Lawsuit Mentions Ruby Franke's Friend and Role in ConneXions

If you're interested in Pam Botcher, that's going to tie Pam Botcher to all. of this. What's in those documents? When. now convicted child abusers Ruby Frankie. and Jodie Hildebrandt were arrested in. Utah in 2023, their so-called mental. wellness and life coaching business, Connections, was thrust onto the. national stage. The two women would. eventually be sentenced to spend years. behind bars for starving and inflicting. physical and psychological wounds on. Ruby's two youngest children. And all. the while they were giving parenting.

advice on Connections podcasts and. social media pages. But they weren't the. only two involved in this controversial. organization. You may remember another. name from this story, Pam Botcher. We're. digging into who she is, her connection. to Ruby and Jod, and the accusation. she's now facing from an alleged former. member of Connections who's blowing the. whistle on what he calls a cult. Welcome. to Sidebar, presented by Law and Crime. I'm Jesse Weber. Pam Botcher has been at the fringes of.

Ruby Frankie and Jodie Hildebrand's. story, and her name has definitely come. up here and there, and she's definitely. played some sort of role in this whole. saga. So, what we want to do is put her. a little bit more into the spotlight, take a closer look at her apparent. involvement. So, who is she? Well, Pam. Botcher is reportedly one of the. higherups in a counseling group called. Connections, which is also known as. Connections Classroom. This was started. by Jodie Hildebrandt in 2012 as an. onlinebased program offering workshops,

group counseling sessions, leadership. training, and more. Pam was at one time. listed as the president of Connections. Foundation. Now, only parts of the. connectionclassroom.com website are. still active. It seems that its homepage. now diverts to this ad for slot machines. in Thailand. That's at least what we. found. But previously it said the. purpose of connections was quote to. invite and encourage healing and. facilitate personal growth through. impeccable honesty, rigorous personal. responsibility, and vulnerable humility.

But many have now come out to say not. only was it all just a money-making. scheme, but that Jodie used the company. to ruin dozens of relationships. That is. the allegation she's facing. And. according to her bio on the connections. website, Pam Botcher has a degree in. interpersonal communications, is a. mother of seven, and grandmother of 14. And it's important to note as we make. our way through this saga, and want to. be very, very clear about this. Pam. Botcher has never been criminally.

charged with anything in connection with. the Ruby Frankie or Jodie Hildebrand. case. Want to make that very, very. clear. Here's the thing. We first heard. about Pam Botcher after Ruby and Jod. were arrested at Jod's huge house or. compound in Ivans, Utah. And to give you. a little bit of a backstory to catch you. up here, Ruby Frankie was this mommy. vlogger who at one point had amassed. more than 2 million followers on her. YouTube channel called Eight Passengers. She was arrested with her business. partner Jodie Hildebrandt on six charges.

of aggravated child abuse. The women. kept Ruby's two young children, then 12. and 10, separated from the rest of the. family, and abused them really badly, physically, emotionally, mentally. We've. heard about duct tape found wrapped. around the boy's ankles and wrists, both. children being forced to stand in the. hot sun for hours, being forced to jump. into a cactus. That was one of the. revelations that came out during the. course of this case. And according to. her own journals, Ruby believed the two. children were evil, that they were. possessed by demons. And according to.

Jod, the only way to save them was to. essentially hurt them. And the two women. both later took deals. They plead guilty. to four of the six counts of child. abuse. And they are going to be spending. potentially up to 30 years in prison. It'll be up to the parole board to. decide when they actually get out. But. here's the thing. If the two youngest. kids were at Jod's compound in southern. Utah, where were Ruby's other children? Right. Well, the two oldest, Sher and. Chad, they were both over 18 years old.

They were out on their own. Kevin. Frankie, the children's father, the. aranged husband of Ruby Frankie, had. been essentially excommunicated from the. family, told that he couldn't talk to. any of them or see them for at least a. year. We'll get more into that in a. minute, but according to Sherry, her. younger siblings were often left on. their own in the family's Springville. home. Sherry had even called the. Department of Children and Family. Services to check on them, but. apparently when social workers arrived, they said the children inside refused to. answer the door. By the way, as you. know, we are constantly in the breaking. news business. We have to stay up to.

speed. We have to stay alert on what is. happening in these everchanging stories. So, not a shocker. I got to drink coffee. at times, but I will tell you, I'm very. particular in what I like and what I put. into my body, which is why I'm so happy. that we have partnered with Trade. Coffee. This is a great sponsor. So, I. took their quiz and in under a minute, they matched me with my perfect coffee. See, the way it works is trade sources. from top independent coffee roasters. across the United States and then they. match me to the coffees I love most. based on my taste preferences. And that. includes Alma. Never had it before, but. it has that medium roast, which I love.

