10 Shocking Epstein Secrets from 'Bestie' Les Wexner

This is a deposition of Mr. Leslie H. Wexner conducted by the House Committee. on Oversight and Government Reform. >> Oh yeah, he's a crook. >> I know. >> he would make Bernie Maid off look like. a boy scout. I mean diabolical isn't a. big enough word. The rumor and innuendo. that goes around me is makes me very mad. cuz I think I'm a very straight arrow. and a very responsible person. Les. Wexner, the business guru, the retail. store icon who once described Jeffrey. Epstein as a quote most loyal friend. He.

faced off against US House members for. hours this week. In an unprecedented. deposition, he shared details about how. he met the man, the man that he claims. would go on to steal millions of dollars. from him, and how he responded to. accusations that maybe he knew more. about what Epstein was apparently up to. and we have all of the video of his. deposition and it says a lot. Welcome to. Sidebar presented by Law and Crime. I'm. Jesse Weber.

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brand that was owned or influenced by. Leslie Herbert Wexter. Les Wexner, an. Ohio businessman who has made millions. and millions of dollars on brands like. Victoria's Secret and Express and Bath &. Body Works. But for years, his. reputation has been marred by his. apparent close personal and professional. relationships with convicted sex. offender Jeffrey Epstein. And as the. Department of Justice released millions. of files related to Epstein, this is.

pursuant to the Epstein Files. Transparency Act, Wexner's name has. popped up again and again and again and. again. Now, to be clear, Wexner has. previously denied knowing that Epstein. was involved in any sort of illegal. conduct. I mean, aside from allegedly. stealing money from him, but I'm talking. more specifically about sex trafficking. and prostitution of minors. and he. insists that he cut ties with him back. in 2007 before Epstein was convicted of. soliciting an underage girl for sex in. Florida. And remember, he entered into.

that plea deal. See, the issue with that. is it came out that June 26, 2008, that. Wexner had apparently sent Epstein uh an. email. This is after a plea deal was. announced and Wexner apparently wrote to. Epstein, "Abigail told me the result. All I can say is, I feel sorry. You. violated your own number one rule. always be careful. And then Epstein. replied, "No excuse." Now, Epstein was. arrested and charged federally a decade. later. Died in a New York City jail. while awaiting trial on federal sex. trafficking of minors charges. This is.

back in 2019. But Epstein, this alleged. genius with money, controlled Wexner's. considerable assets for years as his. financial adviser. He was even granted. power of attorney in the early 90s. So. essentially allowed to make all sorts of. decisions involving Wexner, his family, his properties, his money. Now Wexner. has claimed I'm the victim claimed that. Epstein expertly conned him out of. millions of dollars and that's allegedly. how he acquired much of his wealth. And. more information that was released in. the file show or seemingly show that. Epstein agreed to pay the Wexner family.

$100 million to resolve this issue. A. police report was never filed because. Wexner seemingly didn't want people to. know that he'd been the victim of such a. massive theft. And by the way, Wexner. released a three-page statement ahead of. his deposition saying he was pleased to. testify and quote, "I was never a. participant nor co-conspirator in any of. Epstein's illegal activities. To my. enormous embarrassment and regret, I, like many others, was duped by a. worldclass con man. I cannot undo that. part of my personal history, even as I. regret ever having met him." And Wexner.

also insisted in the statement that he. had never been unfaithful to his wife. Abigail in any way, shape, or form. He. says she was the one who uncovered that. Epstein had been essentially robbing. them blind. Quote, "In September 2007, nine months before he plead guilty in. Florida, we revoked Epstein's power of. attorney, removed his access to our bank. accounts, and forced him to resign from. all our affiliated entities, confronted. with his financial wrongdoing by. Abigail." Epste agreed to and did return. a substantial amount of money, even. while continuing to maintain his total.

innocence of any wrongdoing, never. dropping the con. In light of his. eventual guilty plea and deception of. our family, we completely severed our. relationship with Epstein. Epstein was. permanently and irrevocably out of my. life. Again, but I mentioned the 2008. email or the parent email. While others. visited Epstein in jail and associated. with him after his release, I did not. Nor did I witness, condone, or enable. his crimes in any way. Okay, but here's. the thing. The US House Oversight. Committee wanted more details about just. how close Wexner and Epstein were and. what sort of sorted and nefarious.

activity Wexner might have witnessed, known about, allegedly even participated. in. And that's the key, whether he. funded Epstein's activities. And the key. here, either knowingly or unknowingly, which as we go through this, you'll make. your own opinions. There was a recently. released FBI email that shows Wexner and. others were labeled at one point or. considered at one point as secondary. co-conspirators. However, not only has. Wexner never faced any sort of criminal.

