Why You Are Stuck in an Endless Cycle of Dating! (And How to Fix it!)

Dating apps should be used like in the. same way that fast food is. I don't. think you should say never ever eat fast. food. People have these like black and. white views towards the dating apps. I. think they're great in moderation and. you need to be controlling the way you. use them. You can't just be on it. scrolling mindlessly. There's a time and. a place for dating apps and people. should use them like when they make. sense, when they can't be out there. socializing, when they're really busy. with work, but shouldn't be the only. tool in their in their tool shed. >> People are afraid to say like, I'm just. tired of them. People look at dating as.

this like on off switch. It's just like. a part of your life. Hang out with your. friends who are in relationships once a. month. Join a fitness class. Go out to. eat once a week without your phone. The. app we have to realize is a crutch. We. have to acknowledge who these. apps were created for and by because. they're not for you. Most people. listening are pretty social people. You. can do it. >> The number one health and wellness. podcast. Jay Shetty. Jay Shetty. The one. the only Jay Shetty.

Hey everyone, welcome back to On. Purpose, the place you come to become. happier, healthier, and more healed. I'm. so excited because today I get to invite. into the studio two people that I've had. the pleasure of getting to know over the. last few years. I've been on their show. like three times now and I always have. the best time with them. I felt like we. hit it off immediately and it's got more. fun every time. So it is an honor to. have them on the On Purpose studio. I'm. talking about Jared Freid and Jordana. Abraham, the hosts of the hit dating and. relationship podcast You Up. If you.

haven't subscribed already, make sure. you go and do that. They break down the. confusing, chaotic, and hilarious world. of modern dating, which I know all of. you need a lot of help with. Jared is a. stand-up comedian and writer. His work. has been featured on Netflix and Comedy. Central and Jordana is the co-founder of. Betches, a digital media brand with a. reach of over 40 million across. platforms and a leading voice on dating, self-development, and modern. relationships. Please welcome to On. Purpose, Jordana and Jared.

Great to be here. Thank you so much. Great to have you. >> guys. We're so excited. What an intro. Yeah, I mean, you do everything you do. everything right, you know, like I'm. just sitting here listening your intro. I'm like, man, he's nailing it. He's. just has it down. Like even when you. introduce the podcast like, this is the. podcast for, you know, you you tell. people what they're listening. I'm like, I feel like I'm in like a you know, a. class. >> real professional. >> Yeah, this is a pro. This is a pro. You. know, we we run the podcast. This is a. professional. >> a pro. Yeah, this is a pro. You guys are. pros. The tables have turned today. though. So, I get to I get to quiz you.

and make Jared feel uncomfortable. >> Right. That was always the That's always. my goal when you come on our show. I'm. like, how can I get Jay Shetty. >> mess with him a little bit. >> bit like and I love it. And you nail it. It's just always a surprise. I mean, He. always knows how to how to take your. annoying questions and turn them into. and own them. To own them and then you. turn them. I've said this to many. people. I just I don't want to take over. your show. I I I I I I I You are doing. that. I'm doing that right now and and. your audience is like, I hate this guy. He won't shut up. Let Jay do his thing.

But I have to say what a great guy you. are. I I I cuz I did this bit when you. came on the show where I was like, Jay, can you give pep talks to people who are. going through it? And then I read this. whole sad monologue About you. about my. life. And it wasn't me saying it was me. And I I but I I was joking but like, you. know, sometimes sad stories are meant to. be funny. And you took it and you were. like, you are enough. And then I texted. you later that day. You texted me first. Hey man, had a great time. And just. remember, you are enough. It's the.

sweetest text I have ever gotten in my. entire I want to make sure it's on. camera on podcast because I can't He's. like, this they're going to cut this. Get rid of that sappy Uh, let's. talk about dating. Yeah, I I just have. to say cuz I I I you know, sometimes you. listen to people and you go, what are. they like off camera? That's like the is. it truly the nicest text I've ever. gotten? Yeah. I'm going to send more of. them now. >> Please. I I It improved my whole day. Yeah, or month, whatever. I'm still. talking about it. >> The feeling's mutual. You guys have been. so kind to have me on three times. We.

have the best time ever. And and I and I. love the side of me you bring out. I. don't always get to show that. I don't. always get to show that fun, playful, energetic side on my platform. So, it's. that's a part of me that I get to share. with both of you. And so, you give me an. opportunity to do that. But, let's talk. >> You always are game. That's the thing. And I you know, we appreciate that so. much cuz some you know, we talk about. dating and relationships, which is like. a very personal thing, you know? So, it's. >> what we want to talk about today. Because my audience, community, I've got. groups of friends.

I've got so many people have written in. We've we've scoured the world to prepare. for this podcast. But, the first thing I. wanted to start off with is. dating. You guys know everything about. it. You're doing it, Jared. Jordana, you're not doing it anymore, but it's a. part of your life. What's your hot take. on current dating? Like, what's what's. the take? What's the viewpoint that you. think is surprising you right now that's. different right now on dating? I think. the negativity. that's out there right now, while it's.

founded, like you can always be negative. about dating and you'll find a million. people that will help you like. you'll find a million people that will. back you up and tell you how right you. are for being negative about it. But, it's the least helpful thing for. your dating life. And it's not the thing. that's going to get you on the first. date. It's not the thing that's going to. make you a better dater. It's the only. thing that you can find other people to. cheer you on for that actually makes. your dating life worse. Wow, that's a. good one. I like that. 100% agree. Cuz I. do these dating.

pep talks all the time. And I it's a. joke. It's a pointing out. why that I heard a relationship and I. heard this couple get in a fight. And. then I talk about how lucky you are to. be single. And I point that out and you see so many. people that are just like. it's almost like crazy to me that they. never thought of it. Like being single. is a good thing. You're hopeful. You're. looking for to make your life better, you know? And I think all you hear about. is. maybe that you're doing it wrong or do. this or do that and it's like whatever.

you're doing is fine. You're you. It's. going to work out. But I think the. negativity that we see online like. that's easy to do because it's like. biting a mosquito bite. It feels pretty. good, but it's not really helping you. That's a great perspective. I was just. talking to my one of my producers. She's. in a long-distance relationship and she. was saying every night she goes home. right now, she turns on her favorite. show and she just binge watches it. And. all of our reaction was like, "Oh, okay." And she was like, "I sit alone on. the couch." And she was like, "But. actually this is the last time I'm ever.

going to get to do this. So I'm loving. it." Like that mindset. of actually, "Oh, wow. Like this is the. last time ever it's just going to be me. on my couch binge watching whichever. show I want and looking at it positively. rather than the negative of that." And I. think that's You're so right. And I want. to dive into that, but I want to hear. Jordana's first. Yeah, I think going off. of that I think you know we talk about. like you know no one wants to hear diet. and exercise if if we're like you know. fitness or losing weight. But like I. think that I totally agree with Jared. I. think the diet and exercise of like. dating is really like going into.

anything you're doing in the dating. space with a good attitude and then. having a full life outside of dating so. it's not the only thing that you're. focused on because I do think attitude. is like 70% of it. Like I think it's. such an underrated part. I think so many. people think if I just keep going on. more dates more is more and I'm kind of. there, but I don't want to be there. I'm. in a negative mindset. I'm on the apps. still. I'm so annoyed. I'm still on the. apps. You become you you go on the dates and. you think you're actually trying, but.

you're you're bringing not like a a fun. exciting version of yourself that. someone would want to date someone with. a full life, someone who just thinks. someone would add to their already great. life and you're kind of expecting. someone to fill in what's missing and I. think that's really what holds people. back and they don't even realize they're. doing it. And when you're holding back, like more on that, just like when you're. holding back and you're being negative, like. you're you're not being your full self. So you're not even bringing people into. your world. Like you want and and like.

we're not we're not this like woo-woo. podcast. >> Yeah, I know. I know. We're not there. telling like there's nothing more. annoying than like cheer up from your. married friend. Oh, you'll find it when. you're not looking. It's like off, you know? Like that's not that's not. advice. That's not helpful. But it's. like the minute you give in to like I. got this great life. I'm looking for. someone to make it better. I'm not. looking for just anyone. Then you start to have taste, you know? And that's something where people are so.

afraid to even like admit. They go, I'm. confused. That's what you hear from. people dating. I'm confused. No, you're. turned off. Change the wording. Now it's powerful. Now you have taste. Now you have. ownership over like, oh, I do like and. dislike things. I am looking for certain. things in a partner. Like you know, living your full life. Like when you say. these are the things I do, you're. willing to have someone go, I don't do. that. And go and you can go, good. Get. out of here. Yeah. Yeah, I like that. So. let's apply that to. what everyone's saying right now where. there's this.

mass fatigue around dating apps. You. both hear it more than anyone. Of. course. Where every other person you. speak to is just like, I'm sick of the. uh dating apps. I'm tired of the dating. apps. I hear it all the time as well. How do you then apply that to the. fatigue around dating apps? So when. people are saying to you, hey, I'm. exhausted, you're not saying cheer up. What are What are you saying? I think I mean, I think dating apps. should be used like in the same way that. fast food is. Oh, interesting. Tell me. that. Tell me about that. >> think you should say never ever eat fast. food. You know, you know, it's going to. ruin your life. And I I think people.

