7 New Shocking Details in Nvidia Affair Scandal

Embattled Tech CEO Jensen Wong, the man. at the center of an alleged Chinese spy. affair with huge national security. implications, has just resigned from. Nvidia. [music] And this is on the heels. of reports he has had multiple affairs. This is a big deal. And we [music] ask, as the FBI is reportedly looking into. this, why exactly did Jensen Wong decide. to leave [music] the company? Right now, we're bringing on national security. expert and former [music] FBI agent and. CIA officer Tracy Walder. Welcome to.

Sidebar, presented by Law and Crime. I'm. Jesse Weber. Well, after news of this alleged. honeypot involving a reported Chinese. spy scandal took the world by storm, it. is official. Tech giant Jensen Wong has. announced that he is resigning from. Nvidia. And to be clear, this is a very, very big deal because Jensen Wong, the. co-founder, the chief executive of.

Nvidia, the large computing company that. describes itself as making advanced. chips, systems, software for AI, that. had a market cap of over $4 trillion, that has customers including Microsoft, Amazon, Google, Meta, Oracle. a guy who. has the ear of the president of the. United States as we're in this race for. AI dominance against China, he steps. down. Now, aside from the massive. economic and financial implications, I. mean, I'll give you an idea of it. When.

it was announced yesterday that the. board may remove Jensen Wong, the stock. dropped 8%. New York Post reporting that. around $450 billion may have been wiped. out from the company's market value. after this story broke out. CBS saying. that there could be 700 billion dollars. that's lost, but apparently that was for. the whole month of November, not just. after the announcement. But big picture. here, you're talking about a guy who. stepped down in the wake of this crucial. race that we're in against China, the AI.

race, and he is being accused of having. an affair with a Chinese spy. I mean, if. this is true, you could potentially have. an asset of China feeding it information. about one of our top tech and AI. companies, or even allegedly potentially. influencing the decisions at Nvidia, even though it's not clear what. information was shared or divulged, if. any, or what decisions may have been. affected by Alice Wong, if any, or in.

general what intelligence China may have. gathered, again, if any. And we'll talk. more about Alice Wong in a second, but. something to keep in mind here is that. Jensen Wong had previously been pushing. for more lax regulations on AI to loosen. restrictions on selling chips to China. The close relationship between Jensen. Wong and President Trump. It is well. documented with the New York Post. reporting how he traveled with him to. China last May and was invited onto Air. Force One. So this news launched an FBI. investigation according to President.

Trump. Republican chairs of three House. committees have called for Jensen Wong. to appear to come in later this month. for an interview about this scandal. It. raises a ton of legal and national. security questions. We had a lawyer on. last time talking about potential crimes. that could be investigated here. And. this comes after reports that Jensen. Wong didn't just apparently have this. affair with Alice Wong. No, now it's. come out that he's had at least two. alleged affairs within the company. So,

first the New York Times reported that. Jensen Wong had a separate affair with. Kimberly Powell, vice president of. healthcare at the company. This is. apparently based on the reports of five. employees. And then it came out from. Reuters today that Jensen Wong had a. quote intimate relationship with a. second Nvidia employee. Now, currently, as we're recording this, we do not know. the identity of this second person, but. that's significant to say the least. And. one of the questions is, was this the. breaking point, right? Is this why he.

resigned or was something else? Was. something discovered in the last few. days potentially raising legal or. national security concerns or issues. that forced Jensen Wong to resign or. caused him to resign. I mean, Nvidia's. board of directors released a statement. today reads in part, quote, Jensen Wong. has resigned as president, chief. executive officer, and member of the. board effective immediately. Colette. Crest, current executive vice president. and chief financial officer of Nvidia,

has agreed to serve as interim chief. executive officer. The board is. initiating a search for a permanent. chief executive officer and will. consider internal and external. candidates. Interesting because I also. saw a Newsweek article that said, you. know, who would replace Jensen Wong as. CEO and it said nobody. And that perhaps. it's better to have a team lead the. company, that kind of management style. But it shows you how valuable he is to. this, how this is a huge loss again in. the middle of this AI race. But anyway,