charges connected to that, there is a. part there's a memo where it indicates. that there was limited evidence. regarding his involvement. Okay. Now, getting to the answers to these burning. questions, it wasn't quite as simple as. the committee members maybe might have. hoped because Wexner, now 88 years old, was reportedly too frail to travel from. Ohio to Washington DC to respond to the. subpoena. So, DC came to him at his home. in New Albany. You don't see that a lot. The committee released the video.

deposition in its entirety. And in it, you can see Wexner laughing and joking, seemingly undeterred by the massive. implications of his Epstein connections, although could have been nervous. Very. hard to judge. But here's what I'll say. We have a lot of information to go over. in this episode. The deposition itself. lasted hours, and there were a few. breaks that were sprinkled in, and we. can't get into all of it, but I do want. to highlight some particularly. interesting details, including Epstein's. seemingly unhealthy interest in.

Victoria's Secret and its young models. whether Wexner actually ever considered. Epstein a friend. A wild moment when it. seems his own lawyer, Wexner's own. lawyer, threatened to kill him. Plus, by. the way, what the members of Congress. had to say about what they heard during. the deposition. >> We should be very clear that there would. be no Epstein Island. There'd be no. Epstein plane, there'd be no money to. traffic women and girls. Mr. Epstein. would not be the wealthy man he was.

without the support of Les Wexner. >> So after going over the rules and the. expectations of the deposition and. having Wexner swear an oath to tell the. truth, the committee members that were. present, they started off by asking. Wexner about his early life and his. career. And then the questioning turned. to his relationship with his financial. adviser who he says he first met through. friends in the mid1 1980s. >> How did you first come to meet Mr. Absene? was really by accident. U.

I was friend with with a a couple of Bob. and Wendy Meister and uh I was in. Florida and I had never been to Florida. So, they were driving me around showing. me what South Florida looked like and. pasted uh and they showed me the. Breakers Hotel and they were just. driving around the driveway and they Bob. stopped the car and he said, "There's. somebody you should meet uh a really. smart, savvy guy named Jeffrey Epstton.".

And so they stopped the car. I was. sitting in the back seat and they. introduced me to Jeffrey and we drove. off. That was about it. So at that time. you had no knowledge of Mr. Epstein. until Mr. Meiser introduced you to him? >> Never heard of him, never saw him, never. met him. >> Did Mr. Meiser ever raise any concerns. about Mr. Epstein? >> No. Um, he didn't. And during parts of. the deposition, the Congress members,

the congressional members read excerpts. from various articles that were written. about Epstein or Wexner over the years. asking him to confirm or deny certain. information, including a piece from the. 1990s in Vanity Fair. >> For the record, it reads, "Soon after. introducing Wexter and Epstein, Meer. started hearing disturbing stories about. Epstein sexual proclivities. Think of whatever the worst thing anyone. could do is and Epstein did them all. Meister said. Did Meister ever express.

concerns related to Mr. Epstein's sexual. procities? >> Never. Objection. Double hearsay. He. answered. >> never. >> The very next sentence continues. Mr. Epstein showed up unannounced at. Meiser's Park Avenue apartment with five. model models for Meicer's sexual. entertainment. Epstein thought he was. bringing me a gift according to Mr. Meiser. Were you aware of this.

occurring? >> Objection. Double hearsay. >> No. >> Did Mr. Epstein ever present you with. women for your sexual entertainment? >> Absolutely not. >> Mr. Wexner. The committee is. investigating the circumstances. surrounding Mr. Epste and Miss Maxwell. and the trafficking of young women, trafficking and sexual abuse of young. women or girls. Did Miss Maxwell ever introduce you to. any young woman or girl?

>> No, I don't think she ever introduced me. to any female or man. Did Miss Maxwell ever ask you to. introduce a young woman or girl to your. friends or associates? >> No. >> Did you ever introduce any young woman. or girl that you met through Miss. Maxwell to any of your friends or. associates? >> Objection assumes in fact not in. evidence.

>> You're kind. Let's just answer the. question. >> That's fine. >> Repeat the question. I think the answer. is no. But. >> did you ever introduce any woman or girl. that you met through Miss Maxwell to any. of your friends or associates? >> No. Never. >> When you were interacting with Mr. Epstein, did you enjoy spending time. with him? >> Enjoyment was fun. No, it was work. >> Can you elaborate on that? What were the.

nature of your interactions with Mr. Epstein? like professional, you know, this is what's going on. Have you paid. this bill? Do you know about that? Or, you know, I took an inventory of your. house and no one ever taken an inventory. of your furniture. Do you know how much. furniture you have? And it was like, no, I never thought about it. Well, I know. you should know that I have an. inventory. Things are buttoned up. Um. it it was. like what an off um I don't think how.

can I explain it? Uh, it's like people talk about family. offices. and I'd managed all my stuff or my admin. paid my bills because I was so busy and. and I realized it was a complexity of my. personal life and somebody had to just. do this stuff cuz it wasn't getting done. properly. And so it was like um.

