The Business Expert: The SECRET FORMULA That Launches Billion-Dollar Companies!

When you are chasing a dream, you're. going to be happy about a third of the. time. I have lost and failed more times. than I've succeeded. We don't talk about. that. I felt like it was the end of like. my company and my career, but it wasn't. It was just a failure. One of America's. richest self-made women, fashion and. business powerhouse, Emma Grede. I spent. such a huge part of my life being so. crippled by fear for so long. That held. me back. It was rough. Before we jump into this episode, I'd.

like to invite you to join this. community to hear more interviews that. will help you become happier, healthier, and more healed. All I want you to do is. click on the subscribe button. I love. your support. It's incredible to see all. your comments, and we're just getting. started. I can't wait to go on this. journey with you. Thank you so much for. subscribing. It means the world to me. The best-selling author and host. The number one health and wellness. podcast. On Purpose with Jay Shetty. Hey everyone, welcome back to On.

Purpose, the number one health podcast. in the world. Thanks to each and every. one of you that come back every week to. become happier, healthier, and more. healed. You know that my goal is to. introduce you to incredible thinkers, thought leaders, people who are making. an impact and a difference in the world, rule breakers, people who are changing. the way we think, lead, and live. And. today's guest is someone I've wanted on. for a long, long time. So, I'm very. excited that I finally have her sitting. opposite me. I'm talking about the one. and only Emma Grede, CEO and co-founder.

of Good American, the first fully. inclusive fashion brand that celebrates. all dimensions of female power. In. October 2016, Emma launched Good. American alongside Khloé Kardashian. What started as the largest denim launch. in history, Good American is now an. iconic inclusive fashion line of denim, ready-to-wear, swim, shoes, and. activewear. Emma is also a founding. partner and chief product officer of. Skims, a solutions-oriented brand. creating the next generation of.

underwear, loungewear, and shapewear. You already knew that. And co-founder of. Safely, an accessible premium home care. brand dedicated to creating high-quality. plant-based cleaning products. Emma is. now recognized as one of America's. richest self-made women by Forbes and. serves as chairwoman of the 15% pledge. and also as a board member of Baby2Baby. And for me, beyond all of this, I'm just. happy to be sitting with a Brit in LA. and just so grateful, Emma, because I've. been watching you, I've been following.

you. Your energy, whether it's a picture or a. video, is so magnetic and so real. And. now I meet you in person and I'm like, it's amazing. So thank you, thank you. for being here. Honestly, I could not be more happy to. be here. A, definitely because you're a. fellow Brit, but I have been listening. and watching and reading you for so. long. This is like the thing that I've. been most excited about for the longest. time. So thank you for having me today. You're the sweetest. Very happy. It's a.

big like tick for me. I'm like, yes, let's do it. Aw, you're the sweetest. And I want you to know, literally my. whole team was so excited you were. coming today. Everyone is such major. fans. They're They're big fans of you. and your family. I can't even imagine. that. Even when you say it, I'm It's. true. I want to go back to I remember that you. and Khloe were doing a live years ago. Yes. And I literally just came on. because I saw you both live and I came. on and I was just saying, "Hey guys, you. know, like just being friendly.". And we were like, "What?". You both shifted the entire I just want.

everyone to understand this. They're on. a live talking about their incredible. brand that is like crushing it and. little me comes on. We're like, "Yay, we love him.". And it was the sweetest thing like and I. was like, "How did" I felt terrible so I. logged off because I felt No, no, no. We. were like, "Where's he gone?". It was so sweet and I was just like, how. conscious and kind and thoughtful. And. anyway, I want to dive straight into. your incredible journey. That's why. we're here today to understand you, the. human behind this incredible journey and. incredible story. And I want to start.

off with what is your earliest childhood. memory that you think is indicative and. defines who you are today? That is such. a brilliant question. This is what you. do, right? You ask the best questions. I'm so glad you know, so why did you. start with American? And you know, it's. so interesting. I come from East London. and you know, East London is like, you. know, it's like coming from like. Long Beach Inglewood or Brooklyn. Do you. know what I mean? It's like it's the.

street. It's the part of London that. when, you know, if you go back 30 years. ago when I was a kid, it's just not the. place where you would happily hang out. Mhm. I had a fantastic upbringing there, you. know, and I think it's very defining. East London has been very defining of. me, my personality. You were really. raised to, you know, in a in a. community, to have huge respect for the. people around you, huge trust actually. for the people around you, but it was. pretty devoid of any aspiration and. certainly any any glamour. And I was one.

of those kids that just kind of grew up. like always kind of looking at what. could be next and what was in my future. and I just fell into this like fashion. magazine land, you know, it's like I. would do my paper out, I'd get the money. from that, I'd spend it on an issue of. like Vogue or Elle or Marie Claire. And. it was that great moment sort of late. 80s, early 90s in England where we had, you know, so many incredible movements, you know, Brit pop, Brit art, but all of. those supermodels, you know, it's like.