have these like black and white views. towards the dating app. I think they're. great in moderation and you need to be. controlling the way you use them just. like anything else on the internet, just. like Instagram or TikTok. Like, you. can't just be on it scrolling. mindlessly. You can't just be on it. swiping mindlessly. I think there's a. time and a place for dating apps, and. people should use them like when they. make sense, when they can't be out there. socializing, when they're really busy. with work, but it shouldn't be the only. tool in their in their tool shed, because just like with fast food, if you. eat it all the time, you're going to. feel sick. You eat it on a road trip.

every now and then, that's fine. You're. like an indulgent having a great time, but like don't make that the only Make. that your entire lifestyle. Yeah, and we. have to like acknowledge that. Like, I. think people are afraid to say like, "I'm just tired of them.". Like, you hear that, but like if you. went to McDonald's every day, if you. went to fast food every day, and someone. was like, "Yeah, I've eaten. uh you know, fast food every day for the. last week. I'm tired of it." You would. go, "Yeah, you should take some time off. of that.". >> Yeah. Like, you would We wouldn't look. at that person go, "Well, you're not.

trying." Yeah. Like, people look at dating as a like. on-off switch. It's just like a part of. your life, and I don't know. It's just. it's we like right now I'm doing We. We've said on the podcast we're doing a. summer challenge. Okay. >> Okay. Here's the summer challenge. Delete the apps. >> And you're doing it, too? >> I'm doing it, too. I'm single. You're. deleting all the apps? >> Deleted all the apps, okay? This is for. June, July, August. >> And how many apps is that for you? It's. 17. No, I. I was on one app at the time.

Deleted it, okay? June, July, August, that's the promise. Okay. Okay. And. then, what's your plan? The plan is uh. hang out with your friends who are in. relationships once a month. Okay. Make. one plan a month with like Jordana and. her and her husband, my brother and his. wife. Make a plan with someone who's. married or in a relationship. Then, join a fitness class. Do something. different. Do a different fitness class, whatever it is. Go out to eat once a week uh every.

Wednesday without your phone. On your. own. Put on your own. Put in your. pocket. Put your phone in your pocket. Look up. Because we're kind of like. addicted to these things. Like the app. we have to realize is a crutch. It was. made by male nerds. to try and be social. If you think about it, the app you never. get dumped on an app. You never get broken up with. You never. hear a no. It's swipe left, that's a no from you. Swipe right, you either get a match. right away or you get nothing. And when. you get nothing, what does your brain.

go? Guess they haven't seen me yet. That was. invented by someone who didn't want to. go up to someone in public and. experience public failure. Oh, that's. good. So we have to acknowledge who. these. apps were created for and by. Because they're not for you. Most people. listening are pretty social people. You. can do it. But you but sometimes we need to like. create these little games like we're. doing with this like challenge to get. yourself out there because the phone is. so addictive. So like I go to dinner on. a Wednesday, I sit at the bar and I look.

up. That's it. I'm not promising you a. boyfriend. That's something going by the way. That's interesting. >> Great. Yeah. Great. I have. conversations. I have stories. I have. experiences. Hanging out with your. married friends, that is the that's the answer. Because. and I speak from the guy perspective on. the podcast like of course, but I'm like. I speak for myself. We talked about not. saying this anymore, but we said we're. not experts, okay? No one's a dating. expert. We are I'm just a expert in my. own feelings and my own experiences. So.

when I talk on the show, like I was. thinking of like we have so many women. who their response to like hang out with. their married friends is like they don't. know anybody. Mhm. They Oh, my friends'. husbands, they don't know any of their. friends. They don't they never have a. guy for me. It's like First of all, don't hang out with your married friends. to get something from it. Hang out with. your married friends to to hang with. them and have a good time and be you. Mhm. Okay? And if you do that, what you. want from that experience is for the. husband to go. Oh, yeah, Jessica's pretty cool.

That's all you want. Why does Coca-Cola. still have ads? So, you think of. Coca-Cola the first drink when you need. a soda. >> That's such a good point. >> Same thing. You want to make yourself. Coca-Cola to your to your married. friends because that husband does know. people. Yeah. He is talking. Yeah. But. he men we don't care about dating and. relationships. That's why men don't. listen to our podcast. You know, like Right now you have Aussie. Cola. Right. Right. Right. Right. They're going Oh, I guess I haven't. thought of them lately but when if you.

make yourself the first thought in their. brain when. cool chick. comes up cuz it's going to happen. But. that's the thing. So, when I hang out. with like my brother and his wife and. you know, I'm doing that with his wife. but in my bro you know, my brother's my. brother. But like you know, if I go hang. out with Jordana and her husband like. he's going to you know, he comes across. I'm the first thought on it Well, I have. we'll see. But I I think. >> he's thinking about every time. >> and these are like the things that don't.

go viral on the. you know, you know that. You know, negativity goes viral, salacious stories. go viral. Not hey, go out with your. married friends. Well, it's like it's. like loose ties, right? >> ties, right? Right, loose ties. Who do. we get that from? Um Meg something. Sorry. We can't remember her last name. Right. But we've we've we've you know, our podcast we've just collected all. these experiences that we hear the the. voices of so many people and how they're. going through it and I'm not doubting. that. Yeah. It's hard but it's that's.

also the fatigue element. Yeah. >> Dating apps just get you more. Not better, more. Mhm. >> more intros which are good. More. breakups, more more disappointment, you. know, more conversations. If you had. more conversations a day, you're going. to find more annoying people a day. So, of course you're going to have more. stories that are are negative. Yeah. So, that the fatigue is really. you know, the yeah, the numbers of it. all. >> Yeah, I can't remember the exact math, but Tim Ferriss had broken it down. He. was like, "For every 100 people, there's.

like five narcissists, one psychopath.". And so, when you have like a million. followers, you're going to have, you. know, the same percentage of. narcissists, psychopaths. And it's the. same on a dating app. If you Yeah. Like. I think I use uh Sweet'N Low in my. coffee. It's like the strongest. sweetener. And everyone's going to tell. me that I'm going to have have a heart. attack and I'm going to die. I'm I'm. okay with that. For for a sweeter coffee, I'm okay. But, it you know, dating apps are like. Sweet'N Low. Like, you're going to It's really going.

to hit you. Mhm. You know, going to a. bar and trying to meet someone new is. like putting sugar in your drink. It's. not going to You're only going to get a. You're going to need a lot more sugar. >> Yeah. But, it's going to It's going to. be a better quality drink. And then you. said this, it's like, "No, you don't. need a dating app in the summer." No. Right? You don't need it in the summer. >> Right. You were out in the summer. You're taking vacations in the summer. You're hanging with friends in the. summer. >> Yeah. Hence, you're doing the challenge. now. >> That's why I'm doing the challenge. I. mean So, what's the complete challenge? Lay it out again so that everyone else. can do it. >> dating challenge is delete the apps.

Just get off them. We'll We'll come back. in September. Yeah. >> Yes. Doesn't have to be forever. >> No, it doesn't have to be forever. >> can never eat McDonald's in the summer. It's the end of the season. Yeah. You. got to wait for the next season. >> Wait for the next season. Um and see how. it goes. We've tried the apps. You hate. them. Yeah. So. So, let's try something new. Uh go to. dinner once a week by yourself, phone in. pocket. Don't take out your phone. Make. it a challenge to yourself. Go to a new. fitness class. Mhm. Just because that. gets you out and active and doing. something new. Hang out with your. married friend and their husband,

married friend and their wife, once a. month. Make a plan. It doesn't have to. be a vacation. It doesn't have to be. anything crazy. Just hang out with them. Mhm. And have a good time. And I do. think the the feedback I'm going to give. is like, "If you come to me and go, 'Well, I didn't work.'". I think you've looked at it the wrong. way. Mhm. And we're on a wellness. podcast, we can think of the intrinsic. value of hanging out with your friends. I hope the listenership can understand. that because with dating some people go, "Well, where's my boyfriend?" And I go,

"You don't sound like someone I would. ever want to date.". Right. Well, then again, at the at the. end of the at the end of the um. challenge, you go back on the apps and. you're a more invigorated, more. energized version of yourself who's. Yeah, it's the fast food example which I. love. >> Who's not saying, "Hey," as their. opening line because you're more, you. know, you're you're putting more energy. into the interactions that you are. having. Yeah, I do that like once a. week. Like once once every 2 weeks, I have mentally been so disciplined and. focused on work, working out, eating.

right, all the rest of it, that I need a day where I don't care. And so, usually Saturday night is that. day. I have this There's this I have no. idea how this place I don't want to No, I don't want to get them sued, but I. don't know. I have no idea how this place exists. There's this place in LA called Mr. Charlie's. It is vegan McDonald's. If. you go outside, it looks like. McDonald's. They have an upside-down. frown, they have a smiley like. From the outside, it's yellow and red. Like it literally looks like McDonald's. I, as someone who grew up going to. McDonald's, but now I'm vegan and I.

don't eat uh meat, have been searching. for vegan McDonald's my whole life. I've. now found it. And the fries taste the. same, the chicken nuggets taste the. same, the the mayo tastes the same, the. lettuce tastes the same. So, Saturday, usually once every 2 weeks, I. will eat chicken nuggets, fries, burger, whatever it is. But it's that feeling of. like, come Monday morning, I'm. reinvigorated work out again. I'm. reinvigorated have my discipline again. because I've allowed my brain. this space to go there. Yes, and you. probably enjoy it so much more than if.

you had it If you had it every day, you. wouldn't feel great. Right. >> One thing I've been getting a lot. though, and this kind of comes from the. point that Jared was talking about. Right now, I have so many single. female friends. that I think are amazing. Yes. >> That I'd love to introduce to good men. And now I'm It's hitting me right now. that I've not thought of Jared before. So now I need to Now I need to. Now I need to change that up and Jared. I've got. I'm like you weren't a friend of mine.