you go back to the statement. It says, "Clette has helped lead Nvidia through a. period of extraordinary growth and has a. deep understanding of our business, customers, operations, and financial. position." Goes on to say, "The board. has full confidence in Colette and the. leadership team, and we expect the. company's operations, customer. commitments, and product roadmap to. continue without interruption." And then. the statement from the board says, "Jensen's contributions to Nvidia are. profound. Nvidia is one of the most. consequential technology companies in. the world. The board and the company. thank Jensen for his immeasurable. contributions to the company and the.

industry." Now, that feels a little bit. different than the one we heard the. other day because it was on Sunday when. Jensen Wong released his own statement. telling his employees about the affair, saying, quote, "I owe my family and all. of you an apology. I was unfaithful to. my wife." by the way, didn't mention who. the people were that he had an affair or. affairs with, right? He didn't say. affair or affairs. Interesting. My. actions hurt her and our children. There. is no excuse for what I did. I am deeply. sorry. Throughout my life, my family has.

given me love and support. They deserve. my honesty and loyalty. Instead, I let. them down and damaged the life we built. together. I take full responsibility for. what I did and the hurt I caused. And I. accept the criticism that comes with it. To my wife and family, I love you. I. know an apology cannot undo what I have. done. I hope our family will heal and. that over time I can earn back your. trust. To my colleagues at Nvidia, including those I have worked alongside. for decades and to our board partners. and shareholders around the world, you. deserve better from me. Leading Nvidia.

is the privilege of my life and my. responsibility is to serve you and be. worthy of your trust. I have fallen. short of that responsibility. I'm fully. committed to Nvidia and will work to. earn back your confidence regarding the. national security concerns raised in. news reports. Nvidia's board of. directors has initiated an independent. investigation. I support the. investigation and will cooperate fully. I love our country and our company. I am. committed to protecting Nvidia and. supporting America's national security. I am proud and grateful to be an. American. My family bears no.

responsibility for my choices. I do. Please give them privacy. Jensen. And. then Nvidia's board of directors issued. a statement. Quote, "The Nvidia board is. initiating an independent investigation. in light of recent reporting that. founder and CEO Jensen Wong has been the. target of a foreign intelligence effort. A committee of independent directors. assisted by outside independent council. will oversee the investigation. The. board prioritizes US national and. economic security, which is paramount to. the interest of Nvidia and its. shareholders. While the board has no.

reason to believe that either national. security or Nvidia secrets were. compromised, the board's inquiry will. examine all available information, Jensen fully supports the review and has. committed to cooperating with it. The. board has confidence in Jensen and his. leadership team and will provide further. updates as appropriate. And by the way, the board came out and said that it. hired former acting US attorney for the. Southern District of New York, June H. him and his law firm, one of the most. prominent Wall Street law firms in the.

world, WTEL, Lipton, Rosen and Cats, to. conduct this independent investigation. And now, what just two days later, Jensen Wong resigned? What changed? You. got to talk the national security. implications of this. And I'm going to. bring on former FBI CIA officer Tracy. Walder in a minute. And also, there's a. shareholder lawsuit going on, too. But. while Jensen didn't mention who he had. an affair with, reporting indicates that. this woman is Alice Wong. To be clear, no relation to Jensen Wong, but someone. who has been photographed alongside him. numerous times. Photograph of them.

reportedly attending a dinner in Taipei, Taiwan on May 22nd, 2025. There's. another one reportedly taken at an event. during the Computex Forum in Taipei, Taiwan on June 7th, 2024. This photo. allegedly shared by Alice herself from. WeChat feed, a Chinese social media. platform. The Guardian is even reporting. there's footage of his arm around her, her kissing him on the cheek. According. to CNN, Alice Wong was apparently a. journalist for Chinese state media, a. figure in the tech industry with US. Customs and Border Patrol records.