Naomi and Kate Moss and I saw that as a. means of escapism. I never thought about. it as a potential for a job, but I was. like, let me just lift out of where I am. and aspire to something that was. beautiful and aspirational because I. couldn't see that anywhere around me. And so when I think about my childhood, I think partially about this piece of. like East London where there's an. honesty and an authenticity and a level. of just like being the person that you. say you are, like living by a certain.

set of values and then this other part. that was like get me out of there. Do you know what I mean? And that's. that's the honesty of it really. Yeah, and how do where do you think that. comes from? I think some people are. like, you know, we become products of. our environment and so if some people. are in a group of people or in an area. that is unambitious or not striving, it's easy to fold into that. Where did. that come for you personally? Like. was it someone in your life? Was it. something you read? Was it the. magazines? Like where did that belief. come that there could be more? There may.

be more. There is another place to go. to? You know, I think that it must have. come from my mom in some ways because I. honestly I didn't know anyone that owned. their own business. Everywhere I come. from everyone worked a job and you work. for somebody else. And jobs were seen as. exactly that. There was no career, there. was no vocation, there was no like. purposeful doing of what you do. It's. like you get up, you went to work, you. probably found it miserable and you try. to get out of there as quickly as you. could. And for me, I really thought that. you know, there has to be a better way.

to live. I was like shouldn't there be. some excitement and enjoyment? But I. don't know where I got it from. The. sense of value and the sense of ambition. has always been in me and people always. say to me, you know, like. how did you get to where you are? And I. go, well, it's much more simple than. people think, you know, it's like I. really value myself and I really value. my goals and I don't think it's much. more complicated than that. But I was. taught that by my mom who was very very.

much like, listen Emma, you're not. better than anybody else, but nor is. anyone better than you. And so when. people talk about imposter syndrome, like I look around, I'm like that's. that's made up. Like every we all feel. exactly the same, like deep, deep down. And that sense of me feeling like I. could achieve was just built in. Like I. I've never felt a lack of confidence. I've never felt less than. I always felt. like if I worked hard enough and I. really like put everything into it that.

I could achieve. I still feel like that. today. I don't expect things to be easy, but I I've never had a sense of I. couldn't. Yeah, what a great way for. your mom to set you up. Like what an. amazing recipe to put together. No, it's. it's beautiful to hear that because I. love that perspective of no one's better. than you and you're not better than. anyone. Like that's such a great. equalizer. Absolutely. And the two things are. really important, right? Because I grew. up with such a respect for everybody. else around me, regardless of like where. they come from or you know, what they.

were doing. And I think that you know, as a kid, I was surrounded by a lot of. people that were doing what they had to. do to get through the day. And I never. looked down on anyone. I always felt, well, you know what? As long as you are. doing something, you find an interest in. something. And for me that came at a. very early age in fashion. But it was. much more a means of escapism than me. sitting there and like really. appreciating the clothing or the craft. It was like it was a means to dream. Yeah, absolutely. I love that. And tell. me about you touched on it there, but I.

want to talk about your first job. And I. like doing this with people because. what's really interesting to me is. people forget, especially when someone's. at the peaks of their careers and. achieving incredible things. Like when. people ask you the question of like, how. did you get to where you are? It almost takes away from the fact that. there was a first job that wasn't this. CEO and Well, especially now, right? Because we have this idea through like. social media that everything happens. overnight. And I think you know, it's. like I've been grafting away since I was. 12 years old and like boom, I get some.

success at 40 and people think you're an. overnight success. I have worked every. job imaginable. I had a paper round when. I was 12 until I was 15. I worked in a. delicatessen. I worked in clothes shops. I served in restaurants. It's like I've. done every job in fashion that you could. do at the lowest possible level. imaginable while not being paid, right? It's like I've done all of it. But. actually for me, you know, when you talk. about people and your point of view on. life, like I am a naturally positive of.

a naturally positive distribution. disposition. I always am a person that. thinks about the glass being half full. And so even when I worked in that deli. and I was making a sandwich, I was going. to make you the best turkey sandwich. you've ever had in your life. And I. would wait and look at you and be like, how good is that sandwich? Is that an. amazing sandwich? I chose the best light. amount of turkey with the right amount. of the pickle and I'd make it look nice. and I'd cut it beautifully like on the. plate. And do you know do you know what. I mean? So for me, I can take pride in.

anything and I also take a huge amount. of learnings from everything. So for me, it's like I used to think, well, one day. like this will be useful to me. Like one. day learning how to make a perfect. cappuccino or making a customer happy or. discussing how things work in a shop or. a delicatessen will be useful to me. And. I actually think about all of those. experiences as being very formative. Um. and I enjoyed all of them, you know, it's like I've just I've really worked. and I think everybody talks so much. about hard work, but they don't really.