You weren't going to go out with her for. me. I I I've messed up. Yeah. But I feel. like I have. at least let me think. I have at least three to five. female friends Yes. >> Who I think are awesome. Like genuinely. think are awesome. They're They're the. Oh yeah, she's really cool. >> Mhm. Like they're smart, they're. thoughtful, they're beautiful, all the. rest of it. And I actually struggle to think of. single men I know and and that's not I'm. not saying that they're not good men out. there. I'm saying I don't know many.

single men. As a married man I think. most of my friends are married or in. long-term committed relationships. And they're just struggling out there as. well. What are you seeing from a woman's. perspective because to a lot of them. what they're experiencing is we're. strong, confident, ambitious women. and a lot of men are intimidated by. that. Yes. I think this is a. conversation where I'm seeing all over. the place now. I think it's like a very. feels like a very hot hot topic now to. to kind of look at the available single. women. I totally agree with you. I know.

so many amazing single women. I really. don't know that many. I only know one. amazing single guy. Um No, I I really don't know that that. many. um otherwise and I do think part of it. is women are much more likely to want to. date men who are of the same education. level as as them or higher or make the. same amount of money of them as higher. or higher and I think men are not. necessarily looking for that. So I think. there's a bigger pool for men of women. that they'd be interested in. So I do. think women I don't want to I don't like. the term dating up or dating you know,

but I think like when you just look at. objective things like education or money. a lot of women don't want to date people. who are less educated or have less money. than them. To to to add on to this, I'm. sorry to interrupt. The men go by one. thing. Am I attracted? Yeah. That's it. That's the checklist. >> Right. Well, that that allows that that. means that could be. that that's infinite. Mhm. Right. What. you're talking about is a checklist that. women do. Are they safe? Are they. educated? Are they Do they have the. ability like Are they a hard worker? Are.

they good dad? These are all things that. they're thinking about like even on the. apps. >> there's right. And there's fewer, I. think, men who meet that criteria for. women who are maybe I don't want to say. more selective, but are just looking at. things in a different way. And I think. as opposed to how things were 20 or 50. years ago, more women are college. educated than men. Women are making more. money than they ever have before. And. so, I think the the pool, especially as. you get older, of men who are at your. level or higher, if that's what you're. looking for in terms of like those. things, is just smaller. So, I think it.

just becomes like a numbers game. And I. don't know if the solution is for people. to be more open-minded or if the. solution is, you know what I mean? Or. cuz I think there's still a little bit. of a double standard around a man who. makes less money than his wife or a men. a man that's has less education than his. wife. So, I think that. I mean, I would hope that as the times. change, people are a little bit more. open-minded in both directions. Yeah. And I think also like we do this all the. time. We We've talked about this. Where. are the single men? And like you just.

said it. I've said this a million times. I don't know. Even as a single man. Like. I I don't know if there's a single guy. for you. I don't even know where they. would be. Like I I actually it's become. like kind of a joke on the show of like. where are these guys? Because if there's. all these women, but also this dating. and relationships is a topic for women. They get together to talk about this. This is something that men just don't. generally get it together and talk. about. So, it might not be as. you know, in the atmosphere for me. >> to that level, right. It's I think.

dating and relationships seems more like. a priority for a lot of women just. societally they've been told that that's. something they should be thinking about. from. you know, 21 years old is like what. their future is and what and who their. husband's going to be and what they're. going I don't think men are given that. pressure. If a man goes home for the. holidays, he's asked about his job. He's. asked about what's going on at at at. work. He's not necessarily most of the. time being asked about who he's dating. I think that's a question that women are. getting a lot more and that they're much. more invested in finding a partner than. a lot of men are around at least men in.

a similar age group. I hate when. someone's trying to game the app. So, if. someone matches with me and they go, "Let's skip the small talk and go on a. date." I don't want to date that person. We think being attractive means being. attractive to everyone. Right. Right. We. only feel hot if everyone thinks we're. hot. And the reality is not everyone's. going to find you attractive. Sometimes. you just don't comment things the same. way and that's really the source of most. conflict in relationships is just having. a totally different framework for how.

you see the world or how you would see a. specific instance and a lot of the times. men and women are thinking about things. really differently. One thing I've been. reflecting on lately is how even the. smallest choices can create a big impact. over time. Whether it's choosing to. spend a quiet night in to recharge or. making a decision that brings you closer. to a long-term goal. Those moments of intention really. matter. And when it comes to the choices we make. with our money, that same mindset. applies. I've learned that saving for.

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a good neighbor, State Farm is there. Prices are based on rating plans that. vary by state, coverage options as. selected by the customer, availability, amount of discounts and savings, and. eligibility vary by state. So, wait, Jared, you're saying you don't have lots. of single guy friends? >> No, that not at all. That's the thing, like I'm not rolling with a group. Like. when you hear a woman get broken up. with, like the first thing that like a. lot of their friends do, they're like, "I know these other single women." Like. they'll try and like fix them up with.

single women to go out with. They're. like their new Miranda crew, you know, Samantha. crew. I've never even heard of that for. a guy. Like, "Oh, you got to meet my. other guy friend." And even you were. like, "Hey, cuz I moved to Delray Beach. I'm in Florida." And And Jordana was. like, "Oh, my friends live down there. Do you want to like hang out with a new. friend?" Right, "Do you want to be my. friend?" I was like, "No, I don't want a. friend. I want to go be lonely at a. coffee shop and look at the sun." You. know, like I You know, like I don't want. like And it's weird cuz that's my.

initial reaction. Of course I want. friends, but like Where are all the. friendless men? But I have friends, but I swear, I got. friends. You know, like I sound very. defensive. I am, but like I I don't. know, like I've thought about this. Like. it is the one thing where I'm like, "The. numbers aren't this off." Yeah. But I. don't know cuz I even like my college. friends, mostly married, you know, couple divorces in there. High. school friends, I got a lot of those. still, mostly married. >> Yeah. But I don't really, you know, I'm 40,

I'm single, and we just. we just don't hear from, you know, like. you know, that I I I know I'm not alone. Yeah, yeah, yeah, I know. I was I was. talking to a couple of guys I know who. are probably, yeah, late 30s, early 40s. as well. And they were single, and I. sent them a couple of. pictures of certain girls that I know. that are friends of mine that are. looking, and you know, all that kind of. stuff. And it was like immediately it. was the point that you said immediately. he was like, "Nah, she's not, you know.". Not for me. >> Not for me. And it was an attraction.

thing. But it was so like instant. Right. Whereas a woman will say like tell me. more about him. Right. Yeah. And it was. also like I wouldn't necessarily say. that. he was out of her league. He just felt. he had more choice. >> Listen, let me Well, I I'll I'll go back. and tell. Things to unpack. because I don't think. that's why men are saying I have all. these choices. Like I I think that's. something that's easy to like put on. single men to like hate on them. >> No, so I'm asking you. I I I would say.

that I mean I've said this on the show. many like guys. there's a pro and con. There's there's. life is gravity, right? The the the the the thing is a guy will. not go out with you unless he's. attracted to That's just No. No other. questions. Just like your friend. >> black and white? It's that black and. white. I'm saying attracted or not or is. it like. she's I don't know. No, there's it is. Men are like beasts. We see the we see. the outline of a woman. We go. Yeah. Like the idea of like, "Will it.

matter if I wear, you know, these types. of socks?" No, men don't even notice. We. just see I'm I'm attracted to that. thing. And so like when when a guy says he's. like. not attracted and not going, that's. that's a good thing cuz you're not on a. All women can understand that if you're. on a date with a guy, if he left the. house, you know one thing, he's attracted to. you. Mhm. That's a beautiful thing too. if you think of it that way. You go, "I. got one thing out of the way. If I'm on. a date with a girl, I don't know why. she's there. I don't know if she was forced, she. thought she should, if she didn't go.

she's not trying." That's a great way of. looking at it. >> Right? You know, like I don't know. Like. I. I don't know if we I could get married. to a woman and then on our wedding day. she's like, "At first I didn't think he. was anything.". I wasn't even. >> You're You have a You can get a foot in. the door. >> Right. Well, it's nice and it's bad. Like I don't want to hear that my wife. at first was like, "Oh.". You know? Like, but that happens. You. know, look look at all the our story. page for all these women getting. married. It's Well, at first I wasn't. into him, and then he came over to me, and he touched me with his clammy hands,

and then I was like, "Oh, I guess maybe. I'll go on a date." Like, it's all this. like horrific tale about how this guy. like Magoo'd his way into this woman. And it's like that's nice for her. That's a fun. marvel, you know, story to tell like. your your you know, your beginning, but. like. >> Well, I think women are also more like, I can work with this. Even if someone is. not I think women are more open to. dating men who aren't exactly the. perfect way that they want them to be as. soon as they meet them. >> like, I can change what they wear, and I. can. >> Well, yeah, they're you know, they can.