indicating that she's a 43-year-old. Chinese citizen by the name of Wong Lee. Alice Wong was an executive of Nvidia's. reported business partner. Singapore-based Mega Speed between March. and November of 2023. Mega Speed is a. data center company apparently sells. computing power or capacity services. usually in the AI space. reportedly. allowed its customers to rent out. Nvidia's chips. Mega Speed, according to. CNN, became one of the largest. purchasers of Nvidia chips in Southeast. Asia. And according to the New York. Times, Mega Speed was accused of working.

to divert Nvidia's specialized chips to. China. So going around US sanctions, so. essentially smuggling chips. And that's. because the US has restricted exports of. its most advanced chips to China due to. of course national security issues. and. Megaspe denied allegations of. wrongdoing, though it was reported by. the New York Times on November 9th that. the Justice Department is conducting a. criminal investigation into Mega Speed. But US intelligence believes that Alice. Wong was recruited to be a spy for. China, namely by the country's Ministry.

of State Security. It's their top spy. agency. And the New York Post reports. that she has been under investigation. since the end of President Biden's term. According to the BBC, electronic. surveillance revealed a series of. communications between Alice Wong and a. US citizen that seemingly now has been. identified as Jensen Wong. Not entirely. clear when or how they met, but she's. appeared alongside him at numerous. occasions, numerous events. CNN saying. they've been photographed together as. early as 2024, which is what I. mentioned. And the New York Times.

reports that President Trump was briefed. about intelligence indicating Alice Wong. may be a Chinese spy. In fact, CNN says. sources say the FBI alerted US lawmakers. about her allegedly providing. information to China nearly a year ago. And we know that Jensen Wong traveled. with the president to China earlier this. year. And right now, reporting indicates. that Alice Wong's whereabouts are. unknown. For its part, China denies. these spy allegations. But look, it's. escalating. The president announced the. FBI is looking into all of this, too.

So, with the resignation of Jensen Wong, the timing of it interesting. What is. happening behind the scenes? What can we. expect from this investigation? And is. there weight to this alleged honeypot. scandal? How exactly do these work? All. right, I'm about to throw an interview. And before I do, this is before we. recorded this before the news came out. of an alleged third affair, the second. employee at Nvidia. Just keep that in. mind. Okay, I want to bring on somebody. who I haven't seen in quite some time. I.

always miss her. Always happy when she. comes on. Uh, former CIA special. operations officer, former FBI special. agent, national security contributor at. NewsNation, Tracy Walder. Tracy, good to. see you. I mean, you know, this is the. topic that when we were like, who do we. want? Got to talk to you about it. Now, first, him resigning. Some would say, is. it after the news of the second alleged. affair, or did something happen in the. last few days? Was there information.

that was learned either during the. course of the FBI or during the course. of this internal investigation that. raised certain legal or national. security issues that maybe said there's. no way he can stay on anymore? I mean, or it's him just trying to, you know, not be a distraction for the company. It's kind of a corporate question, but. it also makes me think, did something. happen in the last few days? >> I don't think so. I think once the news. broke, he probably had every intention. of resigning. It also, and again, I am.

not giving him any kind of pass for his. behavior. Obviously, cheating and then. having really poor judgment is terrible, but it does give me more credence to my. belief that he probably didn't know that. she was a spy until news broke that she. was a spy and he is a national security. threat for his his country. What? >> Somebody would look at that and say, "This guy's brilliant." Okay, he's. heading up one of the biggest companies. in the entire world. He's brilliant in. the AI space. He doesn't know that the.

person that he is reportedly with is. potentially a Chinese asset. How is that. possible? Unless you tell me the. techniques that are used are so good. that no one would have any idea. whatsoever. So, I think I'm trying to. say this in a way that doesn't alienate. people, but there is a reason that men. are targeted more in these kinds of. operations than women. And I think some. of it is is that every single person in. this world, has a weakness, has.