I'm always looking for. Sometimes not so. easy to find. It was fresh. It was ready. to go. And get this, right now, Trade is. exclusively offering our viewers 40% off. of their first order at. drinktrade.com/ssidebar. That's. drinktrade. tr.com/sidebar for 40% off your first. order. Now, on the day that Ruby and Jod. were arrested, police were trying to. find the two teenaged middleaughters. and investigators in Ivans called. authorities in other parts of Utah to.

try to find them. Police end up. searching the Springville home. No one's. there, but eventually police got word. that the girls might be with Pam Botcher. at her home in American Fork. And that. is when officers had their first. interactions with Pam and her husband. Roy. How's it going? Good. I'm Officer. Hawkins, sir. I'm looking for Pam. Is. Pam incident? Yeah, it's my wife. Is. your wife? She's here. Hi. Hello, Pam. How are you doing? Good. I'm Officer Hawkins, American Fork.

Police Department. Hi. So, we had a uh. agency assist out of St. George and. Springville that we're just looking for. is. Okay. When you picked her up, what was. the uh what was the case? Did somebody. ask you to pick her up or did you just. pick her up? What was going on? Well, I'm having guests coming and she came. and did some cleaning for me. Did some. cleaning for you? Um, you right now in the house living.

room here. Okay, great. We're going to. have both of you come out here then. If. you can just for a second, we just have. to go over some stuff. Um, you have a. warrant? Yeah, we do. Let me see it, please. So, it's in my car. But right. now, my concern is Will you just tell. them you're all right? Well, we have to. physically see her. under the doorway. We'll go ahead and get the copy of the. warrant for you. Okay. You have a. warrant for my house. Specifically for. you. Yeah. For you and the child. Yeah.

Okay. So, what is going on? As of right. now, I'll just need you to give your. phone to your husband. Okay. Okay. And. as of this moment, you're going to be. detained right now. Okay. Okay. Okay. So, is there is there anything on you? Uh, no. Okay, perfect. Just put your. hands in front of you. Okay. Just going. to place you temporarily under my. arrest. I'll explain to you that I'll explain to. What are you guys doing? I've explained. this already. I'm being as curious as I. can. Okay. Okay. Well, I'm going to call. an attorney. That's fine. I don't know.

what's Yeah. I don't even know what this. is all about. Okay. So, I'm going to. explain to you when we get to the car. Yes. I just explained to you that you're. being detained right now. Now, the. officers on the scene aren't sure. exactly what fellow law enforcement. found at the compound, but they know. it's bad. For example, at this point, officers at the scene are not quite able. to get into a large safe in Jod's. basement, and there were fears that. there could be a child locked inside. Now, fortunately, that turned out not to. be the case. But during the conversation. with Pam, he learned new information.

about Pam's seeming connection to Ruby. Those are my friends daughters. Okay. So, your friend's daughters then? Yeah. Okay. Yeah. Is Ruby Frankie's daughter? Okay. She's she's a friend of ours. She comes. over and helps me every once in a while. to do cleaning and stuff. Okay. So, this. is what happened. Okay. Her parents were in the situation.

of a child abuse allegation. Okay. DCFS. made the report and went to the house. and found children malnourished and. locked in a safe. Okay. In a safe. In a. safe. Okay. So now those officers from. DCFS have to cussy those children and. we're looking for this one. The rec. center when they went to go find her. said that you picked her up. Yeah. So. now they are trying to figure out why.

you picked her up. What you know with. her? Is she okay? Is is she did she come. here willingly? All that kind of stuff. Okay. As soon as they come here Yeah. we'll be on our way. Okay. Okay. That's. why I said you're just detained. You're. not placed under arrest just right now. until they figure out what's going on. with their part. And during his. conversation with Botcher, the officer. learns that actually both girls are at. her home, not just the one she picked up. at the rec center. Then you go over back. to the front porch where Botcher's.

husband Roy and one of the girls are. still on the doorway. And he tries to. contact Ruby. Gets no answer because by. this time she's in police custody. Girls, I have no clue what's going on. and I don't know what's going to. happen. So, just the worst thing we can. do is try to fight. it. So, we got to just go with it, whatever, and then sort it out. I don't. know how that's going to. happen. So, we'll see. And the. investigators also question Botcher.

about connections and how she knew Ruby, but interestingly, they never really. bring up Jod. How did you start to know. the family? the Frankie family. Yeah. Through a a. program called Connections. Okay. It's. a kind of a life skills. Yeah. Type. thing. Okay. So, tell me more about like. when you first met them through the. program or not really know what what the. program is. She's just she was just she.