you know professional I guess what a. fiduciary would do um more than what. just your accountant would do or your. lawyer would do and something was I. thought was unfair for my secretary to. do. >> And you testified that you had at times. he would call you three times a day. Is. that a fair characterization of your. testimony? No, what I'm saying is that. he would call me three times maybe in an.

hour. He wanted to tell me something. about what he was doing or would ask me. a question about taxes so I could under. he could understand what he was. preparing and but he might not call me. for 3 months, maybe 6 months. I wouldn't. pay attention. I it wasn't important at. the time. >> Mr. Wexner, is it your testimony today. that your conversations with Mr. I've. seen were predominantly focused on your. business relationship with him.

>> That'd be very accurate. That would be. very accurate. >> What common interest did you share with. Mr. Epstein outside of work? >> None. >> So, you didn't have any personal. relationship with Mr. Epstein. whatsoever? I I don't think I ever went to lunch or. dinner or a movie or had a a cup of. coffee with Jeffrey. >> Now, interestingly, Wexner insisted.

throughout the deposition that not only. were he and Epstein not close friends, they weren't friends at all. >> Did you at any time ever consider him to. be a close friend? >> No. >> It's. been reported repeatedly that you were. close friends with Mr. Epstein. Why do. you think people. would come to that conclusion? >> Objection, hearsay. >> Speculation. Because he would tell him. that.

But he told me he was friends. If you. told me that you were friends with Bill. Clinton, I would believe it. Or if. anybody told me somebody was a friend, I. would believe it. So I. I think the perspective. that I have now and I think what's. really important for this group to. understand. is it as I look back at it I was conned. by the world Olympic all-time con artist.

and when and you look at I read in the. news all the people he knew royalty. kings prince and all that. An incredible con artist. >> At one point it was brought up that. there was a note from Wexner that was. included in the new infamous Jeffrey. Epstein birthday book, right, that Gain. Maxwell reportedly put together for. Epstein for his birthday. It was filled. with letters from old friends and.

acquaintances. Take a look. >> Did you yourself write this letter to. Mr. Epstein? >> Sadly, I did. >> Did Miss Maxwell approach you to write. this letter for Mr. Epstein's birthday. >> I think the request was to write a card. or a note or something for a birthday. book. >> And did did that come from Miss Maxwell? >> I don't remember. >> Mr. Wexner, would you please. read the main body of the birthday note.

for the record, please? >> I wanted to get you what you want. So, here it is. Happy birthday, your friend. Lesie. And what was your understanding of what. Mr. King would want? >> He he was a bachelor, so he drew a pair. of boobs. >> Um, you've. >> as a kind of a joke and off-handedly I'd. say understand. >> Um, I hope you do. You've uh you said a.

few times throughout this deposition. today that you did not consider Mr. Epstein a friend of yours. However, you. signed this letter and I quote, "Your. friend Leslie." Um why would you sign. your friend Leslie to someone you did. not consider to be a friend of yours? >> I don't know. I normally say less not lessly either. when I write notes. And you know,

I guess I I could I can't explain why I. would say you're friend because we. weren't friends. >> So, according to Wexner, his wife. Abigail discovered that Epstein had been. stealing from him around the same time. that he was convicted of a sex crime in. Florida. >> Mr. Epstein was convicted in 2008. Did. you maintain any contact with Mr. Epstein after his plea deal. >> as I recall concommently.

with Abigail taking over the finances. and my wife is a M&A lawyer. She worked. for Davis Pulk. She's really smart and. she took over the finances and kind of. concommentately she was discovering that. he would stole money from us and. convently. finding out about these accusations and. the criminal activity that he pursued. and when we when I when we found out. about it we severed relationships with.

him immediately. >> Mr. Mr. Wner, I I appreciate the. context, but when was the last time you. were in contact with Mr. Epstein? >> I have no rec no no recall. >> Did you have any contact with Mr. Epstein after 2008? >> What happened in 2008? Again, >> Mr. Rap scene uh entered a plea deal uh.

related to the solicitation of minors or. Oh, okay. >> Never. never talked to him, never saw him. As. far as I was concerned, once we knew how. bad he was, he was dead. >> Did you have any knowledge of illegal. activity by Mr. Epstein prior to his. arrest in 2006?

The only I recall is my chief of staff. told me uh and I don't know he knew. press whether it was the newspapers or. radio or TV. that um. that Jeffrey had been. accused or a woman was suing him for u I. don't know being aggressive. And I I remember calling him and saying,

"What the hell is this?" And he said, "I. was being shaken down and by a hooker. and I believed him.". And I think the followup that. conversation was, "I hope you know. you're not bullshitting me because if it. is, you know, the party's over." He. said, "Absolutely not. Do you think I'm. stupid? which is probably what I would say to. attorney or say to you or anybody that I.

worked with. If you do something off, you're out. >> With the benefit of hindsight, were. there any things you witnessed or. observed about Mr. Epstein that could. have suggested he was trafficking and. sexually abusing women? >> Absolutely not. I've asked myself that. question. over and over. why I didn't see the. there should have been a clue or. something that I should have picked up. on. There's nothing that I can recall. Nothing.

