. He. is currently scheduled to go to trial in. December. And Hollyley is charged with. two counts of neglect of a dependent. resulting in death, two counts of. neglect of a dependent resulting in. serious bodily injury, one count of. neglect of a dependent resulting in. bodily injury, and one count of failure. to report. Her jury trial is also.

scheduled for next month. Andrew, by the. way, why not charge all of them as. codefendants as part of one case? >> Yeah, that's a that's a great question. I wondered that myself. I don't know the. answer to that question. and the Marian. County Prosecutor's Office, which is. Indianapolis, sometimes they they will. put all the codefendants together, and. sometimes they won't. That doesn't mean. that they can't um gather those. defendants all together still in uh one. case at trial. That could happen. They. could still try to to join all those.

parties together, but I don't know if. there's a strategy involved there. I. just it doesn't make sense to me. it. seems like they would all be better. served in in more judicial economy if. you just had them all uh together at. trial and try one case instead of three. >> So obviously this is truly a horrific. case, a horrific tragedy that as we talk. about many times absolutely preventable, right? And to make matters worse, as the. defendants get closer to trial, there.

are claims that the Indiana Department. of Child Services, DCS, essentially. ignored what was happening inside of. that Indianapolis trailer. Why? Because. Brian Welty, Kinsley's paternal. grandfather, has filed a lawsuit in. Marian County Superior Court on November. 6th. and he is suing not only the. defendants and DCS as a whole, he has. also directly named 10 DCS employees who. he claims knew or should have known that. Kinsley was in grave danger. According. to Wealthy, Kinsley was removed from her.

mother's care multiple times early in. her life, sometimes staying with him, sometimes being placed in foster care. And his lawsuit reads, "Yet as a result. of repeated failings by the Indiana. Department of Child Services and its. employees, Kinsley was returned to her. mother's custody multiple times despite. clear evidence that defendant Mccclure. posed an ongoing risk to her safety. After returning Kinsley to her mother. for the final time, DCS and its. employees failed to investigate. subsequent reports of abuse and neglect. until Kinsley's death." Andrew, talk.

about this lawsuit. What sort of. evidence would Wely need to provide to. back up his claims? I mean, DCS reports, witness statements, messages between. case workers, cuz it's not every day you. see a lawsuit like this. >> Yeah, I think you're you're on to. something there with the messages. between the case workers. I think the. reports are important. I think. statistics in this case, they've. mentioned some statistics in the lawsuit. about what the national requirement is,

five to six children that you're taking. care of, I think it was what the number. was per DCS case worker, but they have. as many as 35, like four, five, six. times as many children that they are. watching. So, I'd say getting into the. the minutia of what is going on at the. DCS, how many people are they um do they. have employed and then how many children. are they watching? That's going to be a. part of it. And also, I do agree. communications between case workers, what are they saying, how are they.

trying to cover their butts, that. usually comes back to haunt them in a in. a lawsuit. Back to the lawsuit, it lays. out the reports and apparent lack of. followup that allegedly precipitated. Kinsley's death, naming each of the. family case managers or DCS supervisors. that were purportedly involved. According to the complaint, Kinsley and. two of her siblings, they were brought. to a hospital in August of 2021 for. concerns about abuse and neglect. These. children were reportedly covered in. welts and bruises. They appeared to be.

underfed. They were removed from. Mccclure's custody, but she got them. back a few months later in December, according to the lawsuit. Welty claims. this is because DCS failed to present a. medical witness at a factf finding. hearing November 6, 2023. The lawsuit. claims that DCS got another report that. Kinsley was being abused and neglected. Quote, the report alleged that defendant. Tony Mccclure was not feeding Kinsley, left marks on Kinsley after hitting her. with a belt, and forced Kinsley to stand. facing a wall for hours. Despite this.

longstanding pattern of abuse, defendant. Ayanna Jones closed the foregoing. assessment as unsubstantiated, only two. days later, despite never having made. face-toface contact with Kinsley. And. the grandfather claims that the report. Jones filed had multiple factual errors. in it, including misspellings of both. Kinsley's name and her mother's. It also. claimed that there was no information. about the family's history despite. interactions with DCS that apparently. went back years. And the lawsuit says. defendant Relle Smith approved the.

expedited closure of that November. report as unsubstantiated. The complaint. continues. On December 5th, 2023, DCS. received a second report that Kinsley. was severely underweight, appeared. malnourished, and that defendant. Mccclure was not feeding Kinsley. The. DCS case worker was unable to locate the. family. Defendant Casey Stagal closed. this assessment as unsubstantiated on. December 19th, 2023. Despite never. having made face-to-face contact with. Kinsley, defendant Ryan Pesky approved.

the expedited closure of this assessment. as unsubstantiated. Days later, apparently another report came in about. Kinsley appearing malnourished. And that. report also said that the home didn't. have heat or running water. The lawsuit. claims that the DCS worker was quote. unable to locate the family. And the. assessment, as we've been talking about, was closed and declared unsubstantiated. 2 days after that report was closed, apparently a fourth came in indicating. that Kinsley wasn't allowed to eat and.

her hair was falling out. Quote, "Despite this pattern of grave. allegations and mother's substantiated. prior history of neglect, defendant. Daria Jackson claimed she was unable to. locate the family, did no investigation, and closed this assessment as. unsubstantiated on January 8th, 2024, despite never having made face-to-face. contact with Kinsley." Defendant Tammy. DS approved the expedited closure of. this assessment as unsubstantiated. January 11th, 2024. That marked the. fifth report about Kinsley, according to.

this lawsuit, with the person saying. that the little girl was treated. differently than Mccclure's other. children. That report also alleged that. Smith and Holly knew about or. participated in the alleged abuse. The. lawsuit says, quote, "Defendant Crevelin. Abara did no investigation, made zero. effort to force defendant Mccclure to. allow personal observation of Kinsley, and closed the assessment as. unsubstantiated on January 24th, 2024, despite never having made face-to-face. contact with Kinsley." Defendant Ashley.