was a coach. She was a Okay. What type. of things did they do with the program? Um it's like life skills. like um learning how to you know it's. like be honest, responsible and humble. Those are those three pillars of their. of their program. Um is there like a meeting place for you. or is it kind of a place? It's online every Saturday morning. It's.

called Empowering Joy. Okay. How long have you known them for? Oh jeez. Probably. Oh gee. I don't know. Let's. see. I mean, I didn't know her really. well cuz she was in the program, but I. didn't really know her, but I've known. her probably really well. Maybe 3 years. Is this like a program that she started. or is it just one that she and she's. just a part of it? She's just part of.

it. So, according to Utah's KTVU, the. Department of Children and Families told. the teens that they could either stay. with their sister or be placed with a. foster family. And the girls reportedly. didn't want to leave the Botcher home, but eventually agreed to stay with their. sister, Sherry. Now, police ended up. interviewing the children's father, Kevin, to find out about connections and. Jod and how it all connects back to his. family. And what Kevin had to say sounds. almost in a way too fantastical to.

believe. But according to Kevin, Jod. told Ruby she was being haunted by. demons. So Ruby decided to move Jod into. their home, apparently kicking her. oldest child, Sherry, out of the bedroom. so she could watch over Jod during these. episodes. And again, Botcher is brought. up once more. Then she started having. like trances and stuff. I would say. probably September where she believed. that she was going to heaven and and. seeing God and Jesus and and talking.

with. them and she would get together with Pam. Botcher. Ruby, Pam, and Jod would get. together and do these. interventions. That's what they called. them. And so they'd just go up and lock. themselves in a room for four or five. hours and then they'd come out and and. they'd all just be on cloud nine and and. and Ruby would share with me like she. had this amazing vision and and I wrote.

it and recorded it all down and and we. have a work to do from God and and and. you're part of it and and the bishop's. part of it and we're all part of. bringing all this stuff to the world. Kevin claims that Ruby had fallen. completely under Jod's spell and even. wanted to give up their wildly. successful business and YouTube channel. so she could work with Jod at. Connections. And once again, Botcher is.

brought up once more. Ruby, Pam, and Jod. were. completely determined to do this work. that they felt God had for. them. And. um I thought it was crazy. Like I. thought it was just crazy. Like Ruby, you have a reputation. You have a. multi-million dollar business. You have. a brand. And you were just giving it. away. She wanted to legally like work.

with Jod's attorney to. basically give. Jod eight. passengers and. um and become an employee of. connections. So basically the contract. was Ruby gives Jod everything and Ruby. gets nothing in return. our manager, um, our YouTube manager at. the time was like, um, red flags, red.

flags. Like, I don't know how to tell. you. She is scamming you. Ruby fired. him. And I was like, I believe our. manager. I think he's right. And Ruby. started threatening me with another. separation. And just like, this isn't. about money. This is about doing God's. work. And so we continued in that dynamic for. the next 6 or 7 months.

until she went on a trip with Jodie and. Pam down to. Arizona. And I think they like when I. read her journal that she went into. Mexico or something and bought drugs or. something like prescription drugs for. the emergency kits. Now, Sherry also. talks about these trips to Mexico and. Pam in her new memoir, The House of My. Mother, A Daughter's Quest for Freedom.

In fact, one passage reads, "Pam, Jod's. oldest and dearest friend, high up in. connections, was always popping by with. a case of soda and a high-pitched hello. that set my teeth on edge. The three of. them, Ruby, Jod, and Pam, would hole up. in my old bedroom for hours on end. They. went boating in Lake Havsu in Arizona. for a week and would make little. shopping trips down to Mexico, coming. back with grocery bags full of pills. When I asked about it, Ruby claimed it. was all part of their grand plan to. stockpile antibiotics for the end of. days. It was as if they'd formed their.

own exclusive apocalypse collective, and. the rest of us were decidedly not on the. list. Sherry also wrote, referring to. Ruby, Jodie and Pam had become her ride. or dies, her squad, her soul sisters. They were the three musketeers of the. apocalypse, ready to follow each other, literally to the ends of the earth, or. at least to the nearest Mexican pharmacy. for another antibiotics run. So, Pam. appears to be, by all accounts, definitely friends, with Jodie and Ruby. But I want to delve a little bit further.

into her alleged involvement in. connections as a business. So, we. learned a lot of the specific. allegations against Pam in a massive. civil lawsuit filed in federal court in. Utah that essentially accuses Jod of. running a criminal enterprise, racketeering, tricking people out of. their money while also wreaking havoc on. their families. That's the central. allegation. Now, Michael Tilman, we. first told you about Michael Tilman's. civil action in January. The 150page. lawsuit names Ruby Frankie and Jodie.