Not even a clue of a clue. And I I think the reason. in hindsight and I think for the. understanding to get to the bottom of. what Jeffrey did. is to understand how great econ was. because that's the explanation I have to. myself. How how could I have never. thought he was a thief? How could I. never thought he was a pervert? You. know, all the terrible things. Never. clue.

>> And during the deposition, Wexner. confirmed that he had originally owned. Epstein's multi-story New York City. townhouse and said that Epstein had. purchased it for around $20 million. He. also confirmed that he visited Epste's. house in Palm Beach, Florida, just to. check it out, noting, by the way, that. he wasn't very impressed by it. Did you. ever visit his island in the US Virgin. Islands? >> Yes. >> Can you tell us about those visits? >> Yes. Jeffrey um invited.

us to see it and uh we were on a boat. and we went to the island with our kids. So Abigail, myself, I can't remember how. many kids we had, two or three or four, but at least two. walked around for a. while and left. probably an hour a visit. >> Okay. An hour. So on that trip, do you. recall seeing any prominent figures on. the island? >> No. And it was a pretty crummy island. >> Okay. Did you ever visit his ranch in.

New Mexico or his house in Paris? >> Do you want to break those up for. clarity? >> Did you ever visit his ranch in New. Mexico? >> It was the same kind of thing. He wanted. Abigail and I to see his ranch. We flew. down there and drove around for an hour. or two, got back on the plane and came. home. And I don't think he had a house. >> So you would fly just to go visit for 1. hour? >> Yeah, I I would fly to Europe for 1 hour. on business trips. I, as crazy it is, I.

getting on the plane and going places. for me was like going to the mailbox. Uh, and he didn't have a house on the ranch, and I never knew he had a house in. Paris. >> Did you ever see any girls or women that. looked unusually young? >> No. >> Did you ever hear rumors of any girls or. women who looked unusually young. visiting Epste?

>> No, we did. During any visits to. Epstein's property, did you ever see. photographs or other images of women or. minors? >> Not that I recall. >> Did you ever become aware of Epstein. transporting women or minors using. assets that you owned, whether that's a. plane that you owned or a yacht that you. owned? >> Absolutely not. No. Now, at some points. during the deposition, Wexner seemed to. be learning information for the first. time, especially when it came to how. much access Epstein had to his money and.

how much of it was moved around. >> Your attorneys quote explained that over. his years handling Wexner's finances, Epstein stole or otherwise. misappropriated several hundred million. from Wexner. That misconduct together. with with the fees that Epstein paid. himself for his services to Wexner. appears to account for virtually all of. Epstein's wealth. So So several hundred. million is a large but not precise.

figure. To the best of your knowledge, how much exactly did Epstein steal? >> I don't know. I don't think I'll ever. know. One of I'd like to try to understand a. little bit better how Epstein was able. to steal or misappropriate. that many uh funds. One way reportedly. is that the trusts that we described. earlier, which I know you said you have.

no recollection of, I just want to to be. thorough. The trusts that he was trustee. of would receive gifts of limited stock. and he would then sell that stock on the. New York Stock Exchange and then use a. portion of those proceeds for his own. personal purposes. Do you have any. knowledge or recollection of what I just. described? >> I'm effing surprised. I. shocked I didn't know this. >> Is it that you have not previously heard.

what I just described? I I I never heard. of it. Never saw this document. >> And it was publicly reported, I think, by ABC several years ago, but but not. ever on your radar. >> Never. >> Okay. Uh the report indicates that it. was more than or around $1.3 billion of. stock that Epstein moved around that. way. Not that he kept all of that money. for himself, but the total amount of. stock sales was over a billion dollars. You have no knowledge or awareness of.

that? >> I I don't know the amounts. The only. trust that I'm aware of is my wife set. up trusts for our kids, you know. So, wherever she set them up in the amounts, I have no idea what's in them then or. now. And then separately, it's been reported. that around $20 million of stock and. cash were contributed by two of your. charitable foundations to one of. Epstein's charities. Do you have any.

knowledge or awareness of that? >> Effing shocked. I I just I'm appalled. I. never heard that. >> Did you know that? >> No. Except. >> the questioning returned several times. to an apparent ruse that Epstein often. used to get closer to young women and. girls pretending to be a model or a. talent scout for Victoria's Secret which.

was at its heyday in the late 90s and. early 2000s. >> How did Mr. Epstein act towards women or. girls around him? >> In in his presence or. >> in your presence? Yes. I I guess the answer would be kind of. normal and nice. He would, you know, he. would like send my secretary or admin. flowers for her birthday.