Yeah, they can. They can work They can work with this, or they cannot. I don't think men are. thinking that. And in some ways that. makes men more romantic. They're like, I'm not even If I don't like you just as. you are, I'm not going to commit to you. And women are like, if I like the bones. I can work with them. >> Well, it's it's that age-old idea of men. don't want women to change. Right. >> But they will. And women want men to. change, but they won't. >> Exactly. >> Right? Like, it's that balance of like. Right, men are just I mean, like, we. always hear about like the Disney. princess or like how the Disney Disney.

movies convince women they're going to. find a prince charming, and that is very. true. There's a male version of that, you know, where men have been told in. every coming-of-age movie that this this. woman is just going to show up, and. she's into video games, and she's cool, and she gets it. Every coming-of-age. movie is some chick who's like uh like. given guys crap, and like she's like. this dream Yeah. version, and you're. kind of told and this guy falls in love.

So, you're kind of told that like. someone's going to come along there all. of a sudden you're going to get it. Yeah. >> And you're going to want this monogamous. lifestyle. And you You. I don't think either is fair. Yeah. You. know, and but the looks thing it it's. everyone has a type. Everyone's into. something. Every There's a butt for. every seat. I mean, I always say this. sounds gross, but like everyone's. someone's foot. Like there's men out. there masturbating to feet. You know, and they There were so many. men masturbating to feet that there's a.

hyperlink on the porn sites that take. you directly to feet. So But that's why it is you are. someone's foot. So ugly is not even like. hot or attractive is not even a thing. >> Right, but I'm saying that. I don't. think think that it's Yeah, it's not. like I don't think the key to doing well. in dating is being hot. I think it is. really about your attitude and like. again, how happy you are. I think a. happy person and like a again, there's. going to No matter what you look like, there's going to be someone who's. attracted to you. But I think if you are. If someone's Someone could be attracted. to you physically and you could go on. the date and you bring a bad attitude.

and you seem unhappy with your life and. you seem unhappy and you seem like. you're burnt out just from being there. and your feeling is like he's not Oh, he's not even going to text me again. Like I think that that is. self-sabotaging. But you feel that. Like. as I Listen, Jordana took my disgusting. speech and made it sound a lot better. I I It is um you feel that on a date. I. go out on a lot of I've been on dates. with women who are like the I've had it. woman. Like And then you got to like. turn into a clown. You got to be like, "No, I got you got you got your got your.

ear. Like got your nose. Like you have. to like try and make them cheer them up. a little bit to like go, "Hey, we're. going to be on a date that's not going. to be disgusting and horrible.". >> Yeah. You know, so you can feel when. someone's like. I've seen it all. Yeah. And it's hard to. get. >> And even if you feel you have, the point. is to have the attitude that you're. talking about. Even if you have been. everywhere. >> tell someone to do that. Like we can. talk about it for days, but like. you you got to figure that out. >> Well, I think I think the challenge is. going back to the part about being. attractive, we think being attractive.

means being attractive to everyone. Right. Right, we only feel hot if. everyone thinks we're hot. And the. reality is no one feels that way because. not everyone's going to find you. attractive, no matter how where wherever. you are on the spectrum of it or however. you feel about it, it's the fact that if. someone can go out there, be confident, put the best version of themselves out. there, you're giving the person who. actually finds you attractive the chance. to do that. We've all met people who are. attractive that turned us off with their. attitude. Totally. >> like massive.

>> And I think we've met people like we're. like maybe borderline attracted to, but. are seem so happy and so confident and. so happy to be there um that it makes. them more attractive. I think that. there's really like you can't really. quantify that, but it definitely I'm. sure it could sway you, too. Like. someone who you're. Attitude because attitude is everything. I mean like you get there and you're. like oh my god again to go back to like. the. you know, the the coming-of-age movie, the the the chick who gets it. You know, you go. oh my god, and she's cool and is fun and. is like, you know, you go oh my god,

everything's here as opposed to being on. a date where it's like, okay, you know, show me you're not a dick. Yeah. Right. >> like, okay, I've I've seen this before. You know, like. I'm not going to be the one that because. what happens is if someone's miserable. on a date, you're like, if I do make. this person happier, now I've made. promises to them. Mhm. You know, now. I've, you know, love bombed them or like. and not even, I'm not saying you do that. to cheer them up, but you go. now you've like put on a performance. myself. Like I'm performing. Yeah. I'm.

not even getting to be the real me here. because I was just spending the whole. time trying to get this person to be. happy. And now I've faked it. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. >> You know? >> I'm just going to say I think that also. that attitude thing also helps you once. you're in a relationship. I think. everyone thinks like, okay, once I like. lock it down, then it's over, but. relationships are their own level of. work, and I think the best relationship. advice I've ever seen is that if you. look for what's missing from your. partner, if you look for what they're. not doing, what they could be doing more. of, that's like they're going to be the. reality that you're living in. If you're.

looking at what they're doing well, what. they do better than everyone else, like. you're going to feel really lucky and. you're going to feel really happy. So, I. think attitude just brings you not even. when you're single, but once you're like. in the relationship, once you're like. working through that, once you're. changing into a relationship that's a. long-term marriage or just a long-term. relationship, I think that's the. attitude is something you really need to. keep working on and always be trying to. be in a place of looking for what's. working and looking for what's good, whether it's your own life or your. partner. Yeah, I think this alpha male,

high-value woman conversation on Tik. Tok, Instagram, podcast has put this. pressure for women to think you've got. to look like a model, you've got to look great in these. clothes, without clothes, whatever, right? There's that pressure for women. And the pressure on men is you better be. earning multiple six figures, you better. drive an amazing car, you better have a. great future. And everyone's looking at. both of those things going, I can't live. up to either of them. Right. >> Right. Do you see that or Well, the. beauty of being a man is that I don't.

think I and this is. where I feel lucky is that. when it comes to dating. maybe I'm not making that money, but I. can I don't think I have to like do the. right thing by other men. Like I never. feel judged by other men for how I date. >> Mhm. And I think when we hear from women. that are dating, they're always. wondering. am I doing it right? Is this the right. text? Is this the right way to go? And. it's almost like who are you asking? Who's to say? And I think when it comes.

to those conversations of like, you. know, who we answer to, like I'm I don't. feel the pressure with relationships. You know, I can feel it from the other. side of like. hey, what should I wear for a first. date? You know, like when we get that. question, like they're asking us as if. we know what we're talking. You know, like and it's like what should. we wear for the date? And. >> What do you say? Whatever makes you feel. comfortable and confident. Mhm. And. that's again to what Jordan Peterson. diet and exercise of answers. Like no. one wants to hear that. Yeah. Well, but you have women that write in about.

this and you're like. that comes from a place of like, please. tell me I'm doing this right. >> want rules, I think. People want like. the secret sauce, the formula. And. really it's about you and what works for. you. And that's again like a less flashy. Yeah. answer, but that's that's the. truth. There's no one way that everyone. should act. There's no one kind of. person that everyone should be. interested in. It's like about what. makes you the best version of yourself. and everyone is a different person. Every time I hear someone say the phrase. high value,

I'm like that person is screwed. >> Awful, yeah. They're awful and screwed. They're thinking of the wrong thing. They're thinking of the internet, I. think. And that's that's the issue I. think with modern dating modern and it's. why it's so hard to sort of like. appreciate the things about your partner. that you really love because you're. seeing you're scrolling all the time and. you're seeing someone else's partner. you I think of the Pookie and Jett. thing. Like someone else's partner. surprised them with this bag or someone. else's partner is taking them on these. crazy dates and it's and you look at. your partner and you're like, where's my. crazy date? Where's my like spontaneous.

surprise trip? And I think that again, you're not even thinking about if that's. even something I want, is that even. something that like works for me? You're. just constantly comparing and before you. really didn't get that. You didn't get. like the behind the scenes of every. single couple's highlights of like the. best moments that they have together. No. one's putting their fights up. No one's. putting the like stupid argument that. they had before bed on the internet. So. you're not seeing what's not working for. other people until you see the divorce. post and then you kind of kind of get go. through the back. That's so true.

Yeah, it's like it's almost like 25. years ago you spoke to less people. Right. >> And today you're exposed to more people, but you know them in a really shallow. surface way. >> Right. And so if you had four friends, you knew who was on the verge of. divorce, who was having a tough time. because you all opened up and you were. helping each other out with their. problems. Whereas today, you're seeing. someone who just took that trip for. content. Like it wasn't even It wasn't. even a trip. It was content, and they. went away, and they got this sponsored.

trip, and now it's like, "Oh, well, that. husband does spontaneous stuff," or. whatever it may be. >> Right. And then you think there's. something lacking in your relationship. when there's not. You're only Again, you're only seeing this one side of it, and you don't really know these these. people that well. You talked about. messaging there, and people asking you. what messages should we write. How much. are you hearing about people getting. ChatGPT to write their messages back, and how How are you both feeling about. More and more. It's cra- It's It's funny. because again, this goes back to I want. to be right. I don't want to do this wrong. So, let. me go to ChatGPT,

and it will tell me an answer that I. don't have to think about anymore. Well, listen, I think that there's some merit. in ChatGPT and helping as a tool, like. anything else. Like I don't think if you. I don't think you should use it, not. even read it, and send it. But I think. it's like We did a an episode where we. did First, someone writes in their. breakup text. They're texting someone. after three dates to say they're not. interested. And then we have ChatGPT. write the same text. ChatGPT's is. better. >> Not a bad job. Yeah. It It did It did a. It's a little more mature. It's a little. Well, it's as as personal? Probably not.

