Bodybuilder Butchered by 'Possessive' Wife in Frenzied Knife Attack: Cops

a bodybuilder who was known for his. hulking muscles, his training regimen, his caring spirit, somebody who was. loved. He was stabbed over and over and. over again. And apparently this attack. started while he was sleeping. And. despite his efforts to crawl away from. the frenzied attack, he was found dead. Police say it was his own wife who was. the one holding the knife. And as new. details come out about possible motives. and what she was allegedly doing. beforehand, we try to make sense of this.

entire situation with forensic. psychiatrist Dr. Daniel Boowber. Welcome. to Sidebar, presented by Law and Crime. I'm Jesse Weber. [Music]. 41-year-old Walter Devarito was a. champion bodybuilder from the city of. Chapekco in Brazil. According to. reporting from Universal online and the. New York Post, he represented his. country in bodybuilding competitions. around the world. world. He was a. fivetime state champion. He was even at. one time a World Fitness Federation. runner up. He worked as a personal.

trainer. He shared his workout routines. online and in person. But everything. came crashing down in early September. because that is when Brazilian police. say Valter was stabbed nearly two dozen. times. And the attack started while he. was in bed asleep. During a news. conference, police released new details. about the suspect. that suspect, Valter's wife, Andrea Carvajalo Ita, and. you will not believe what she is accused. of doing in the leadup to Walter's. death. So, the two apparently got.

married in 2021. This is according to. Universal Online, but they apparently. had a rough, tumultuous relationship. Santa Katarina civil police say that. Carvajaloa was convinced that Valter was. having an affair, although it's unclear. if he actually had been unfaithful in. the relationship or she just suspected. this. However, a friend of Walters. identified as Camille told outlet ND. Mais that she was surprised when the. news came out about Valter's death. Not. only because of the heinous crime, but. because he had apparently said he was.

single. Now, police say that on. September 7th, Valter was sleeping. inside that apartment that he shared. with his wife when she allegedly started. stabbing him repeatedly with a large. knife. According to the New York Post. and Globo, during their news conference, police revealed that neighbors had heard. cries for help with one person claiming. they heard him yell, "My God, why are. you doing this?" This is per reporting. from NDA. Now, Universal Online reports. that at least one neighbor had claimed. that she saw Valter stumbling out of his.

unit into the hallway, apparently naked. and bloody, and saw this through a. peepphole. According to the New York. Post and and Disease, investigators say. that Valter was stabbed 21 times that he. had apparent injuries to his face, his. head, his neck, arms, legs, chest, abdomen. When he got out of bed to try. to get away, the New York Post has. reported that police believe his wife. followed him, continuing to strike him. with a massive trail of blood leading. out into the hall. Valter was found dead. in a stairwell near the entrance to the. building. This is according to multiple.

Brazilian news outlets. Now, as for his. wife, Carvajoa, she was taken to a. hospital for her own injury, some cuts. on her fingers, head, left arm. This is. according to the Court of Justice of. Santa Katarina. And when she was. released is when she was arrested. Just. a brutal situation. So, I want to get. insight into this and I want to welcome. back on to the program uh forensic. psychiatrist Dr. Daniel Bober. Dr. Bober, thanks so much for coming on. Really appreciate it. Uh we're going to. get into some of the details of what. she's accused of doing, but the the if.

she if she really did do this or just. generally speaking, the brutal nature of. this attack, what does that tell you. psychologically about what might be. going on here? >> Well, it's a familiar story, Jesse. Uh. we think about things like OJ Simpson, Jod Arius, we have a familiar cycle, right? suspicion and insecurity which. leads to this obsessive surveillance and. control and then finally threats uh and. intimidation. If I ever see you with.

anyone, if you ever betray me, escalation, planning, obtaining a. weapon, preoccupation, and then finally. lethal violence. So, this is a very. unfortunately common story in society. that we see of pathological jealousy. Now, you brought up an interesting. point, which is did he actually commit. infidelity? Well, it turns out that's. not critical for the diagnosis. Usually. the diagnosis is associated with a. delusional disorder. But anytime the. focus is irrational, excessive, disproportionate, extreme, uh it moves.

over from jealousy, which is an. appropriate reaction. If you believe. your partner is committing infidelity, then it becomes pathological. It's. irrational. It's excessive. It's. disproportionate and results in extreme. behavior as in this case. >> That's interesting if you're talking. about what she believed. So, assuming. she did this, if you had the opportunity. to interview her, what kind of questions. would you ask? What would you want to. know from her? >> I would want to know, one, does she have. a history of mental illness? I would. want to know, is she using substances? I.

would want to know what her evidence is. for why he's been been unfaithful. I. would want to challenge her. I'd want to. see if there was an alternative. explanation that she would be willing to. entertain. Those are some of the things. I would talk to her about. By the way, I. don't think I've asked you this before, but your role, let's say a criminal. investigation, have you ever seen a. situation where somebody may not open up. or confess to authorities, but during. the course of an interview, they may. admit to the crime?