Uh, courteous, I would say. >> Did you ever witness, Mr. Epstein, have. sexual contact of any kind with young. women or girls? >> Absolutely not. Did you ever witness Mr. Epstein sexually abuse young women or. girls? >> Absolutely not. >> Did you ever witness Mr. Epstein receive. massages from young women or girls? >> Absolutely not. >> Did Mr. Epstein ever discuss sexual acts. of any kind with you?

>> No. >> Did he ever discuss receiving massages? >> Yes. >> What were the nature of those. conversations? He told me massage therapy was great and. I should get massages. >> Did he ever discuss who he was receiving. massages from? >> No. >> So, it is your testimony today that you. don't recall him ever saying anything. about receiving massages from young. women or girls? >> Absolutely not.

>> Or absolutely. I'm agreeing with you. Didn't do that. >> Was it common for Epstein to bring young. women or girls to any other place where. the two of you would meet? Never. >> Did Mr. Epstein ever request that you. bring Victoria's Secret models to events. at your home? >> No. And no Victoria's Secret models ever. came to my home, even for business. purpose. >> Didn't.

talk about one exception. Have you seen. >> Oh, yeah. I forgot about that. There's one exception. Uh my wife had a. um for about 20 years a horse show here. for charity and one of the models. husband was a polo player and I don't. know how they showed up as a couple and. he gave. either me or my wife a polo horse which.

was I don't ride and Abigail wasn't. interested in a polo horse so that would. been the onlycept ction. >> Do Mr. Epstein ever request that you. introduce him to Victoria's Secret. models? >> Never. >> And Wexner was also asked about his. connections to President Donald Trump. Said the only times that he recalls. seeing him are at the Victoria Secret. fashion shows. >> Did you ever spend time with Epstein and. Donald Trump. >> together? >> Yes. >> I would answer this question accurately.

I would go to some of the Victoria. Secret fashion shows. was very important. to the brand. At some of the fashion. shows, Jeffrey was there and some Trump. was there. And I remember cuz Trump. would always introduce himself to me and. I always thought it was kind of odd that. he was at the fashion show because he. had nothing to do with fashion. So, the. coincidence of them being together at at. an event, it could have been that, but I.

have no specific recollection. never had a social or like a drink or a. cup of coffee, something. you know that uh. that would put them together. >> Okay. So, just to clarify, because I. want to make sure we're clear on the. record, you're saying that you can. recall instances potentially where. Epstein and Trump were together and you. were in their presence or just a random. scenario where Epstein may be there, Trump may be there separately and then.

you would be. >> It would be at random. That would be. accurate if it happened, but I have no. specific recollection. >> Okay. Um, did you ever see or become aware of. President Trump having a sexual. relationship with a person who was. introduced to him by Epstein or Maxwell? >> No. >> Um, has Donald Trump ever discussed Jeffrey.

Epstein with you? >> Nope. Did Jeffrey Epstein ever discuss Donald. Trump with you? I I would describe it. He would name. drop it. So he would say things like I. know President Clinton or I know the. Pope or I know God or you know or I know. you. It was that kind of name dropping but.

never. I can't remember specific place but. Jeffrey dropped a lot of names. >> Okay. So to clarify, you believe he's specifically dropped. Donald Trump's name. >> No, I'm saying it could have, but I. don't remember. >> Okay. Um, did Epstein ever share any. information with you about Donald. Trump's sexual activities? >> No. Do you have a relationship with. Donald Trump?

>> No. >> But you've met him before. >> He would he introduced himself to me at. the fashion show a couple of times, but I wouldn't say hello, how are you? Like you say, met like in we knew each. other. We don't know each other. He. wouldn't. I'd be shocked if he. remembered me. >> Towards the end of the deposition. Okay. One of the congressmen read out.

allegations that had been made by women. apparently fooled by this model scout. ruse. Take a look. >> It's been publicly reported that in. 1993, uh, President Cynthia Fetus Fields, who. was an executive at Victoria's Secret at. the time, was alerted that Epstein was. holding himself out as a Victoria's. Secret scout and that you were alerted. to the problem. and quote said that you. would stop it. Does that sound like the. time frame in which you recall being.

told about the issue? >> Maybe it doesn't. It could have been. I. was trying to think when she worked in. the business and when she left, but. yeah, probably right. I I don't know for. sure. >> What do you specifically recall about. when you were alerted to the issue? In. other words, who approached you and what. did they describe specifically? something like uh Jeff's trying to pick. up women and he says he's a Victoria. Secret talent scout.