talk about like unenjoyable work. I had. a lot of unenjoyable. jobs that I just had to get through, but. I never ever let it put me off. I always. saw them as a means to the end, you. know? And so I think when we talk about. that now, like what does hard work. actually means? It means getting up and. thinking about the end goal when you're. nowhere even close to it, right? But you. can see a pathway. And for me, it was. always about that. I could always see. very clearly that I'm going to do that. to get to that to get to that. And I've.

been quite um. been quite planned, I feel, in so many. ways in my life. Yeah, and I'm so glad. you raised that point because I I feel. the same way that you don't have to love. a job to learn from it. No. And I think we all are thinking, "Well, I hate my job. I dislike it. It's the. worst. It's a waste of time. I'm in the. wrong place." But actually, if you just. shift that to be like, "What can I. learn? What experience do I not have? How can I interact?". do I not want to behave? Like this boss. drives me crazy. I'll never be this. boss. I remember I had a boss like that.

And I used to literally write down in. the back of my book like, "You should. never ever speak to people like that or. call someone out in that way." And I. think that's been so formative of what. type of leader I want to be. But the two. things for me haven't been mutually. exclusive, right? I think that you can. two things can be true at the one time. You can be unashamedly ambitious and. focused on what it is that you need, while also being an inspiring and. empathic leader who lifts other people. up. And so, I've been thinking about.

those type of things since I've been a. boss, you know, for the last 15 years, as a direct reflection of what I didn't. experience when I was an employee. And. so, I actually think, "God, all of those. experiences were really good for me cuz. now I know what I don't want to do.". Yeah, absolutely. I did a paper round, too, by the way. Did you? Yeah, yeah, yeah. That was my. first ever job. was heavy work. It was such heavy work. work. But that's where I feel like I got. my appreciation for the mornings. Like. I'm such a, like, early bird. And I. remember doing those paper rounds in the. dark in England. And it was kind of. amazing cuz you'd like most houses were.

quiet quiet, and then you'd see this. like one house where like there's a. little glimmer happening. And I thought. I learned the power of the mornings from. that particular job. Like getting out, getting a head start. I'd go home, I'd. put on my school uniform before any of. my sisters. I'd be sitting there with a. cup of tea while they were all like. scrambling around. And I was like, "This. early morning stuff, there's something. to it, you know?". interesting. So, I used to do mine in. the evening because I didn't have to do. in the morning. So, I'd do it after. school. What about your people getting the. papers? What happened to them? I don't. know. That's what I was going to.

I That's what I was going to. That's what I was going to. I don't. think anyone read the paper. That's. amazing. Uh but I would like I'd walk. around with my uh headphones on. I'd be. listening to Eminem. And I'd have like. this. know that. I know that paper route. Yeah, and I'd have this like really. weird-looking like trolley that I'd pull. around and then I'd have to take the. papers into a bag. That bag stunted my growth. bringing me back I believe that joke. I've like a lopsided shoulder because of. that bag. It was so bad. But yeah, I learned the. same thing. Like for me, so all the kids.

in my area what they used to do, the. other kids who did the paper routes, they used to throw the papers off the. edge of the train track or like in a. bush or whatever it was. So then the guy. who ran whatever company it was that did. the paper routes, he said to me, he. goes, "Jay, you're the only reliable. person I have, so I'm going to give you. all their streets I love it. You're like. that kid singing. Yeah, exactly. You're. out here making money. Yeah, it was. amazing. And And it's I love that you. said that that you learned. And I love. the passion. I wish you were at my local. deli. Like And And you know that stuff. still happens today. I interviewed um.

last year I was doing a show for YouTube. and I interviewed this TikToker called. Markel Washington. All right. And if anyone doesn't know who he is, he's awesome. Like great energy, super. talented young guy. And he. was I think he worked in a Subway. Wow. And he was He used to dance and sing. while he served. Right. And not only did he used to. upload that to TikTok, he got found out. way and now he's got this incredible. career doing And I love that energy of. like back then when you were doing it.

and it took you maybe a lot longer to. find that success. He was doing it more. recently, he found it, but it's. interesting to see that it's the same. sort of What was What was the hardest. job that you did? The most unenjoyable, the most uncomfortable where you. actually looked at it and went, "Maybe. this is not worth it." Like what What. was the one that pushed you to the edge? Well, you know, it's so interesting. It. was probably the job that I did before. starting my first company because such a. part of that I worked in a fashion show. production company, which if you imagine.