>> Yeah. And I think that goes just back to. not necessarily your qualifications, whether you're a psychiatrist or a. police officer. A lot of times that has. to do with building rapport, trust, making them feel like they're being. validated. I think they're much more. likely to open up to you in those. circumstances. >> Let me talk about the evidence in this. case so far. So, I want to talk about. some of the digital evidence that the. civil police uncovered. Um, according to. Universal online, investigators. apparently found messages between the.

couple in which this wife had threatened. to kill her husband, even including. knife emojis in some of the texts. MD. Mice reports that there were also audio. recordings where she reportedly said. that Valter would quote pay for what he. was doing to her. She had also allegedly. sent photos of Valter of him sleeping, so reinforcing that he was constantly. being watched. Civil police also alleged. that she had drilled holes in the walls. of the apartment to watch him to see. what he was up to. Dr. Bober, if that is.

true, and we talk about escalating. behavior that you know allegedly ended. with this brutal attack. What does that. tell you? So again, we have obsessive. surveillance and rumination. We have. possessiveness and fear of abandonment, which is often a sign of deep-seated. insecurity. And very often, the more. intense the attachment, the more. aggressive the reaction. So in these. types of relationships and we've heard.

about them probably even through friends. of ours that are very intense. They. often tend to be very unstable and those. are the ones that have the unfortunate. tendency to result in violence. So we. have this threat control cycle where it. starts off with anxiety, these betrayal. fantasies and then finally it goes from. anxiety and insecurity to threats of. punishment. And you have these. prehomocidal warning signs like the. letter that he wrote that said, "If. anything were to happen to me, this is. the person who did it." By the way, you.

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By the way, she also allegedly. communicated with some sort of. artificial intelligence, some AI. relaying the problems with her marriage. to some sort of chatbot. So, Basia. Noticius reports that message logs. obtained by police show her talking to. this bot about her symptoms of. depression and feelings of frustration. and suspicions that her husband was. cheating on her. You know, Dr. Bober, we've talked before uh here on Sidebar.

about AI and how people feel comfortable. to ask this chatbot questions and relay. personal information almost like it's a. friend. Are you surprised to hear this? I'm not in this day and age. And it's. very concerning to me. I keep telling. people all the time, AI is not your. friend. AI is not your therapist. AI. doesn't act with intention because AI is. simply a language prediction model. It. is designed for reinforcement, social. engagement, and to keep the conversation. going. So, if you're relying on AI for.

advice, you're making a huge mistake. And it's obviously can be incriminating. evidence, right? I think that's coming. up more and more that what you put in. there, it's similar to Google searches. that can come back in a criminal case. and really hurt someone. Now, despite. Valter's extensive injuries, the civil. police said that this woman admitted to. stabbing him. However, she says it was. only three times. This is according to. the New York Post. She claims she was. acting in self-defense. She claims that.

he had the knife first, but she was able. to get it away from him. I will tell you. authorities weren't buying it. And let. me ask you, Dr. Bober, about that. self-defense cases, domestic violence. cases, wouldn't be the first time that. we've seen those. What would you be. looking out for to see if this was or. was not a legitimate case of. self-defense? Well, listen, I don't buy it either. Uh, you have to look at the physical. evidence. You have to look at the fact. that there seemed to be a leadup to all. this, a crescendo, if you will, and that.

doesn't necessarily prove it. definitively. But again, at least in the. United States, we're talking about. beyond a reasonable doubt. So certainly. a defense team would try to present an. alternative theory. But given the. obsessiveness, drilling holes in the. wall and watching him sending the text. messages with the knife emojis, all this. uh would be highly highly difficult to. overcome. I want to talk about that. letter uh that you mentioned before. because it seems that Walter was aware. that his wife could cause him great. harm. The Post reported that he told her. he planned to write a letter explaining.

that if he were to be found dead, it was. his wife who did it. I will say. apparently police couldn't find any such. letter. But if that's true and you're. talking about somebody who has a. recognition of what would happen to. them, what does that tell you? And B, not I'm not placing any blame. I'm not. placing any blame. But is it difficult. for someone to separate themselves from. a relationship like that, particularly. if they're married, right? I mean, what. does that tell you? that this was a very intense unstable.