I think you should edit their thing, but. I think if it can help people act like a. nicer, better member of society, or at. least give them somewhere to start, I'm. okay with it. You're a fan of it for. breakups. I wouldn't want to be told to. ask for a divorce with ChatGPT, but I. think, you know, if they wrote the first. draft, and then someone else edited it, I mean Well, the thing we have to admit. to is that we've been doing a version of. ChatGPT from the minute dating apps. started. Listen, when you're texting, you are writing your own script. You are.

being the person you would like to be. That's not you on the fly. That's not. you on improv or in the moment. How many. times have you been in a conversation or. an argument, and then you went home, and. you go, "I wish I said that. I wish I. had said this." You never do that about. a text. Text, you go You say exactly how. you want to say it. Yeah. The way you. want to say it. The reality is in what. our podcast, we always say we want to. make you a better buyer. We're not going. to fix dating. I get put in the position. of speaking for men and it sounds very. icky. I'm letting you know exactly what.

a man is feeling cuz I'm 10% away from. the guy you're dating. Mhm. So, I'm. telling you what's going on in his head. It's up to you to like take that. information and do the best you can and. waste less time. Yeah. >> So, this goes to like the texting and chat. GPT and like listen, if if you want to. blame chat GPT for your relationship. problems, you're. It's just the truth because right now. you're texting with someone who's. Googling the movie that you said you. loved. Yeah, or the quote that you said.

that they didn't fully understand. >> Right. They're They've been doing that. since day one. Send me a movie quote. that makes you laugh every time. If you. had none off the top of your head, but. you thought they were hot, I'll go find. a movie quote. You know, like that's. just the that's just how it's going, you. know? So, all this is to say like chat. GPT or someone Googling what to text. you, you got to get in person. Right. Well, You got to have a date. It's like. the same the same advice that we have. for the apps. It's like the apps and. chat GPT, they're both tools. Should you.

be exclusively communicating with chat. GPT? Should you be exclusively only. dating on the apps? No. Is it something. you can use when it makes sense? Yeah. Right. >> Or at least to help. How quickly have. you realistically seen people move from. the apps to an in-person date? How quick. do you like it to be and how quick is it. realistically? I hate when someone's. trying to game the app. So, if someone. matches with me and they go, "Let's skip. the small talk and go on a date." I. don't want to date that person. That's. my Because? Because I don't want to waste my time.

out We're on a dating app because that. gets you the. first few conversations that make you. excited for the date. Yeah. You're. trying to verify that. Right, it's a. verifying process. But when people say. that I'm like, "What's the catch here?". Mhm. This was so easy for you to go out. How much time How much do you value your. day? You don't value your day? Why would I. want to go out with you? But the problem. is someone always is going to come in. and go, "Well, I hate pen pals." Yeah. But that's not a good answer. That's the.

the answer is nuanced and gray. If you're texting for 6 days. before a plan is made, yeah, that's a. lot long that's too long for me. >> long for you, right? >> But like I don't know what someone needs. to feel safe. >> Mhm. I don't know what someone needs to. feel excited. You should feel safe and. excited. That's That's the two rules I. would give to someone to go on a first. date. Mhm. Do you feel safe? Are you. excited? Yeah. And so however long that. takes. >> How How long does that take? That's. That's That's not up to me to say.

>> saw you and felt safe and excited in. that moment. >> Right. Or they wanted to screw me over. and steal my you know my identity. And. you felt safe and excited but I didn't. And you pay for my oil change. We've. gotten that. You know on a Really? We've. gotten messages where you know the the. guy says, "I'm so excited to you know I. had a such a great time. I'd love to go. out again." And then the woman replies, "Me too. Would you mind paying for my. oil change?" Right. You're going to meet crazies. You know. like this This is what happens. You put.

yourself out there. You got to play in. traffic if you don't want to get hit. And sometimes you get hit by a weirdo. Wow. Yeah, you know. So it But that's a. good story. You know you've lived. Right. Exactly. So you can live to tell. the tale. Yeah, it's a great story to. tell. But dating, the idea of like when. should you how should you? We are not. here to say. Like I I think that if. anyone's trying to tell you their four. rules for dating or you know you should. never this, I think they're trying to. sell a book. You know we did this to. make light and have fun about a subject. that dating for some people it's they're.

killing it everywhere else and this is. the hardest thing in their life. That's. crazy. And I when I first started. talking about dating like as a guy, I. didn't realize the gravity of it for. some people. For me it was always fun. And I mean that should tell every woman. out there like every guy is like. they just think it's fun. They don't. think it's the most like it's as serious. as maybe you're coming at it. This isn't. every conversation they're having. This. isn't podcast they're listening to. So, again, like when I first started doing. this you go, "Oh, this is like.

hilarious. Like, oh, let me hear your. dating problems." And then you start. meeting people and you're like, "Oh. like this is like. real stuff." Yeah. You know, like it is. they're doing great in their career, their friends, their family, and then. they're like, "What what the what's going on here? How. is this happening?" Yeah. Jordana, how. are you feeling about Jared's dating. life? I don't know what to. >> you'd say. Yeah, what is What's my. problem? As his friend. No, no, maybe. not a problem. Jared, I mean like a lot. of the men out there that that we talked. about earlier like has a lot of options.

And sometimes I think that's almost like. a lot of the issue with today's dating. world just men and women. Yeah, especially for men who aren't. >> Successful men. Right, successful high. high value men. No, I'm joking. But like I'm not. But. I'd like to be doing better. Please. follow me on Instagram. I'd like to be. doing better, yeah. >> No, I think I mean I I think people. don't want to talk about this cuz it. feels icky and it feels unfair, but I. think that women are a lot of the time. they're constrained by one societal. norms of that they should be they're. more pressured to settle down earlier,

and two biological realities is that and. that the older you are as a woman the. harder it is to have children. And so I. think that there's. there is a freedom that men have where. they're not constantly thinking about. dating against that that time frame. And. again, it feels like an icky. conversation. It feels like something. that shouldn't be true, but it is true. So, I think that men do have more. options and in a lot of ways especially. if you're like doing well in your career. and you're and you're in a city like New. York, let's say. And so I think that.

sometimes you can be a little paralyzed. by choice. And men will end things. before the next step. You know, men will. go, "This is okay, but I don't know if I want to go through. the work Like I I'll say men, me. I'll. speak for myself. I have ended things before the next step. cuz I'm like, "Is this the next place of Like am I. ready for this next phase of life?" It's. not about the relationship. It's about, "Do I want to do the work? Do I want the. responsibility?" And I have a lot of.

envy and high regard for people in. serious relationships. Like that takes a. lot of confidence. It takes a lot of. like uh stress and work that I have gone. against. I've said, "Well, I'm going to. put my life into, you know, stand-up and. comedy and, you know, my work.". Which is a easy excuse for me. Yeah. I. also It's my avoidance of like this next. thing of life that. first few months of dating, you can be. you're all potential. You know, you get past that, you're.

living in the reality of who you are. And like I think that's what a lot of. men deal with is like. I'd rather be potential than. the reality and deal with the reality. >> the reality or is it then then. commitment? Commitment is reality. I. like commitment like I I I think it's. commitment to like the broader thing. Like to me, when I think of like the. next step in relationship, I'm like it's. everything. It's house, it's. family, it's kids. You know, like it. gets way farther ahead than maybe women.

think we're thinking. I hear you on. that. Like that resonates with me. It's. one of the reasons why we haven't had. kids yet. Was because I was excited to. be with my wife, to get married, Right. but. my career took over, and then my wife's. career took over, and that was So, it's. weird how you can have that different. phases. So, I can relate to what you're. saying on the children level where like. I want to have kids, for sure. But I mean, we've been together now been. 12 years and married for nine. And for. me, the focus was I'm getting to build.

and I'm doing what I love. And I don't. want to end up feeling like I'm not. paying attention to this young, beautiful child that I brought into the. world. >> Right. And I'll And I'll do it when I. can. And I feel like that's a very feels. like a very masculine trait. And so. you're you're feeling the same I can. like the way you're talking I'm like I. can relate to everything you're saying. It's just I'm married. That's That's the. only I've taken on that commitment. I. feel good about that one. And we're. around the same age, and I think like. there's good and bad everything as we. said before. >> Yeah. Like our parents like that may have. gotten married young, you go, well, I.

would never do that for me. And they had kids young. And then we. kind of were given the ability to like. push those things off. >> Yeah. And again, there's positive to that. You. get to build your career. But then you. give it get so precious with. your life that you're like almost. you become too picky, too choosy, too. >> Totally. too precious with doing walking. forward. And uh what a lot of men will do, like. women will break up after they've tried.

again and again. Mhm. Yeah. Men will. break up before the next step, and. that's why a lot of men have the one. that got away. I don't You don't hear. from women with the one that got away a. lot. You hear from men, oh, I could have. been married to her. I could have been. married to her. We I I've said that. about many people I've dated. And that's why it's like. you know, it's funny when you see these. TikToks that are so angry and so the. negativity I talked about in the. beginning. It's not as personal as it looks the way. they're talking about it, even though. it's personal to them. Like I know it from the male side.