that I want to be in fashion, you think, yes. The reality of that is that you're. building stages, you're working on this. like concept of like, you know, whatever. you're producing for 3 months. The show. goes up and down in 10 minutes. Everybody goes off to the after-party. and you're doing de-rig and you're like, this is the worst job ever. And so, I. transitioned into this role of like. sponsorship, which was so formative for. my for the first business that I ever. started because it was all about brand. partnerships and marketing and. collaboration. But, my role at that. point when you know nobody was just cold.

calling, right? So, I would just have to. like hit the phones and the rejection. and, you know, you can't help but take. that personally. You're like, I haven't. made one connection today. And that I. found so disheartening. But, you know, I. even knew then I was like, this will be. worth something because for every like. little knockback you got, you know, every kind of 3 days you'd get one. glimmer of hope and you take one meeting. and out of those 10 meetings, maybe. you'd start one deal. And actually, it. was very It was just like very telling.

about yourself, like what are you good. at? And now I think, you know, as I. think about entrepreneurship and because. I meet so many founders, that skill of. sales and storytelling, if you ain't got. that, like, you can't do this job, right? You can't You can't sell to. investors, you can't craft a story to. customers, and you certainly can't get. into the heart of like what makes a. brand successful unless you can sell and. storytell. And so, again, it's just one. of those things that I had to go. through, but it was miserable.

beyond miserable. I I didn't realize how many different. similarities we have in our background. to some people. So, I worked at the. Business Design Centre for a bit and I. did I did like internships, then I'd. work there over the summer and stuff. And all I had to do was sit there and. call to sell the stands cuz you know, they'd have all the different stands for. like the bike show or the they'd be. fashion shows. Yeah. It really is. And I remember the. cold calling and I look back at that and. I remember before then I was so I was. quite introverted, I was quite shy and. and then all of a sudden when you're.

doing like 300 cold calls a day. it goes away and it's amazing how so. much can be like removed from not your. personality but this kind of fear and. insecurities that we often have as a. have as a kid. 100% and I feel like even now, you know, when I think about fear and what that's. meant in my career so much cuz it's. actually been helpful in so many ways. Like I always think about myself now and. I'm like, you know, it's like if I am. not a little bit scared about what I'm.

doing, like even coming here today, right? It's like then I'm not growing. Like I'm not moving forward. I'm not. going in the right direction. And so now. I find myself looking for the fear. I'm. like, what can I do that's going to. scare me? Cuz I I know how to make. jeans. I can make you fantastic knickers. all day long. But actually like. branching out and trying to do something. else is the stuff that keeps us as. humans growing and I think about that. all the time because I spent such a huge. part of my life being so crippled by.

fear and failing and, you know, I I was. a school I dropped out of school when I. was 15 or 16. I can't actually remember. It must have been 15. But you know, that. always left me with this kind of. inferiority complex that I wasn't. educated enough. I'd work in London. around very hoity-toity wonderful people. that were fresh out of Cambridge and. Oxford and had these wonderful. educations and I always felt a bit. inferior for that. I was like, I'm going. to get caught. They're going to find out. that I don't, you know, have that. educational background. I don't speak in.

the right way. And, you know, I feel. like for so long that held me back until. I realized, no, no, no, that's my fuel. That's what makes me me. And if I'm not. a little bit scared, now I find myself. just actually looking for it, cuz I know. I need that fire in my belly like the. whole time. Did you ever feel that. anyone ever made you feel inferior. because of a lack of the formal. education, or was it an internal I'm. sure they did, but it was much stronger. the internal voice, right? It's like I. don't think anybody, you know what it's.

like, when you're in London there is. such a class system, right? And people. know immediately, they in it in this. country they think you and I sound like. the Queen, and we know in reality we. don't, babe. And in London, any English people. listening to that us absolutely know. that. And so there is always that you. open your mouth and immediately you're. judging, you know exactly where I'm. from, and you can attribute a set of. circumstances to that. But I think it. was much more about the voice in my own. head. And I I think about that an awful. lot now in the way that I've set up my. life and my businesses, and you know, I.

believe very much in this idea like this. rule of thirds, right? I think about it. constantly, you know, when you are doing. something very difficult, or you are. chasing a dream, you're going to be. happy about a third of the time. You're. going to feel okay about a third of the. time. And the other third of time you're. going to feel pretty crappy. You are going to feel bad, and if the. ratios get out of whack and things are. not actually you're too happy, you're. probably not pushing yourself hard. enough. And if, you know, you're.

actually spending too much time, you're. probably not, you know, you're not. thinking about it right. But I do think. that that leaning that I've had my whole. life, the idea that I shouldn't be. comfortable and happy all of the time, actually really helps me so much, and I. think about that idea of the third and. the third and the third, and it doesn't. scare me anymore. I'm like, "Oh, I'm. just having one of the days that is my. crappy day. That's okay, cuz what I'm. doing isn't straightforward. It isn't.

what everybody's doing, and it's. supposed to be difficult. It's supposed. to be heavy. It's supposed to not be. comfortable all the time." And I think. that that for me has been a way that I. can actually get through those times. that are a bit more tricky. You know, I. love that. I've never heard someone say. it like that before. Yeah, that's such a unique way of. thinking about it. So, you said that the. thirds are okay, Yeah. happy, and then terrible. terrible. Yeah, and I I that's so spot on, and. I've never heard someone break it down. like that simply. Yeah. Well, I am a. very simple girl, you know, that's.