relationship. Uh now what were the reasons that were. motivating her? Was she someone who had. a legitimate mental illness, for. example, psychosis? Was she someone who. had paranoid traits where she was. suspicious and hostile? Is this behavior. that she displayed in other. relationships prior to this one? This is. something I would want to look into. talking to other people that knew her. before. Or what we call borderline. traits. Again, emotional instability, fear of abandonment, the so-called black. and white thinking, acting impulsively,

going from idealization to devaluation. These are all what we call borderline. traits, and they tend to be very. intense, unstable, labile type. relationships. Is there any way to. reason with somebody like this? Again, assuming all this is true, if you're in. a position where your counterpart is. this woman, um, how do you reason with. somebody like that? I I mean I think it's someone who needs. professional help, but there are types. of therapy. For example, if it's. borderline personality disorder called.

dialectical behavioral therapy or DBT. that can help with someone like this, obviously medication, but it's probably. something that she came into the. relationship with and her partner may. not have known how to deal with it. She. could have gotten professional help, but. unfortunately it didn't happen. Now, I. will say in a shocking twist, okay, this. apparently is not the first time that. this woman, Andrea Carvajaloa, has been. accused of a very serious crime. Local. reporting says she was actually.

convicted of attempted robbery with. violence and was given an 18-year prison. sentence. She apparently appealed that. conviction. It was upheld in 2023. The. prison length was reduced though to 15. years. But by the time the appeals. process wrapped up, authorities couldn't. find her. She had an active arrest. warrant when she was taken into custody. for Valter's murder. And according to. NDA, if she is convicted, she now faces. 12 to 30 years in prison. And it seems. on top of the 15 that she was supposed.

to be serving for the robbery. conviction. That adds a whole other. layer there, Dr. Bober, doesn't it? >> It does. you know that now we're talking. about someone who slipped through the. cracks of law enforcement and that. brings as you said a whole other element. to it. Is this someone with antisocial. traits, someone who routinely violates. the rights of others? Who manipulates. people? Who acts without remorse? Who's. cold? Who's cunning? Who's methodical? So, it does add a new element into it. Now, Valter's mother spoke with Andy Mis.

saying that this woman Carvajaloa. had said she had to marry her son. she. had to marry Valter and threatened to. kill him. She remembered her son as a. caring man, saying, quote, "We set up a. gym at home so he could work and devote. himself to bodybuilding. He was a. simple, kindhearted boy." Doctor, it's. never lost on us the family and the. friends that are left behind after an. alleged murder, right? What does that. family, what does this mother, what does. loss look like for them and what's their.

journey going to be? Well, I think it's not only loss, but. it's loss in this horrific way. And it's. something that they will have to live. with uh for the rest of their lives. And. I've said it before, you know, grief is. a process. Loss is a process. It's not. something that you ever forget. It's. something that you learn to live with. And it, you know, it becomes a new. normal for the family. And hopefully. there are other things in their lives. where they can find joy in because this. is obviously horrific. this legal. process that unfolds, does it only.

complicate it for them? Does it only. make it worse? Does it amplify these. feelings? >> You know, you hear this from the. families of victims all the time, right? Leading up to a trial, which sometime. can take years. They never find peace. until there's justice, until everything. is resolved. They have a lot of trouble. moving on with their lives. And as I. said before, it never really goes back. to the way it was. But it's certainly. easier when this process is no longer. playing out. By the way, I I'm not. entirely familiar with the law in Brazil.

regarding um a mental health defense, but assuming this happened in the. States, based on this limited set of. facts that we have laid out, the. allegations that we have laid out, is. there a potential mental health defense. that you would be looking out for here? You know, I guess, you know, a defense. attorney might turn to an expert like me. and try to say that she had some kind of. extreme emotional reaction, but the. problem for them is going to be all the. leadup that occurred to this. The text.

messages, the threats, the surveillance. It all makes it seem pretty pre-planned, pretty premeditated. One of the things. they could say is that she was suffering. from some form of psychosis and she was. delusional and she had false beliefs, but it's going to be a very uphill climb. for a defense strategy uh using an. insanity defense. >> I agree. Dr. Daniel Bober, thanks so. much for taking the time. >> Thanks, Jesse. And that's all we have. for you right now here on Sidebar. Everybody, thank you so much for joining. us. And as always, please subscribe on.

YouTube, Apple Podcast, Spotify, wherever you should get your podcasts. You can follow me on X or Instagram. I'm. Jesse Weber. I'll see you next time. [Music].