It's never been that someone's not worth. it or not enough or not, you know, someone that I could have been with. It. was always my own. I was thinking in, you know, I I there's. a Tony Kornheiser's a writer he I've. heard him say this line, the key of me. We all live in the key of me. You know, when you write a story, you write it. about yourself. So it's like I think. what a lot of men are going through is. the key of me and it's not as personal. to the women that are feeling like okay. I have so much choice or they're Or I. wasn't in love. He thought he could do. better. >> he could do better. It's all That is.

always fraudulent to me. I've never. heard it that well articulated. I mean. That's really interesting to hear. >> I'm saying I'm a I'm a well articulated. person. My mom says that all the time. but no. No, I mean that. I mean that. I don't. think I've heard it put that way before. and and I can resonate with it so. strongly at different ways in my life. Right. I I think right it's a very It's. an ideology that I get. Yeah, and it's. for all levels of life. I mean you talk. about kids, you know like Yeah, that's. what I'm saying. It's I think that's. just a man's mind is like Yeah, if you. talk to me about kids at 30, I would.

have been so scared. Right. Like I would. have just be like oh my god I don't. think I could be a dad. Right? Like. that's how I genuinely felt. Like. whereas now I'm 37 I was like I think. about kids a lot. Right. >> That's just a shift that I've been. through. Right. >> own mind, you know, where. at one point if you asked me I would. have been like ah I'd be fine without. them. And now it's like it's a part of. something that I want and it's such a. whether it's age, maturity, biology, finances, I don't know, but there is a. sense of that feeling of yeah it's not. really about the other person. I've.

always known my wife would be a maker. amazing mom. That's like. >> Of course. >> the conversation. >> Well, we get so many emails that are. like he ended it and I wasn't looking to. marry get married. That's always the. response. Women write in and I I wasn't. It's not like I said I wanted to get. married and it's like it's really. you know, kind of like demeaning towards. the men they're dating because a lot of. women don't think that men have the. emotional intelligence to like think. that far ahead. I don't know if it's.

demeaning. I think women are like why. don't you just give this a chance? Right. >> we see where it can go and we don't have. to get like Yes. Why don't we like a. woman who's dating a man for 3 months. say. and he'll he'll break up before they're. like in a relationship and I think. there's this frustration of like I'm not. asking you to marry me right to commit. to forever right now, but why can't you. keep dating me or like really really. fully commit? I guess it's demeaning to. both sides. He's thinking way far ahead. Right. >> Way farther ahead than she would even.

imagine. And he's also not trusting her to be. able to be told that like he's ending. it. Mhm. You know, I I I'm going to. >> be okay if if they date for 3 years and. then don't get married. Right. Yeah. And. I I so we're both not. >> other enough credit basically. >> Right. We're not giving each other. enough credit that Oh, wait, he's. actually thinking 25 years from now. Right. And we're not trusting that she's. confident enough to like handle a break. to handle a breakup in 5 years. Again, both sides of that equation I feel bad.

for. Like if someone got dumped after 5. years and never got married, thought. they were, I'd be like, yeah, that. sucks. Right. But she But women have. agency, too, and I think you see a lot. of those stories and you don't get the. other side, which is also that like. yeah, if you're dating someone for 5. years and you've been looking to get. married and they and and they're not. marrying you, you can leave also at any. time. >> Right. That's the credit you're not. giving the woman. Right. Is that like if. you're not giving her what she wants, she can leave. Right. >> Yeah. Fair. Yeah. It's so it's so. interesting, right? Like what what. you're both doing, which I really.

appreciate, is it's almost like if we. were able to verbalize this stuff. to the person that we're talking to, Right. Much harder. It's so much harder, but it would transform everything. because you'd actually be able to hear. someone's heart. Like you'd you'd. actually be able to hear and go, wow, I. didn't realize you were even looking at. it from that really thoughtful. perspective. >> I I always have so much uh joy when a. couple says they listen to our podcast. together because I know what you're. saying is so true. This is all easy for. us to say from the sidelines. It is so.

easy for us to say, this is simple. Oh, I can give advice on everyone else's. relationship. I know exactly what I. should do. When I'm in it, I'm like I'm. I'm a bumbling idiot. But when I hear a. couple listens to our podcast together, I'm like, we're talking for them. Like, it's almost easier to listen than it is. to like put these into words. And I'm. like, man, they must be doing okay. Like, not to give ourselves too much. credit, but I I I don't even think it's. possible. >> Well, they're having these. conversations. And kind of like what we. said before is like I do think when. women break up with men, they're like,

"Please change. Please change. Please. change." And then they don't change, and. then finally they break up with them. And I think a lot of men are are maybe. more than women afraid to have a lot of. these conversations, and so are kind of. just like secretly thinking about like. if they should leave. And then women. always feel like they're blindsided. >> That's true. That's true. Yeah. Men have. been thinking about it for 6 months. before they do anything. Yes. And the. woman is like, "What do you mean?" And. you And you you've done all this work. perfect. Yeah. Because any woman that. breaks up with it with her boyfriend. will tell you, "And I kept asking him. not to stop getting drunk. And I kept. asking him to stop doing this and this.

and this." And he just wouldn't change. And I really wanted it to work. And you. just don't really hear that from men. when they're No. No. No. No. No. No. No. It just wasn't working. I had And And no. one ever asked me after a breakup, "What. What happened?" No one's ever Right. Jordana does. Um but, generally like my male friends. that are They're just like high-fiving. me on the way to a dating app. You know, like And if I had to explain what. happened, it would just sound like I. just gave up. You know, like which. isn't, you know, something I'm proud of, you know, but it's not something I ever.

have to really deal with. So, would you. say you're not looking for. a long-term committed loving. relationship? >> No, I am. That's the crazy thing. Wait, this Now you're going I. No, I I am, but I'm you know, I'm afraid. of it being What are you afraid about? If I was to be really honest about it, I'm afraid of making my choices someone. else's problem. Or are you afraid of. making the wrong choice? Right. Also. >> you make the wrong Well, you make the. wrong choice with the wrong person. Right. >> But, I do think I know my taste enough.

at this point to know who I get along. with. And again, like I think a lot of. guys I'm not a soulmate guy. I'm not a. soulmate either. Like you you I don't. think. I just think you can make it work with a. like a lot of people. >> with that. Um and but they all are very. similar types. Mhm. You know, similar. type of personality and and and thinking. and worldview, those types of things. But I I do think, you know, I blame. stand-up and doing comedy, you know, and. the career I chose, but that's not, you. know, that's not a really good reason.

But I do think the fear of like. you are someone else has Like I if I. fail, I fail on my own. Like that's. really easy for me. Like I can. sit at home and bury myself in it. I I. give a lot of credit to like. you're married and you're starting a. business or you're doing things and you. got kids that you got to like talk to. and they go, "What happened?" Yeah. You. know, the kids ask, "What happened?" Are. you kidding me? I I can't even imagine. What happened with the big deal?" You. know, "We didn't get it?" Like what do you say. to a kid? I don't know. It's uh scary.

And I think I think you you mentioned. something a lot that a lot of men feel. but maybe don't articulate is that it is. much more Like their ability to commit. is a lot more tied to how secure they. feel financially, how secure they feel. in their careers. I don't think I think. it's I'm obviously women care about. their careers and how they're doing. financially, but I don't think I think. most women will say I can date in any. phase of my career trajectory. I don't. need to be established in order to get. married. I don't need to be established. in order to to have children. I think. men are much more like I cannot fully go.

there unless I feel like I could take. care of a family. >> Right. And if we go back to that. high-value douchy conversation, like. what makes a guy high-value is like. career established, safe providing. >> providing, yeah. You know, like and. doing okay. I think that that's why we. talk about dating as vulnerably and as. honestly That's what this is right now. It feels good, yeah. >> And I think people listening like when. we talk about dating is like I like when. I hear. people just say, "Oh, good. Like I'm not. sitting here alone.".

>> Yeah. Yeah. >> dealing with that. But like no, I. long-term relationship, yeah, I'm. looking for that, but I'm also like. I feel a little delusional even saying. that. I was in Australia with I just did. shows in Australia, and I went to the. Great Barrier Reef. I did like the. snorkeling at the I'm not a snorkeler. I. don't know. I was just like I They were. like, "Do you want to go snorkeling at. the Great Barrier Reef?" And I'm like, "How am I going to say no to that?". Like, I'm. No, I'd like to sit at the hotel and sit. on my phone. Like, I can't I have to do. this. This is so on my list. item. So, I took a boat like an hour. away, and we got to the reef, and I.

started snorkeling in the the mask kept. coming off my face, and I was like. miserable. Then they give you all this. like lube, and they say put it on your. face. So, now I got all this Vaseline. They give you all the Vaseline. And they. put it on the face, and I finally get. the thing on, and I start looking at the. fish, and I remember thinking like 10. minutes into this, I'm going, "Is this. it? This is the Great Barrier Reef?" And. then I'm like thinking is but I'm by. myself, and I'm like looking at this. reef, and I'm like, "Shouldn't I see a shark or some turtle. eat something?" You know, like, I And. then we got on the back of the boat, and.