I said that's yeah. terrible or the nonsense or I'll put a. stop to it something like that because I. couldn't it could be possible I think in. my memory but I didn't I didn't believe. it but I know I called him up and said. are you know Jeffrey what is going on he. said you think I'm stupid. I said because I hope not cuz if not. you'll be dead. brief very brief conversation I remember. him being definite about it didn't.

happen that and I'm. it wasn't a long conversation I was mad. so it was a blanket denial from Mr. Epstein. >> that's very accurate. >> and did you believe or were you. convinced by his denial at the time? >> At the time yes I did believe it. So, is. it right that you you were not no longer. upset following that conversation. because you believed that he had not in. fact held himself out as a scout?

>> That's accurate. Yes, that's how I felt. >> Do you recall whether you had the. impression that your executives. simply made the story up or. I don't recall. just knowing how I think about things. I I probably would have said this is. just. Jeffrey Single,

you know, it's a thing to say. A rumor. could get started. I got to chase it. down cuz, you know, God forbid that. anybody was do in the business, let. alone outside the business, was dating. people in the business or dating models. or recruiting them or any any of the. stuff that we now know is true. I would. have fired him on the spot. In May 1997, a young woman named. says that she was introduced to a man. who identified himself as a talent scout. for Victoria's Secret. That was Jeffrey. Epstein. Mr. Epste allegedly invited.

Miss to his hotel room in Santa Monica, California to audition for the catalog. When she arrived, Mr. Epste grabbed her, tried to undress her, and said he wanted. to quote manhandle her. Mled in tears, and filed a police report. It's one of. the earliest allegations that are known. against Mr. Epstein. >> Yeah. >> Were you alerted to this sexual assault. at the time? >> Same objection to hears, but go ahead. >> Kind of the same answer. I don't know how I knew about it and.

you called Jeffrey like, "What the. hell's going on, Jeffrey?" And I was. like, "Do you think I'm stupid?". Like, "This was a bad girl. You know, I. was on a date. She made all this stuff. up. You don't think I behave this way, would you? And like I hope not was. probably what I said cuz I couldn't. believe that anybody that I knew would. behave like that. >> And what you're describing is that the. original single conversation you. described earlier or is that a separate.

conversation with Mr. Epstein about the. issue? >> I'm a little confused. the the this. question about the lady in the hotel in. New York was one conversation and the. notion or the discussion about Jeffrey's. interviewing models I think was a. separate one and they didn't happen. simultaneously. >> I understand it sounds like that might. have been about four years apart from. each other. >> you could tell me four years or four. months I don't remember.

>> so it sounds like at that point there. would have been at least two. conversations with Mr. for Epstein about. the broader Victoria Secret issue. Uh, in 2004, a woman named. had a similar experience. She was. invited to Mr. Epstein's New York home. under the impression that he would be. able to get her a job as a Victoria's. Secret model. Mr. Epstein apparently. allegedly undressed and handed her a. miss threw the at his head and ran out.

of the room. Were you made aware of this. allegation at the time? I I never heard. this story before. >> In 2005, the New York Post ran an. article describing a Romanian model who. allegedly uh land a gig at Wexner's. Victoria's Secret brand thanks to Mr. Epstein. Did you have any knowledge. about models who actually acquired jobs. at Victoria's Secret directly or. indirectly through Mr. Epstein?

laughing. No, but I didn't. meet interview or pick models. That. wasn't what I did and no one in the. business did. >> And but just to phrase it clearly, to. your knowledge, did Victoria Secret ever. hire or contract with a model at the. recommendation of Jeffrey Epstein? >> No. I I can't imagine they did. No, I I. wouldn't know if they did, but I'm the. the way that we've handled our.

marketing. It couldn't have happened. that I think I would have I would have. known cuz it was just wasn't the. practice. >> Could I ask one follow-up question with. respect to that second conversation and. the young woman named. I know they were a few years apart, but. if you recall, was there any part of you. that that doubted whether Mr. Epstein. had been truthful in his denial with you. the first time. >> At the time, I don't think I connected.

them. You can't imagine how busy I was. I was. engaged. I was married. I'm running 20. businesses. I never made the connection. >> And as far as you recall, those are the. only two times that you were alerted to. Mr. Epstein holding himself out as. affiliated with Victoria's Secret. >> Those stories. Yeah. >> According to Wexner, he had never been. questioned by any law enforcement agency.

in connection with Epstein and his. alleged sex trafficking operation, which. if this is true, is startling to say the. least. But again, we don't know this for. sure. We discussed earlier in this. deposition. um around the time frame of 2019. if you had any involvement with um law. enforcement as they investigated Mr. Epstein for his crimes he was ultimately. charged with in New York. Um just to. clarify, did you speak to any law.

enforcement agency of any kind regarding. Jeffrey Epstein's investigation in New. York in 2019? Never didn't. Now I don't remember ever. talking to any law enforcement agency. >> Did you ever provide any documentation. to any law enforcement agency of any. kind regarding Jeffrey Epstein and his. investigation in New York in 2019? >> Not to my knowledge. >> And just to be clear, you never formally. interviewed with anyone from the FBI or.