something that makes them susceptible to. espionage, to to theft, to all of those. things. And I think China had their. sights on him because they wanted those. chips that he had, right? And he was. always a target. And I think they. realized that one of his weaknesses and. a way to get close to him was through. women, especially with the news of the. second um affair that he had. And that. is a weakness that he has. It's a poor. judgment call that he has.

problem is this is somebody Alice Wong. who had a connection to China. She was a. jer a reported journalist for Chinese. state media. She was part of this uh. this company based in Singapore um that. had connections to China. It wasn't as. if he had an affair with Jane Smith from. Virginia and you find out that she's a. Russian asset and you would have no. idea. He I mean isn't there a level of. due diligence that either he or the.

people around him should have known hey. something you might want to keep a. careful eye here? >> Yes and no. So again when I worked at. CIA we have a non-fractionization policy. with people from certain countries. I. can't say which ones but I'm sure we can. guess which ones. And so I am very. cognizant of the fact that we shouldn't. be um in people in certain positions. shouldn't be close to people from other. countries for those reasons. I'm not. sure that everyone is. Also, we have to.

remember again not giving him a pass on. his behavior. But um President Trump and. Marco Rubio both had this information, right, that she was a spy for MSS and. they made the decision not to tell him. and the FBI did not provide him with any. kind of intelligence assessment on her. And so the people close to him, they may. have been telling him, hey, you. shouldn't do this. But the bottom line, as you just mentioned, he is the CEO of. arguably one of the most powerful. companies in the world, one of the most.

influential countries in the world. And. the buck sort of stops with him. So. people can advise him not to do things, but they they may not have a policy in. place saying not to do it. >> All right. For anybody out there who. runs a business, manages a business, owns a business, you don't need me to. tell you that running a business is. tough enough. But I got to say, why make. it harder doing things manually or. relying on dozens of apps that don't. really talk to each other, right? That's. where our sponsor, ODU, comes in. Because ODU is an all-in-one business. management platform with a full suite of.

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create invoices, track expenses, and. even summarize data with AI to save you. hundreds of hours. You know what the. best part is? You can choose your apps. and even build custom workflows. So, it's all fully tailored to your. business's needs. Take your business to. the next level by consulting with an ODO. expert today for free at. odo.comssidebar. Why would the US government not tell him. or the company? And why wouldn't someone. stop the president of the United States.

from maintaining such a close. relationship with him and making sure he. doesn't come on US uh Air Force One. unless there was something deliberate. about that. >> So that is my biggest issue. That's. always been my biggest issue sort of. with this. From an intelligence side, I. I see the idea of letting it continue, right? So that you can see who is else. is Alice meeting with, what other. targets does she have here in the United. States. What other intelligence. information can we glean with her? But. in my opinion, given her closeness to.

him and given that like personal. relationship that they had, not just the. business relationship, I actually think. it's a terrible idea to withhold that. information. And the reason being is she. could have given him any kind of gifts. that were bugged with devices. She could. have accessed his personal and home. computers at any time. And I think that. is the part that I think maybe people. didn't think about or they did and made. ultimately the wrong decision. >> Yeah, maybe. I part of me is like, you.

know, keep your friends close but your. enemies closer. Um, were they monitoring. her and monitoring his communications. with her? And and that becomes the. question about the FBI. Like that's a. big question I have. So the FBI. president says is now looking into this. What does that mean? How are they. investigating this? What are they doing? >> So the FBI, we know from the reporting. now that the the US had essentially. confirmed that she was a spy and they. and they confirmed that actually through. surveillance of her. So they were. already following her. Um and so the FBI.

now it's really not up for debate. investigating whether or not she's a. spy. We already know that. In my. opinion, what I think the FBI is doing. is what we call a damage assessment, right? How much uh was given to the. Chinese, how was it given to the. Chinese? Um, and you know, and that's. through audit trails, that's through. signals, intelligence, and that's. through interviewing him as well in. terms of what devices did she have. access to, not have access to. That's in. my opinion what they're doing from an.