I was just sitting alone on the boat, and I'm like, "Man, I guess this is why people have. relationships." Like, Someone to go to. the Great Barrier Reef with. And say how. horrible it was. And go, "Man, that sucked, right?" Like, you just want to go, "Oh my god." Like, and I Again, I'm sure someone gets a lot. of value from seeing the Great Barrier. Reef. But, like, you know, again, like, this is old-school I'm not saying. I'm I'm saying anything that Dr. Seuss. didn't say, you know, like, it's who you. spend the time with and who you get to. complain about with and I think I.

Like, I remember after that trip to. Australia, I was like, "I'm not doing I. think I told you I was like, "I'm not. going Never going to the Great Barrier. Reef alone again. Right. Right. I just. remember being on that boat, just being. like, "What the hell am I. I was like, "Do people like this?" Do. I don't know. I think people like that. they went with a partner, and they were. like, "That sucked, right?". >> That's how I felt watching Superman last. week. I'm trying to I'm trying to get. all my friends to go watch it to just. figure out whether I'm mad or not. It was the worst movie I've ever seen in. my life. >> it? I hated it. It was so bad.

>> It's that feeling of I didn't go with my. wife. I went with a couple of friends. and they hated it, too. But then the. ratings are through the roof, right? And. everyone else I haven't I don't know. anyone. So, when you go watch it, tell. me about it. >> it. What did you think? I liked it. Oh, I saw it in 3D. Yeah, yeah. I didn't. like 3D. I thought 3D was a waste of. money. >> of the comedy. I wasn't laughing. I. didn't find the dog cute. Like I didn't. get it. >> Dog got annoying. Yeah, I just didn't. get it. I didn't get the film. I didn't. get it. I didn't get the film. I didn't. get the film. Are you a Superman fan? Yeah, I love Superman. But like I love.

the TV version with um Do you like. Smallville? No, not Smallville. >> Smallville's a pretty good show. No, not. Smallville. The um I I felt that way. It's It's It's interesting. And you know. Dana, I wanted to ask you that with. Yeah. kind of like the opposite end of. what we're talking about with Jared. Like how long have you been married now? Almost 4 years. Okay. Okay, yeah, fine. And what have you like you've been. building a business and the business was. fairly established at that point, I. imagine. But like what's that been like. for you where almost all the things. Jared's afraid of are things you've been. doing. What's that like in reality? I.

think in reality it's like so much less. scary than you think it is. I think the. hardest part is like. especially for you is like is the. feeling of like finality and commitment. and like this is it, I'm making a. choice. But I think nothing makes you. feel like an adult more than like really. making a choice. Yeah. And I think being. married is making that choice every day. and saying, you know, I'm going to look. at the positive aspects of what's going. on here. It doesn't mean like constantly. being positive or never sharing. something that's bothering you, but I.

think sort of what you were saying is. like the magic of marriage is not. necessarily all the good stuff that. you're sharing together, but being able. to like go through life and experience. all the lows and all the highs and then. you really have like this full. intertwined experience with someone and. they help you grow. They help you, you. know, if they're the right person for. you, they're help they're supporting you. and I think that for me what was unique. about uh meeting my husband as opposed. to anyone else I ever dated is I just. felt like this full. I felt so safe and so secure that I. could build my career and I could go out.

there and I could like not be foc- hyper. focusing on finding the right person. because I felt like I had someone who. was supportive and who wanted the best. for me and that I could be fully myself. with and like self-actualize. And I. think that you would have that totally. too. And of course someone to make fun. of the barrier reef with. And that you know yeah to make fun to to. like also go through the negative. >> reef as I call it. >> Yeah or to go through like the negative. experiences if something horrible. happens to you and you have someone. who's seen that and they're also then. when things are good they also they can.

appreciate that with you much more. Yeah. Yeah. It was really cool though. cuz we started this podcast when Jordana. was single and also just started dating. her now husband. So it was funny to like. when in the beginning of the show like. how cool it was to like it's funny when. we first started like you know Jordana. asking me questions that are like. So you could tell like this is kind of. about my dating. Like I I I'm on a third. date. You know like like what would you. say to someone going on a third date. with someone they kind of like and they.

think is a good guy. You know like He. listened to the podcast at that time. I. think he did. Yeah. >> That's funny. That's That is the. weirdest You have a dating podcast and. you're like the weird part is you're. more honest on a podcast than you are. than you can be with the people in your. life. Like as it That might sound bad. but like you come on here we're we're. talking we're we're chitchatting and. that's the beauty of a podcast you get. to like. put in a headphone and just sit and be a. fly on the wall. And yeah there's like. >> That was a great part of you know being. in early dating and having you I would.

basically like you could be like his. mouthpiece almost for any fights we got. into or anything and you'd explain the. side and I would get it more cuz you do. have like that very unique ability to. sort of verbalize what men are thinking. or how they're thinking about things. that sometimes you just don't come at. things the same way and that's really. the source of most conflict in. relationships is just having a totally. different framework for how you see the. world or how you would see a specific. instance and a lot of the times men and. women are thinking about things really. differently. Right. And. that's kind of been like the frustrating.

part about like the internet's evolution. over the last like seven years of us. doing this podcast is like. there aren't a lot of male voices. straight male voices in this space. >> Mhm. Mhm. I'm not trying to like pat. myself on the back but like I'm. when I come on this podcast I am. I'm telling you exactly how I feel. Mhm. And it sounds really icky as I said. before but like this is it. Like I'm not. apologizing for it. I'm just telling you. and like the podcast has been great cuz.

you know Jordana has never been like. well that's just you. You're gross. You. know like. like I am gross but I am speaking I'm. within I'm not 100% away from your. boyfriend. I'm 10% away at a max. Most. of us are 10% away from each other. So. when we talk about stuff like and you. see on the internet like there's no male. voice. to get back to the horrific stories you. hear about dating from the female side. and it's because a lot of the male side. of this isn't really morally great. That's kind of.

>> doesn't feel quite as wholesome as the. intentions for women. >> Right. The the intentions for women on. dating apps is I want to find the love. of my life and hold hands when we're. buried together dead. And nothing can be better than that. I I. just like to Like the how do you. you know that doesn't sound great on the. internet and you will find a million. voices shouting you down. I'm here to be. casual and just have a fun time and. maybe if I meet someone great like we. have so many people that ask about and. this is like they'll ask about what men. write or people write what they write as.

what they're looking for. And it'll be like I'm looking for a. long-term relationship. I'm looking for. short-term but open to long. Before that option even exists I would. always say men are looking for. short-term option option for long. That's what all men are looking for. The. dream of this person waltzing into my. life and making me not want anyone else. That's the Disney princess to us. So, you know, when we get asked like, "Oh, what if they wrote that they're.

looking for a long-term relationship, but they ended it with me?" It's like, "Yeah, that is bullshit." Stop looking. at what people You know what they're. looking for. The only thing you should. trust on a dating app is I only want. short-term. Because that's them being honest. Every. guy on there is open to long-term, but. you know, open to short, but hoping for. long. And they believe it. So, you're not going to win that battle. Hey, but you said you had long-term. relationship written there. Oh, you're. right. I guess we should be together. now. That's never going to happen. Yeah, and.

that doesn't sound great. >> No, of course not. >> That yeah, I would make out with a bunch. of chicks before I met the love of my. life. That doesn't sound great, but. that's how most men are going about. this. It's it's really interesting when. we think about it, even for my if we're. 10% away. >> Yeah. My perspective has been so. transformed and I hear this from men who. are married and have kids and so who are. one step ahead of me in that journey. >> And even for me, getting married was the best decision I. ever made because it actually gave me. more time, energy,

and space to do all the things I loved. Because as a young man, all I did was. chase women and spend loads of time, money, and energy on finding the right. girl. Right. >> I got all that time back. And when you. realize how much you get. back, I have a buddy who's like all of a. sudden into baking. And I'm like, "When. did this happen?" He's like, "I got a. wife. I like to bake.". >> it's like I'm like a better version of. myself. And every And I was I remember. speaking to like a lot of successful men. and they were all like the best, if you. look through history, the most. successful and happy successful men, I'm.

not just talking about financially, just. men who are happy and successful, it was. because they were committed to one. woman, because that's so much time and. energy to build, do, be, and be. accepted. >> doubt that. >> No, no, I'm not I'm not preaching to. you. >> No, but I No, no, no, but I know you're. not because I've heard you talk about. your wife on our podcast, and you can. tell like this is a partnership. You. guys are aiming for the same thing. You. seem on the same page, just the way you. talk about your relationship. And when. you see that and feel that, you go,

yeah, of course that's the better option. than single. But then you sit here and. you go, man, I I I haven't really had. that. And that's the right answer. because you're right, it's not just. anyone. Right. >> It's the person that's mutually working. on it with you as well. And it's your. point, too. You could I could have been. with a lot of different people. >> Right. I think I could have married a. bunch of other people that I dated, but. it wouldn't have worked because either I. would have lost enthusiasm and energy, or they would have. Yeah. >> Whereas the only reason why this one's. working is because both people are.