Department of Justice about Jeffrey. Epstein or his criminal investigation in. 2019? >> Never. >> Did Mr. Epstein ever contact you or. attempt to contact you after his arrest. in 2019? >> I don't think so. He was dead. >> Well, before he died. >> No, I mean dead with me. >> Understood. Did anyone affiliated with. Mr. Epstein ever reach out to you in. 2019 regarding his investigation in New. York?

>> Never. No one. >> Okay, I have to highlight this. So, as. the deposition passed the 4hour mark, the 88-year-old started going off on. more and more tangents. His attorney did. not seem to be happy about this. And I. want you to listen carefully because it. seems his attorney at one point not only. had to rein him in, >> he allegedly threatened him. >> Answer the question. >> Okay. >> I I'm sure we all appreciate the. stories. We're just trying to to answer. the questions they actually wanted the. answers. >> That's very helpful. Thank you.

>> I I hope it is. as an example, I. wouldn't I I didn't have the idea to. inventory furniture or valuables. And. he's like, "How could you have all. silverware in your house?" And. I didn't count forks and spoons. And. it's like, Jeff, so people could be. walking out with forks and spoons. Gee, that's a good idea. We ought to have an. inventory. But then there was a I hired. a lady to be like the house manager who.

had run the US embassy in Rome and she. said, "Yeah, I know how to do this." And. I said and I said, "Well, why don't we. keep inventories of stuff?" And she. said, "Yeah, I could do that." So she. did that as that's kind of a puny. example, but I wouldn't have had the. idea. But then all the things were. inventoried. That wasn't work for me or. Jeffrey. It was just regularly done. I will kill you if you answer another. question. Okay,

>> kind of tough to hear, but his council. seemingly said, "I will effing kill you. if you answer another question with more. than five words." Okay, Wexner laughed. A lot to make of that one. Look, I will. say any attorney doesn't want their. client saying more than they have to. under oath. Anything can open them up to. liability or further questions. Optically, for a guy who claims that he. was completely in the dark, that he's. innocent, what's the harm of saying too. much? Right. >> Mr. Wexner, is it your testimony here. today that Mr. Ebstein's wealth came.

from not only yourself, but also this. extensive network of clients that also. were wealthier, otherwise influential. individuals? >> No question. Absolutely. And you know, sitting here. today, um, with the benefit of hindsight being. 2020, how do you think that the United States.

Congress could prevent. the crimes and in your words, cons. Mr. Epstein and by extension Miss. Maxwell committed on uh victims around. the world and specifically in the United. States. >> Well, I would hope that uh this. interview or whatever it is today would. help you to understand.

that he was a crook and a con man. And. in hindsight, you know, uh, looking back, he would make Bernie Maid off look like. a boy scout. So complete, so diabolical. I mean, just incredible, sinister. If I. were giving the government advice, I. tell him the IRS to look into Jeffrey. He couldn't have made all that money and. spent all that money had had the.

lifestyle he did and be the crook that. he was and pay taxes. So if if he would do the things that he. did to those women and do the things. that he did to me. uh then anything is possible. I I believe and so the. you know if Al Capone got went to jail. for for ste for being a crook and tax. evasion it would be so obvious to me.

today that now that I know Jeffrey's a. crook and the things he did and the. people he was associated with there was. a lot of money and he got it from a lot. of people. I I can't believe that he had. time to really work cuz he was playing. so goddamn much and I never knew it. If it's my attorney or your attorney, I. don't I don't even know if you're I. would assume your attorney, but if you. had one and every time you talked to him.

and he said, "I'm in the office working. on your stuff." I don't think you'd run. over there to see whether he was working. on your stuff or believe that he wasn't. in the office. But the con was so ter. just crazy. I mean, I I I've searched my. memory and say, "Why didn't I pick up. clues?" And I think he would have tr he. could trick me all over again if I was, you know, if I was in that position of. trust with someone like that. Really. bad.