investigative standpoint. And they're. obtaining warrants for all these. electronic devices and communications. and working probably with Nvidia because. I imagine there might be internal. corporate communications as well. >> Well, some of it I'm guessing he's. handing I'm hearing that it's been. reported that he's handing over some of. it on on his own. So, that's good. because you get it much more quickly. that way. Um but yes, I I am assuming. and hoping that they have applied for. warrants um to get they're going to need. broader um access to Nvidia as as a.

whole. I would assume, but at the same. time, one thing I haven't talked about. and I think we need to think about is. the the flip side of this. So the fact. that he was on Air Force One, the fact. that he was that close, was there damage. to the other side as well? So, we're. really focusing on this damage to. Nvidia, but what other kind of damage. did it have to the national security. apparatus as a whole? >> Do they do agents match out? They say. okay allegedly this information was get.

provided to her at this point in time. And then they look within that period of. time and say China did this or Nvidia. did this or they look at certain um. commonalities and consistencies that. perhaps certain actions were taken or. communications happened that they it. wouldn't have happened otherwise unless. she had access to that. Does that make. sense? >> Yes. You're actually pretty spot on with. that. In the case that I worked, I. worked Chinese espionage at the FBI was. we actually figured it out in a very. similar way because this very specific.

technology essentially we were. monitoring China and they like randomly. popped up with it, right? And we knew. that technology was indicative to only. the US. It was native to the US. There. was only one company that was making it. And so we could then go back to that. company who was working on that account, what individuals had access to, right? And so then that's how we were able to. identify but in a backwards way the. actual Chinese spy that was working. that. And so yes, they're 100% going to. marry all of that up. It takes some time.

though, but they're definitely going to. do that. >> And this could be very well a case where. he had no idea he maybe was a victim of. this espion this alleged espionage. effort. >> The FBI though, what can we expect from. a conclusion here? Like how long will it. take them to review this material? Um. make an analysis. Is it an internal FBI. report? Are there arrests? Are there. criminal charges? I mean, talk to me. about what could result from the FBI. being a part of this and when. >> So, from a criminal perspective with.

him, it's all going to come down to did. he know, right? Did he know? And they. are going to be investigating that part. But, and I know this sounds strange, but. just hear me out. My guess is that's. probably the least of their concerns. right now because the gig is up for him, right? He can't do any more damage in. the in the the place that he is. he's. not with the company anymore. My guess. is what they are really needing to do is. focus on the damage to Nvidia and then. to the US economy and then right to our. that's probably what they're focusing on.

on first is that damage. Then they're. going to go back and find out what did. Jensen Hong know if anything. And if he. did know then absolutely he would be. looking at espionage and and treason. charges which are obviously incredibly. serious. But I mean, the case that I. worked at the FBI took. >> almost seven years, I think, to to wrap. up. So, I think this one's going to go a. little faster because of the nature of. the business and the damage that it. could do. >> And the fact that he's cooperating and. assisting seems to suggest he really.

believes he was a victim and had no. idea. Do they can't find Alice Wang? They don't know where she is. >> I think, and again, I'm I'm going to. what I used to do and what happened in. that case. uh she fled to China that. we're never going to see or hear from. her. Um again, I don't she's not even in. Singapore because basically they're they. would have to hand her over to us. because of our diplomatic relationship. with Singapore. So in in the case that I. work, there were three other. conspirators and they fled to China.

before we could even get to them. We. just got one of them. And so I think. unfortunately that's where she is and. China is absolutely not going to hand. her over any. >> does that and that would signify that. yeah she is definitely a Chinese spy if. she flew if she fled to China. I mean, you put two and two together, that's. pretty much what it is. So, so explain. to me how this would work, this. recruitment. Like, is it typical that. they look at her, they say, "Okay, the. way she looks, the fact that she was a. journalist, the fact that she's part of. Mega Speed, like when would something. when would a recruitment like this. happen and how would it happen?".