Coffer approved the expedited closure of. this assessment as unsubstantiated. Quote, "Upon information and belief, approximately 1 month before Kinsley's. death, DCS employees saw Kinsley in the. home and took photographs of her, but. did not act to remove her from the. defendant Mccclure's care despite her. emaciated appearance." And this lawsuit. also addresses the workload of Indiana. DCS. According to the suit, the Child. Welfare League of America recommends. between 12 and 15 children per case. worker, but Indiana's current case load.

that far exceeds that. According to the. lawsuit, the lawsuit states, quote, DCS. case workers report having case loads as. high as 35 individual cases for years at. a time. Upon information and belief, one. method DCS has employed to reduce case. load burdens is the implementation of. internal policy directing case workers. to refer 50% of their cases to the safe. assessment closure team for expedited. closure. But instead of fast-tracking. low priority cases as intended, DCS is. using Safe Act to quickly reduce case.

load numbers despite serious safety. concerns. Three reports of Kinsley's. abuse were closed in an expedited. fashion pursuant to DCS's safe act. policy. So, this lawsuit lists six legal. claims here against the DCS and its case. workers, wealthy claims, negligence, as. well as a survival claim. He also claims. that the DCS defendants deprive Kinsley. of her civil rights. And against the. three defendants, Tony Mccclure, Ryan. Smith, Tammy Hollsley, he claims.

negligence and intentional infliction of. emotional distress. Count five is a. claim of battery allegedly committed by. Kinsley's mother, Tony Mccclure. Welty. is demanding a jury trial to determine. damages that Kinsley's estate should. receive. And during a news conference. announcing the lawsuit, according to. reporting from WIBC, Brian Welty said, "When they told me she was gone, I felt. like my soul left my body. No child. should ever die that way. No one should. ever have to bury a 5-year-old because. people didn't do their jobs." DCS keeps.

talking about reunification, about. getting kids back with their parents. That's fine when the parents are safe, but when they're not, that policy kills. kids. It killed my granddaughter. And. WIBC reported that a DCCS spokesperson. declined to comment on the lawsuit, but. said that the agency takes child safety. very seriously and fully cooperates with. criminal investigations. Andrew, what is. your reaction to these claims? I mean, what stands out to you when you look at. these causes of action?

>> I think uh I think what stands out is. just the the legal phrasiology that I. think is important in this case is. deliberate indifference. That is the. phrase that they the the plaintiff, the. grandfather is going to have to prove. that the DCS acted deliberately and. differently. And that's just one of. those words and phrases that really we. don't really know what it means. necessarily, but some of the facts are, for example, they they couldn't even get. the girl's spelling of her name.

correctly. Okay? And that may seem like. a small thing, but that's just like it's. so bad. This girl has died and now they. can't even get the name straight. It. seems as at least the allegation is that. some of the case workers just flat out. lied. They didn't go to see the child, but they said that they did. There's. also a bad allegation that one of the. case workers went and saw the little. girl about 30 days before she died. She. would obviously have she's in this cage, this closet. She's emaciated. She's got. feces all over her. And they just wrote.

off, "Hey, it's it's unsubstantiated. She's doing fine enough. We're done with. that. We're going to move on." And they. had this the thing is the grandfather. that is suing he the grandfather had a. great relationship with this little. girl. He he had the care custody and. control of that girl for two or three. years and had developed a bond with her. and he was a great viable option. That. girl would be alive. she would be alive. had the DCS employees done their jobs is. the allegation and is if if they are.

true and simply had taken the little. girl to her grandfather's house where. there apparently was love and in a in a. good household and uh all those things. are going to uh it's a compelling. compelling lawsuit. It is hard. There's. I'm not I'm a criminal defense lawyer. I'm not a civil lawyer, but I know. there's all types of defenses and and. things that immunities and so forth. I. don't know what they need to overcome. those, but boy, these these this type of. fact pattern could get you there. >> Yeah. No, you highlight a very very. important point here. Yeah, we could.

talk about the law. We can talk about. innocent until proven guilty. We could. talk about yes, you have to prove. liability here, and we can get into the. law back and forth and all that, but the. main underlying theme we talk about in a. lot of these cases, particularly when we. focus upon child protective services, you know, DCF, things of that nature, is. was this preventable? Was there another. option? Could someone else have taken. care of the child if they were given. that chance? I can't tell you how many. stories I cover where family members. say, "I would have taken him. I would. have taken her. I would have taken.

them." And that is just the absolute. tragedy because putting aside the. criminal liability, civil liability, this shouldn't have happened. This child. should still be alive. And I I think. that's a really important point that you. highlight. Andrew Baldwin, thank you so. much for taking the time. Really really. appreciate it. Thank you. >> Thank you, Jesse. >> And that's all we have for you right now. here on Sidebar. Everybody, thank you so. much for joining us. And as always, please subscribe on YouTube, Apple. Podcast, Spotify, wherever you at your.

podcast. [music] You can follow me on X. or Instagram. I'm Jesse Weber. I'll. speak to you next time.