I have to break it down like that for. myself. But, you know, it's really. helpful because I think in any in any. part of your life, like there is. especially now because I work with so. many people, there is this idea and. also, you know, I'm a mom of four, right? So, there is this part of me. that's like, I just want my kids to be. all right and to be happy all the time. And I'm like, actually no, because it's. in those moments, and you know this more. than anyone, of challenge, of. difficulty, that's when you grow the. most. But, we shouldn't rather than like. trying to remove that from my children, or take those times away from my.

employees, or think that's not okay, it's like, no, no, no, guys, like that's. what it's about. And if you're coasting. through life and doing something that. really simplistic, fine, you might just. feel all right all the time. But, I am. so happy when the good is good that I'll. take the okay and the bad, you know? It's worth it because it actually all. comes out even in the end, you know? When when you were chasing the dreams. back in the day, or like trying to build. it up, were you dating? Did you care. about that? Was that like cuz now. obviously you have a beautiful family, yeah. Now you have a beautiful family,

you you have a wonderful partner, you. have four kids, as you said, like but I. wondered then, like I feel like a lot of. us spend a lot of our teens and our 20s. thinking about love. Totally. Was that how you were, too, or. 100%. I don't think I've ever been. without a boyfriend. I'm a person that needs a someone. And I. you know, yeah, I I went around a little. bit, and I I'm I'm very I was very happy. to settle down at 25, 26. I don't feel. like I missed out, you know, because we. started so early. I feel like, you know, I was like out in the clubs when I was.

13, 14, and then I had this stint in. Ibiza when I was asked to leave school. So, it's like I've had a lot of living. before I got there, and I I think that. I've always been someone that has chased. love. Like, I love that feeling, but as. you get older, you realize, you know, what that really means. Like, today, it's like I want to be loved back, but. it's not all about that rush. You know, it's like I've been with my husband now. for. 15 years, married for 11. And the things.

that I value have completely shifted, right? It's like and we've been on a. journey together, and I think that in. life, you need chapters. And just as the. same, you know, like in career, and you. need, you know, needing transitions and. to transform, relationships need. chapters like that, too. The first 5. years, we traveled the world, we. partied, we got drunk, we like did all. the things that you do, and then we went. through a period of having children, and. that's extremely challenging on any.

relationship, especially while the two. of you are enormously ambitious. And I. think that what I have with my husband. is this extremely unique partnership, where he always understood that I was. ambitious, and I needed to do things, and he's completely supported that. And. I think that the love that I have for. him has grown exponentially because. we've been still I've still been able to. chase all of my dreams outside of the. relationship and the family structure. while having someone really support me. do that. Mhm. That's a Yeah, we won't we.

won't go down the stint in Ibiza that. came up. No, it's really fun. Well, well, well, well, We're going to. calling part. Go on, go on, tell me. No, I just feel like it, you know, it's like. you you have There's a part of my life. where I think there was a need to. escape, you know, and I found that I was. a real club kid. That's what I enjoyed. I wanted to go out. For me, it was. actually never about getting smashed, but it was like the music and those. super late nights and the like that.

whole community of it. Like I was. friends with the DJs and the MCs and you. know, like I was on the list and like I. did that whole thing. I think that was a. huge formative part of my childhood. Like I would not or not my childhood, my. kind of late teens, early 20s. Like I. needed to go and get like remove myself. from from what my kind of everyday life. and my upbringing was and it kind of. introduced me to a lot of alternative. things and people and ways of being and. you know, it's like you go to Ibiza, you. you learn yoga for the first time. I was.

like, "Well, what's this? Nobody I knew. in Plaistow was doing yoga.". know anyone in Ibiza who was doing yoga. Not for the island, baby. But you know, it was like there's just. these things that I think that part of. my life really opened me up to and I I. felt like in some ways, even though I. saw a lot as a kid and I was experienced. to some pretty kind of gruesome things, there was a whole part of life and sort. of a a way of living and uh. a a kind of level of peace and.

understanding of people that was not. ever explained to me and was not part of. my childhood and my upbringing and I. learned that much later. Mhm. Yeah, I. know. Thank you for sharing that. It's. it's uh. it's so. Yeah, it's so interesting. Again, we we. often feel like. the next chapter will be better and. you've just broke it down and said, "Well, no, actually there's going to be. every chapter and every chapter has its. reason and it has its story and and you. just said I I love that I live life that.