>> So, we have to remember with China. versus the US, we're dealing with two. very different systems, right? You have. freedom of choice, right, Jesse? You and. I have freedom of choice. If the. government comes to you and says be a. spy, you can say no really this is not. my job. I don't want to do that. It. doesn't work that way in China. If the. MSS comes to you and says we have a job. for you, you are doing that job. So in. terms of identifying her, I don't know. because she would she works at the. everyone in China works at the behest of. the government and what the government.

is telling them to do. She wouldn't have. had a choice in the matter. But I do. think because of her background um and. because of the fact that you know she. was a journalist, she was somewhat. public, she is comfortable with speaking. to people and and getting involved that. I think they decided she would be a good. person for that. Um and then obviously. they they put her in in the role, but. Megaspe in and of itself is somewhat of. a a shell company. And I think they. probably did that on purpose, put her.

there. um with really out without that. experience to get that commonality with. Jensen Hong. I think Jensen Hong was a. target to them long before they decided. that Alice Wong would be the person to. engage in. >> Do you know about what the training is. if like we you know honeypot honey trap. um these seduction methods? Do we know. how China. potentially trains assets like this? >> I don't. And I mean, obviously here in. the US, I'm not going to say the CIA is.

perfect and that we've never done. anything immoral. We totally have, >> but um the one thing we absolutely don't. do are honeypot uh traps. And so I. wouldn't even be familiar with that. training because it's not training that. we even provide. >> But you've seen commonalities and when. these cases pop up, what is it? Is it. the idea? You think like. >> I I was I was interviewing um this woman. who claims to be a former Russian asset. She said, you know, there's a thing you. do like seven times your you you're. around a a potential target seven times.

without them knowing so that when they. officially do meet you there's like a. sense of familiarity. Um but like I mean. you know I don't know what the what the. patterns are the techniques but if this. is true it it seemingly clearly worked. I guess the question also is if they. can't find her okay they don't have her. but then they look at Jensen Wong and. they have his communications they know. what her phone number is maybe they know. what her email address is. Is there any. way to investigate or look at those. records if they don't actually have her. device?

>> Yes, of course they can, you know, get. both sides of the conversation. But just. really quickly, back to your question. about, you know, the recruitment. process. I can't reveal too much about. tradecraftraft, but it's very similar to. how we recruit just spies to work for us. in general. It's just the classic spot, assess, develop, recruit. You spot. someone. So Jensen Hong, I'm sure was on. a list of individuals that they wanted. right to spy on. They assess what are. their weaknesses, what are their. commonalities in terms of who are you. going to put in front of this person to. recruit them. Who is the best person to.

do that? Then you develop them. So it's. my understanding they had a friendship. before that. So they developed through a. friendship and then you recruit them. So. in our case it would have been hey do. you want to come work for the CIA? In. their case is do you want to take this. relationship to the next level? Right? And so it's but that it's very similar. throughout the world. It's just. different ways of obviously utilizing. that. >> That's a good point. I'm glad you you uh. clarified that. Um but in terms of. getting you know her digital information.

because I mean I wouldn't know would. that be the the way that she would have. communicated alleg you know if this is. true if she would that be the way that. she communicated or passed along any of. the information she learned or would it. be in person? Would there be handlers? Would there be drop spots? So, so in the. case I worked, it was handlers. Um, and. the way we caught him was actually the. guy took a drive like physically with. him on an airplane to Beijing. We caught. him at the airport obviously and he was. arrested there. And even recently, I. don't know if you've seen in the news, there's been some um of individuals.

working for China that were taking. drives with them. So, yes, you've got. the electronic and clearly she popped up. on someone's radar electronically. because she was being the the CIA or FBI. or whomever was already monitoring her. when they found out about her. relationship. So, they were monitoring. her from an electronic standpoint, but I. think the the goods or the information I. think was she was probably passing the. oldfashioned way. And one of the things. they'll want to look at are her trips.