willing to put in that energy and that. work and that time in a way that I don't. think I would have had for anyone else. Like a you know, and that's that's. that's the part that you're waiting for. and that's important. >> Yeah, for sure. So, I want to go to the. final five before we do some segments. with you. These questions have to be. answered in one word to one sentence. maximum, but I'm going to change it for. you guys. I'm going to change it for you guys cuz. I don't want to do that, but we're going. to be We're going to be quick with it. though. We're going to be quick with it. Lightning round. >> So, I'm going to give you a little bit.

of scenarios. So, you've been on a few great dates, but you you're always the one. initiating. At what point does that stop. being their style and stop being a sign. they're not prioritizing you? As soon as. you're turned off by that. Yeah. I. think, you know. I. This is my This is my answer. Try this. If you're in a position, you're always. making the plan and it doesn't you're. turned off by it. First of all, establish, I'm turned off. I don't like. that I keep making the plan. That's okay. to admit. It's okay to to you're turned.

off. If you don't like making the plan. If you don't mind making the plan, that's also okay. Right. Both are okay. Um but if you want the person you're. texting with to make the plan and it. would make you feel good, send this. text. You ready? Hey, I'm really busy today. Would love to see you again. Make a plan. and I'm in. Nice. I like that. >> There's no other answer to that than a. plan. If there's other answers, they're not. really looking to go out and hopefully. you're turned off by that. Right. Or. they're not someone who makes plans and.

they're not for you. Right. Yeah. Well. said. I like great answers. That was. very succinct both of you. That was. good. All right. You matched on a dating app. You've had a great conversation but they. haven't responded in 2 days. How long do. you wait before moving on? Feeling it is. the answer. So like that person felt it. I haven't heard from them in 2 days. Okay, what are you going to do about it? Hey, checking in. Would love to go out. Make a plan and I'm in. Right. Make a. plan. Positive. and direction will get you everything.

you want in life. And my with dating, if. you're honest, you will feel this. honesty very quickly. Be positive. Hey, I've loved chit-chatting with you. It's been a couple days. I'm around next. week. Make a plan and I'm in. Make a. plan and I'm in will set you free. It. will truly It's It's such simple advice. but it I only give advice that would. work on me. What would work on me? If someone I was. texting with but I was just getting the. dopamine hit from their text and I.

didn't want to go out with them. If they. were like, "Hey, make a plan and I'm. in.". Time for me to go. Let me put on my hat. I'll be out the door. Yeah. Yeah. And if. that doesn't work, if make a plan and. I'm in doesn't work, you've saved your. own time. You're You've saved your own. mental energy even thinking about it cuz. you've thrown the ball in their court. and now you can move on. Right. Great. How do I navigate jealousy of friends'. relationships and milestones when I feel. stuck or behind? Remember that your. friends are all liars and they're way up. more unhappy than you think they are. No, it's uh.

They suck. How about that? No, I. Uh. your friends, and the jealousy probably. comes from a place of you assuming. I. think if you went out for lunch with a. friend that you'd feel jealous of, you'd. feel really different after that lunch. I kind of tend to believe that. I I call. it that guy mode, FTG mode, uh where you're like someone will be. like, "Hey, have you met my friend Tim?". And I'm like, FTG right away. And then. you meet them, and you go, "Oh, they're. a nice person, and they're pretty cool.". And I So, I think if you're feeling.

jealousy towards your friends and their. relationships, go for lunch with them. I. think that would be like a a purposeful. move. Mhm. I have a slightly different. take. Go ahead and do it, Adam. I think one I. think that feeling of jealousy is really. like that's a secondary emotion for what. you're really feeling, and maybe what. you're really feeling is like a. loneliness thing, and I think it's okay. to feel that. I think that tells you. that's actually great cuz it gives you. direction. Now you know what you want. So many people have no idea what they. want. So I think that's great. I think. have lunch with your friends not to see. how miserable they are, or maybe that's.

Maybe they are. Maybe they're miserable, or maybe they have a great relationship, and you can say, "What was it about this. person that made them different?" You. can get inspired by them. I think you. can change like if we go back to the. beginning of the episode, you can change. your attitude. You can feel like more. excited and kind of get like a a tip. from them. I think it's okay to feel. jea- People are so afraid to say, "I. feel jealous." And I don't know why. It. feels like a very icky emotion, but I. think it's okay to feel jealous. Like. you Jealousy is like, "I know what I. want. I want that. Now I can like really.

work to figure out how to get it." All. right, good answers so far. That's All. right, this one. Uh this person's not. overly impressive to me, but they're. loyal and kind. Do I stay, or do I go? I just always. think of these things, would I want that. person saying that about me at our. wedding? Mhm. And I wouldn't want to be. with that person. I don't want to be. with someone who pities me. Someone who. doesn't think. And again, if you're thinking they're. not overly impressive, then you're.

probably. very caught up on what other people. think of your partner, and that's. probably more of a message to you than. it is to how they should be. Mhm. So, maybe you have to go and kind of like. work that out, and why are you thinking. that way about your partner? And you should I would I would want them. to end it with me. Mhm. I'd be like I I. I don't want to be thought of like a. dog. Loyal? That's what you Yeah, that's how you. talk about the dog. Right. I mean, I I. do agree. I think that like you I would.

have met I would ask myself, what is. overly impressive mean to me, and what. is that adding to my life? Mhm. And then. I mean, like again, I think it I part of. dating, especially as you get older, is. like figuring out what actually matters. And some people call that settling, and. I think other people call that. prioritizing what's actually important. So, I think I would dig deeper into. overly impressive, what that means to. me, why I'm so interested in it, and. what I think that's going to bring to a. partnership. Yeah. Well, said. All. right, fifth and final question. We ask. this to every guest who's ever been on.

the show, but I'm going to apply it to. dating and relationships. If you could. create one dating law that everyone in. the world had to follow, what would it. be? Every time you say you're confused about. something, exchange the word confused for turned. off. Mhm. So, I'm confused they haven't. text me back. I'm turned off that they haven't text me. back. >> That's a great answer. And being turned. off doesn't mean it's over. It's something to.

communicate to the person you're dating. Mhm. And that's an easy text to send from. outside. It's not easy to send that. inside, but to say to someone, "Hey, I'm. a little turned off that you haven't. text me back since our date.". And. that's all you have to say, because. again, I only give advice that works on. me. Anytime a woman has told me I've they've. been turned off by me, it has motivated. me. To impress them. Motivated you to. >> Motivated me to like do either end it. or be better.

>> Yeah, motivated you to some action. >> Make a move to action. Make a move. So. So anytime someone says they're confused. about something, I've noticed that. that's just their way of not telling us. that they're turned off. >> Nice. So take confused. switch it with turned off and then. communicate that. Great advice. Jordana, finish us off. I think when I my mistake. I used to make in dating, especially. before starting this podcast, is. you know, wanting to be the person that. someone likes and so set like not. stating your own needs in an effort to. get the widest reach of people who are. interested in you. But what I've learned.

is that when you express your needs, you. save your own time and you find a better. match for you sooner because your needs. are your needs. There's no such thing as. a wrong need or a right need. It's what. works for you. And the sooner you ask or. express your need, the sooner you find. out if someone's going to meet it and. the more time you save on your own. That's stuff. Jordana and Jared, you. guys are the best. Great advice, great. insight. Uh anyone who's been listening. and watching, make sure you subscribe to. U Up if you haven't already. Make sure. you cut this into all your clips for. TikTok, for Instagram. Tag all three of.

us. I love seeing the stuff that. resonates with you, the stuff that. turned you off, the stuff that brought. you to life, the things that you're. practicing. I want to know who's doing. the challenge with Jared It's it's it's. helpful and it'll make you feel you'll. feel refreshed very quickly. I I will. say that. >> You could get You could do the challenge. in a relationship. You're just, you. know, put your put You're being more. You're being I'm being more social. Okay. All right. I didn't realize. >> I like the dinner one. Yeah. I like. >> Make a plan with a couple. I it really. does Yeah, it changes it. It changes.

things. Get off your This challenge is. get off your phone. >> It's a little bit. Get off your phone. >> When I'm with someone else, I'm off my. phone, but Love it. Jordana and Jared, you the best. I hope you come back soon. Thank you so much. You guys are awesome. I really hope you come back again. We've. got lots more to talk about next time, but uh I would have kept you here for. another hour if I could have. So, I'm so. grateful. Thank you so much. You guys. are awesome. You're the best, man. We. really appreciate it. >> so great. Thank you so much for having. us. If you loved this episode, you're. going to love my conversation with. Matthew Hussey on how to get over your. ex and find true love in your.

relationships. People should be. compassionate to themselves, but extend. that compassion to your future self. Because truly extending your compassion. to your future self is doing something. that gives him or her a shot at a happy. and a peaceful life.