way and then when I met my partner, I. knew it knew it was going to work." And. even that's had so many chapters inside. of it. Absolutely. What would you How would. your mom. describe what she saw as a little girl. to who she sees now? I think she'd say. same same. I was always a pain for. everyone around me, you know? I. literally I was that kid I I actually. didn't you know, I didn't have many. friends. I wasn't like the popular kid, you know, my sisters were all. massive athletes, hugely popular. I was. a bit more of a loner. I had like, you.

know, two or three really solid friends. Sounds exactly like today, actually. But, you know, it was like I was that. kid. I was like in my own head. I've. always been a dreamer. But, you know, my. mom would always say, she was like, "You're a dreamer, but you're a doer.". And I always had those two things. I. don't think I've changed that much. You. know, I I think about myself and I'm. like, "I've been absolutely same since I. was 7 years old." This is how I've. always felt. This is how I've always. been. That's epic. That's so cool. I. wonder how you see that with now being a.

mom, too. Like, now when you're looking. at your kids and. You know, it's it's it's wild because I. think like so many moms, especially. mothers that work in the same way that I. do, right? You're kind of played by this. idea of what you're supposed to be and. do as a mother. And because I grew up. with a mom that left the house every. day, that went to work, I have maybe a. different idea of what I'm supposed to. be providing for those kids. I think. it's really important that my children.

see me living out my dreams. And. hopefully they'll do the same for. themselves. But, you know, everybody the. the question always kind of boils down. to like, "How do you do it all?" And I. really think it's important to dispel. that myth of doing it all because women. have been really sold. a crock of crap. Like, it's like you you. can't have it all all the time. And my. life is a series of trade-offs, right? That's just a fact. I'm not the mom who.

is at the school gate. I'm not there for. pick up and drop off. I'm not at the. school gala. Hopefully, my kids get. something else for me, which is a sense. of actually living out your dreams and. what you're supposed to do. And I think. that they will see that and really. appreciate having that for me. But, I. think it's very important that we stop. talking about this idea of like balance. because there is no balance in my life. Like it it's it's rubbish, you know, it's like I have to go wherever the. energy is that morning and my children.

have to fit around that. Nothing's. changed. Like I said, I'm still the same. the same person and four children, yes, it changes the. the kind of, you know, routine of your. day, but it doesn't change who you are. fundamentally. And I am one of those. person people that think, you know, my. children have to fit around me. Mhm. And. and that's just a fact, you know, it. just it is what it is. Yeah, and I'll. say as as a kid who grew up with a mom. who is working that hard and like had. her So so my mom.

trained to be a financial advisor so. that she could be self-employed as we. called it. In She was an entrepreneur, but. Totally. the language was. her own time, right? she could manage her own time so she. could be there for us. So my mom would. make us breakfast, drop us to school, pack lunch, then she'd go to work, Superwoman. pick us up, feed us, and then go back. out to work. And sometimes I'd join her, I'd go out with her in the car, I'd sit. with her. in my office too. when she was with clients and then. That's amazing. I know, I know, I should. have. I should have. And and it's just I saw.

my mom be so active. My mom was never. She wasn't around like just hanging. around the house. She wasn't available. in that way. Again, I'm not saying. that's a bad thing, I'm just saying my. mom wasn't. And as someone who grew up. with a mom like that, like not only do I. love and respect my mom insanely, Insanely. I also just saw that. it you could still feel loved without. having loads of time. 100% because it's about quality, right? I always think about that. My kids need. me like in a 100% capacity, like not.

half looking at my phone, not half doing. work, not surrounded by lots of people. in the house. And I really try to think. about them as individuals because I have. a boy and a girl and then boy girl. twins. And I like to do things with my. kids individually so that I can really. understand who they are and what their. needs are. Not like this sort of like. family pack, you know, cuz it very. quickly. becomes that. I'm like, "Ah, like all of you in the car." Um but. I think that, you know, again, when you. grow up in a big family, you you have.

ideas and experiences of how it wasn't. so great and what you'd want to do. differently. And so I try to apply that, but I think for for most women it's. really it's really important to just. level like lower the expectations a. little bit and be honest with ourselves. about what we're capable of because it's. really something that I think there's so. much being thrown at women all the time. about what you should do and how should. advocate for yourself and, you know, and.

and it quite frankly is just too much. It is not feasible. It is not something. that we can all cope with and I think. that you do what you do to get through. the day and we should all just like. lower the expectation levels a little. bit. That isn't to say lower your. ambition level, but that's just to say. don't don't feel bad about what you're. doing. At the end of it, it's like we. all do as much as we can and our kids. will all be all right. They don't need. us to usher them through every. experience in the day. And they'll be.

who they are. They'll be who they are. How did you make peace with that? Because I feel like I I love that. perspective and I'm sure it's going to. help so many people, but I think people. will struggle with this. We love being. the controller. We love making sure. everything's right. We also so hard on. ourselves as you were just saying. because. people were hard on us and now we think. we need to be supermom and maybe our mom. did it or maybe our auntie did it, whatever. I think there's a lot of. people who are just like, "I get that, but I don't know how to. make peace with that.".