either to the US, uh, through Singapore, through any of those countries back to. China. I think that's going to be really. important. >> When we talk about this being a national. security concern, can you just elaborate. maybe generally why this is such a big. deal? As we are in an AI race, um, and. you know, our chips are so valuable. They're so important to us. Why this is. such a big deal? a you know now we lost. uh a tech giant running one of the most. important companies that we have but you.

know in this AI race against China. specifically why this is such a big. national security issue in terms of. information that might have been relayed. to uh a Chinese spy agency or whether. any actions were of Nvidia were. influenced because of Alice Wong or. allegedly because of Alice Wong. >> I think this is in my opinion it's. always been a national security threat. because the case I worked was a private. company. So, I've I've seen this for a. long time. I think the American people. as a whole, this surprises them, right? Because we think of national security in.

the military aspects, right, in a very. conventional way. And so, that's. definitely surprising. China does over. $600 million of IP theft damage a year. to the US. And if you think about the. national security implications, let's. let's take the case that I worked. It. was something called quiet electric. drive. It made submarines quiet so they. couldn't be picked up on sonar and China. just like got it. And that's bad. That's. very bad from a technical. It now puts.

us behind or the same because the whole. idea in war and national security is you. want the upper hand, right? You want the. best technology. You want the best. stuff. You want the best people. And. when all of a sudden a country develops. those literally overnight and didn't. spend the time, the energy and the. investment into the R&D, that is a. problem. So, what are the red flags? Like, if I I I don't know if companies, Fortune 500 companies around the country. or just big tech companies, they're now.

saying, "Okay, we got to have new. training, everybody. We got to talk. about this." Like, first of all, maybe. it's the whole thing, don't have an. affair. Um, but this idea of if someone. approaches you that looks out of your. league, just ignore them. I mean, like, what is what are the red flags? How do. you prevent something like this. happening again? And maybe it's not just. companies, it's levels of government. Um. you're in the military, intelligence. agencies, like how do you prevent. something like this from happening if.

this is all true? And what are the red. flags? >> So I think, and this might be a little. bit controversial, I'm going to focus. more on like the prevention piece than I. guess the red flag piece, if that's. okay. And some of I I get that some of. my recommendations are unconventional, but I think they work. So at CIA, for. example, if we even so much as talked to. someone that was not a US national, it. actually had to be documented and. reported and then the CIA would run full. background checks on those individuals. I'm not talking about profiling people.

because it's not bad to not be a US. citizen. There's nothing wrong with. that. We were all immigrants at one. point. So I don't want people to think. that that's how that's coming off. But I. think that for for people at certain. levels of private businesses, I don't. know that it needs to be everyone, but. at certain levels of private businesses, I think they need to have those same. reporting rules. And I think companies. might, even if it's just certain. countries that they've identified as. being IP issues in terms of threats, then those need to be reported. I also.

and again I know this might be. controversial. I think we need to think. about potential lifestyle polygraphs for. individuals at these large companies for. certain certain people at certain levels. of these companies um because of their. access right to information. I know. that's timeconuming I know and again. we're not looking for perfect people. Everyone has a past right even at CIA we. all have a past. I'm sure I've done. things that were not legal growing up, but it was all about what makes you.

susceptible to blackmail. That's what. the CIA wanted to know in that. polygraph. And I think that that's. something that would be very very. beneficial, but I know that could be. controversial. >> Wow. That not a bad idea. I don't know. if it would be widely accepted, but. interesting to see. >> I know. I know. But I think if we care. enough about our national security and. we care enough about our investments. into these industries and we care enough. about I guess winning this race, it's. something we need to really start. thinking about.

>> Yeah, I mean I can't disagree. You make. a good point and we should all care. Uh. Tracy Walder, thank you so much. Really. appreciate it. >> That's all we have for you right now. here on Sidebar. Everybody, thank you so. [music] much for joining us. I'm Jesse. Weber. I'll speak to you next time. >> [music].