I think unbelievable stuff to me now. that I look back. Do you have any. recollection of having any form of. contact with him after 2008? >> Nothing. I'm positive that I had no con no con no. communication of any kind. I keep. repeating. from my point of view died. I didn't want to even think about it. >> Do you have any reflections as we close.

this conversation whether it's on your. relationship with Mr. Epstein or the. pain and suffering that he and his. accompllices inflicted on countless. victims and survivors largely with your. resources. Any reflections of any kind. on the entire topic? >> Objection assumes fact not in evidence. >> Well, I believe he had a lot of resources. beside mine. I think the only thing I said earlier.

was I think if you really if you. understand. I think you know I think he had in. hindsight multiple personalities. um incredibly smart which I didn't. really see. I mean, well, you can. bullshit Nobel laureates about physics. and university professors and physicians. and all the people that I've read about. I mean, if it was a movie, no one would. believe it. I mean, but.

what I read about him and the. connections is so and I think that the. perspective to understand it. would be. to understand. how. intelligent he was in his as a criminal. and all the things that he did. And. I mean, I I have trouble imagining how.

we could just do all the shit that he. did. Forget about work in in a 48 hour. day because it was always so busy with. my stuff. And then you find out all. these relationships. It's just a. mindboggling. And and some of it even today I I I I I. can't believe that it's so but I some of. this stuff I believe because I read. about it. I mean stuff I read yesterday. I go I can't pardon me I can't believe.

this. and and I think to understand it the. criminal activities. all this stuff. it it's like I hope you guys are really. good and I as I said earlier I I hope. you know probably the dismay of um of my. advisors to to give you an accurate. picture of how I am and how he was how I. perceived him. And. I mean diabolical isn't a big enough.

word. And I think I said early Bernie Maidoff. was a boy scout compared to Jeffrey. I mean you you if I just believe what I. read in the press about people that he. contacted that he university presidents. Gurgen my friend. I mean it's just. crazy. But but he was. beyond. perfect or good at at doing all the that. he did. It's just I I think it's um the.

rumor and innuendo that goes around me. is makes me very mad because I think I'm. a very straight arrow and a very. responsible person. I don't want to give. you a speech on my virtue, but I'm. comfortable in my own my own skin. And I. look at I say it's so preposterous to me. what he got away with so long with so. many people that I can't imagine how a. mind could do that and be robbing banks. It's it's.

crazy. Thank you. And then one last question. Uh I think your council has represented. to DOJ that your assets accounted for. virtually all of Mr. Epstein's wealth. Sounds like you don't agree with that. I don't I wouldn't know it, but I don't I really don't know what his. wealth is. But, you know, island, house, all that, lifestyle, buying people's. gifts, you know, and it would seem to me that.

having a good sense of how much money. now he probably stole from us or more. than that that we don't even know about. yet because it was disguised. Uh, I I I I think it's a vast I know if. if you said it to do all the things he. did and I know now I know he was if you. would a bank robber bank robbers don't. rob one bank that that was just there. there's more there and I can understand.

why people like myself who who were. robbed don't want to be mentioned. because they don't want to talk about it. they don't want to you know appear naive. or dumb Um, I mean, when I look in the. mirror, I know I see an honest person, but in this I was completely blind. >> Okay. >> Thank you. Go off record. >> Okay. During a break in the deposition, the members of Congress that were. questioning Wexner came out to give.

reporters an idea of what was going on. inside. Because to be clear, this video. deposition hadn't been released yet. >> It's clear that Mr. Mr. Wexter is trying. to downplay how close Jeffrey Epstein. and Mr. and Mr. Wexter actually were. And we should be very clear that there. would be no Epstein Island. There would. be no Epstein plane. There would be no. money to traffic women and girls. Mr. Epstein would not be the wealthy man he.

was. without the support of Les Wexter. I. think it's very important for us to note. at this moment. There's a significant. amount of questioning that has gone on, but I want to say one other thing and. then I'm going to turn it over. We are. committed. to ending this cover up. Right now, as. we speak, over 50% of the Epstein files. have not been released to the public and. to the Congress. The more this.

deposition goes on, the less less Wexner. knows about uh his relationship with. with Jeffrey Epstein. There was a deep trust between these two. men. There was a deep friendship there, not only in a business sense, but but. Les Wexner gave Epstein the ability to. handle his children's and his family's. money. So, at least that part of it, that part of it uh makes it hard to.

believe Les Wexner's testimony thus far. It may be it may be a question as to. whether Les Wexner. was involved in the crimes directly, but there is no question I in my mind. given the evidence so far. that Les Wexner knew about this and. failed to stop it. and gave Epstein license and the ability.

to commit these crimes. >> Yeah. So, it seems they're not buying. that there's so much that Wexner can't. recall when it seems that he was one of. the people that Epstein was closest with. for a large chunk of his life. Maybe for. now, many in Congress, they're still. calling for more of the Epstein files to. be released or unredacted. This is, by. the way, despite the DOJ's indication. that there's really nothing else to. provide. But I will tell you one thing, this story and what's in those files not.

going anywhere. And that's all we have. for you right now here on Sidebar. Everybody, thank you so much for joining. us. And as always, please subscribe on. YouTube, Apple Podcast, Spotify, wherever you should get your podcast. You can also check us out on NBC's. Peacock as well. If you want to follow. me, X Instagram, my NewsNation show, Jesse Weber live, Monday through Friday, 11:00 p.m. Eastern. I'll see you next. time, everybody.