100%. You know, it's a great question. and I always think about I'm somebody. that's absolutely like fixated and. fascinated by memories, right? I always. like go back and I think about like the. big important things in my life. What. What did I really enjoy from last year? What were the moments that like are here. in my memory? And when you do that, it. very rarely has anything to do with any. level of perfection. The best moments. are the sporadic moments that were. unplanned. When you're sitting there, the kids are a mess, you're in the. garden, something happened that just.

made it so. And it's never the moments. that you kind of forced. It's never the. things that you planned. It's never the. ones that you spent like all your energy. on. And so I think that it just becomes. about like this great like you've got to. weigh it up, right? You've got to weigh. up like what is worth it and what Where. do you derive enjoyment from? And I. think anyone who looks at their life. will actually find that it's in the. small stuff. It's in those moments that. you just. let it all go. And so I think it's.

really It's such a good exercise, especially for women and moms, to just. kind of backtrack and say, "In the last. 12 months, what were the single best. moments that you had?" And then you will. absolutely not stress about whatever it. is that is weighing you down today, cuz. it's never what you think. Ever. It. never has been for me. Yeah. And don't. judge the moment, right? Like we can. We're so quick to be like. Oh, I just I said the wrong thing. Totally. And all of a sudden I said the wrong.

thing becomes I messed up today. I shouldn't be here. I don't belong. I'm. not supposed to be part of it. And it's. so interesting. I remember like there's. this brilliant story about when Oprah. was going through this like crazy crazy. time in her life and she turns up at. Quincy Jones's house for business for. dinner. And she said to him, "Oh my god, like it's so terrible. It's so awful. Have you seen the press?" And did it did. it and he's like, "What are you talking. about?" He hasn't seen anything, right? Because at the end of the day, no one's. watching you. No one's watching you like. you're watching you. Most of your. mistakes is in private. And so I often.

think about that because it's like. everybody's so bothered about their own. stuff and what's going on in their head, they're not thinking about you. And so, sometimes you just have to release a. little bit. And I always try to think. about like, what is real and what is. ego, you know? And so much of it is ego. So, especially around the mom part, funnily enough, right? Because we're all. trying to do and be better than what we. had and change things for our children. and be this impossible, wonderful, perfect mother. And that's nothing to do. with your kids because what your kids.

want is just a bit of you in the most. simple way. They don't care about any of. that stuff. And so, again, it really is. that challenge of really sitting down. and speaking to your children and. thinking to yourself like, what actually. matters? And I think it's like those. small moments. Yeah. Yeah, that's well. said. And and and as I said, as someone. who received a lot of that from my mom, I I felt like I never doubted whether my. mom loved me or not. No. Whether she. could come to my rugby game or not or. whether she could come and watch me.

at the class rehearsals or dramas or. whatever we were doing. If she was there. or she wasn't there, that wasn't how I. felt loved or not. Yeah, because it was so it's it's such a. core part of my life. I feel today I. have like so much love to give because. of how much my mom loved me. 100%. And it's not that she was there. every. 100%. So, yeah. And and and the flip. side, I'm sure there's people who would. think, "God, my parents were around all. the time and and and I didn't. necessarily feel. necessarily connect. Exactly. Exactly. connected. Yeah. You've talked about. this before and I really like it. This.

whole idea of like, you can't have it. all and everyone's always talking about. balance. And I agree with you. I don't. think balance exists either, even in my. life because I often get that. "Oh, Jay, mindfulness and meditation." I'm like, "But that's not balance." Like, you're. actually constantly using these tools. and techniques to be back at a point of. equanimity. Yeah, exactly. Yeah, to be. back at a point of equanimity, but there. isn't this idealized balance. No. When it comes to, you know, you and. your partner, you both have great. careers. You do some things together, lots of things individually. Absolutely. How does that like I guess.

my question there is what is the one. thing you both need from each other. that allows you to stay connected whilst. having. collective empires, individual empires, and then a beautiful family as well on. top of all of that. I honestly think. that just comes down to love because. it's different things in different. moments and if you really, really love. someone, then you do what they need in. that moment whether or not it's. good for you right there or what you. might have discussed, right? That comes.

down to do I really love this person and. want the best for them in this thing, this moment, this decision. And more. than anything, you know, I have such an. admiration for my husband in so many. different ways in how he thinks and how. he approaches things and what type of. father he is. And. you know, love does lots of different. things, but you know, usually it grows. or it dwindles, right? It's like in. relationships. And I think that mine is. still growing, but it just comes down to.