Hildebrandt as defendants along with the. Life Coaching Business Connections. Classroom LLC. And the lawsuit also. names Tilman's ex-wife, who's apparently. also named Michael with the last name. Savage. He's seeking at least $5 million. in damages, claiming the defendants were. and still are essentially running a. racketeering enterprise through. connections. Now, we've broken down. different parts of the lawsuit in. separate episodes, including an. overarching review of the lawsuit, as. well as the supposed misconduct. committed by Jod on behalf of the.

alleged criminal enterprise. You can. check out those full breakdowns over at. the Long Crime YouTube channel. But. today, I want to look specifically at. the parts of the lawsuit that mention. Pam Botcher. Now, to be clear, she is. not named as a defendant, but Tilman. basically considers her a co-conspirator. in the overall scheme. The lawsuit. reads, "Botcher has attempted to conceal. her involvement in the enterprise, but. she is in fact integral to it. Since. Hilda Branson Frankie's arrest, guilty, p, and sentencing, Botcher's central. role in the enterprise has come to. light. Botcher has been involved in the.

enterprise in the following ways.". Quote, "Until the Connections website. was deactivated, Botcher was identified. as the president of Connections. Foundation on the Connections business. team page and has been identified as. such since at least August 2020, one of. the earliest iterations of the page. Upon information and belief, Jesse. Hildebrandt told the media that Botcher. was deeply involved with Hildebrandt's. behavior, including that she was quote. one of the people that was constantly. surveilling the surveillance of. reporting back to Jod. That Botcher was.

quote always at Hildebrandt's house. And. that Botcher was quote Jod's best. friend. By the way, Jesse Hildebrandt is. Jod Hildebrandt's niece. We've spoken. with Jesse before here on Sidebar. Really, really compelling interviews. They tell us that their parents left her. with Jod as a teenager because of. supposed behavioral problems. And Jesse. says they were basically tortured by Jod. until they were finally able to escape. But when you go back to the lawsuit that. Michael Tilman filed, he claims, quote, Botcher's close relationship with.

Frankie within the Enterprise is. demonstrated by Botcher visiting the. Ivan's residence during the time that. Frankie and Hildebrand were actively. torturing victims one and two on the. premises. That is the first time that we. can tell that someone has claimed that. Pam Botcher visited the Ivan's compound. when this abuse was going on. So then. the questions become if that is true, could she have known? I mean, she was. reportedly best friends with Jod and. Ruby and an apparent follower of Jod's. extreme beliefs, would they have shared.

what they were doing? It's a fair. question considering these allegations. Also, I will tell you, I think it's. interesting that she's not named as a. defendant in this lawsuit. Perhaps Mr. Tilman wants to file this lawsuit, have. her as a witness, you know, a. cooperating witness in this case against. the others. Maybe something to think. about. Not entirely sure. But I will. tell you this, the lawsuit also talks. about Pam and her husband Royy's. interactions with police on the day Ruby. was arrested, which we talked about. before. Quote, "Upon information and.

belief, when law enforcement came to. Botcher's residence, and inquired about. Jay and A, meaning the daughters of Ruby. Frankie, Botcher's husband did not want. to allow law enforcement to see the. children, and instead wanted to have Jay. andor A tell officers from behind a door. that they were okay, indicating Botcher. and her husband did not want law. enforcement to observe the children. while Botcher and her husband were. forcing them to work at Botcher's. residence." Now, let me just be clear. about something. That's a allegation. That's a narrative you could put. forward. The other way, you know, of. looking at this could be police show up,

they don't know what's going on. They're. looking after another person's children, and maybe they didn't feel comfortable. just turning them over to the police. That was something that came out during. the course of that body cam footage. So, two different perspectives on what we. can make from that body cam footage. But. the lawsuit continues, quote, the media. reported that Kevin Frankie's attorney. stated that Botcher frequently attended. connections trips with Hild Debrandt and. Frankie. As explained above, Botcher. also actively furthered the enterprise. by teaching Connections classes via. Interstate Wires and at Connections.

conferences and by laundering money for. Hild Debrandt and the Enterprise through. the Connections Foundation and Botcher's. personal accounts. Just to be clear, Pam. has never been charged with any sort of. crime in connection to this case. But. look, her proximity to this case has led. to a lot of whispers, a lot of. speculation about whether or not Pam. Botcher should be held accountable for. something here. Time will tell if she. continues to be swept up in this, but. again, allegations in this lawsuit. She.

hasn't been criminally charged, but. hopefully this provides a little bit of. a better explanation about her apparent. connection to everybody else in this. case. That is all we have for you right. now here on Sidebar. Everybody, thank. you so much for joining us and as. always, please subscribe on YouTube, Apple Podcast, Spotify, wherever you. should get your podcasts. I'm Jesse. Weber. I'll speak to you next time. [Music].