the fact that. I love him. Mhm. It isn't any more. complicated than that. We have lots of. things that we do together and I do. think there is a huge thing of this idea. of chapters and having projects. together, you know, to some extent. children at that because you go through. this like, you know, trying to get. pregnant and then being pregnant and. then having the baby in those early days. and then those stories about those early. days and then buying houses together and. doing those houses up. And so there is. this element and with us, we've also had.

the businesses that to some degree and. in some businesses we've done those. things together. And so there have been. these chapters and these projects that. have been extremely, I'd say, pivotal in. our life and you often see that that. when, you know, couples have kids that. fly the nest, it's like suddenly they. don't have a project anymore. It's like. everything's done and they're like, "Okay, we don't have anything." So we. have that together. But I feel like in. my life I'm extremely ritualistic. You. know, that's just how I am. And there's. parts of our relationship that have. taken on some of those rituals in terms.

of, you know, how we think about time. just us and not with the children, how. we think about setting up our mornings. And those things become sort of bedrocks. and foundations that for our for what I. think is like a healthy relationship. Yeah, what what I really gain from what. you're saying right now and I hope. everyone's listening and taking notes, too, cuz there's so many great great. insights that are like you're just. sprinkling them everywhere and I have. them like trying to catch them. And. there there's I love the idea that.

if you value a relationship in your. life, your relationship's only as good. as the stories you've lived together and. the memories you've made. And if you stop making stories and. memories with people, then you're. constantly living in the past. Exactly, which is so unhealthy. It's And. you've seen that in so many friendships, right? When you're no longer creating. together, you have nothing but your old. memories. And after a while that just. dwindles. So, you need to consistently. create. And that can be big things or. small things. It can be building a, you. know, shed in your back garden, but. something that you live out together and.

you see to fruition and you create and. you make. And I think that that's a. really important part of a relationship. to keep doing that and keep getting. excited together about something and. yeah, rather than just like how was your. day and then you're talking about your. own world and then their world and it's. And all of that separation, you know? And that's how so many couples, I think, where it goes wrong. You're kind of. living out the most exciting parts of. your life entirely separately. And I. feel with us, you know, it's like we. just bought a cold plunge. And like the.

cold plunge has become the thing, right? We're literally just like, how many. minutes are you going to do? How many. minutes are you going to do? Oh my god, are you going to put your head under? Like, you know, but it becomes this. thing that you're living out together. and now we'll be like cold plunge. bullies to all of our friends, you know? But even something so small like that. can be so like magical for a. relationship cuz you're learning and. pushing and doing something together. Yeah, we do the same and we. Do you? No, you don't. Yeah, we do. But, my wife So LA, Jay. wipe the She's so good.

No, she's not. She's so good. I'm so jealous. I can't even try to be a cuz Well, I. married a Swedish man. So, I feel like. I'm at a disadvantage like from the. outset. Like, you were basically born in. the ice. Like, come on. Like, of course. you're better at this than I am. That's. amazing. And then we've been playing. pickleball as well. That's our other. thing. Pickleball, well, I love that. I have a pickleball court, but I don't. think I'm going to be. I don't think I'm going to be on it. anytime soon. It's so fun. Do you guys. want to be. over and you can show us how it's done. It's so much fun. And again, it's just.

doing taking on a new project and you. you know, whatever it may be. You've I. love that you were saying like you love. memories and that you kind of almost. have a memory bank. I was going to ask. you, do you think there's a memory in. your life that you've kind of like. locked away or hidden away that you kind. of like it's almost Have you seen that. movie Inception? And it's like he locks it away in the. basement and he never goes there because. it it kind of it has Sometimes it can be. good, bad. It can be anything, but do. you have a memory you've locked away? I. think I probably have a lot of memories. that I've locked away. And um, you know,

it's really interesting. I. We should have maybe done this podcast. back in a month. I'm going to go to the. Hoffman Institute. Oh, yeah, yeah. I. think I have an enormous amount of that. in my life. And I said to you earlier, you know, I think if you're not. I think about my life in terms of like. practice, right? It's like I'm. practicing every day like who I want to. be. And I think that that's a great way. to teach my children because they do. what they see. And I never beat myself. up about my past, who I've been, my.

background, where I came from because I. know that I'm constantly moving and. evolving. And I feel like if you're not. working on yourself, then you're not. really living. Do you know what I mean? I feel like the purpose of my life is to. explore how I can be the best version of. me. And I don't just mean that in. business, I mean in every single facet. of my life. How can I be the best mom. and the best wife and the best boss? Like all of those things that mean a lot. to me. But it takes work and it takes. practice and I don't get it right every.

single day. And when I think, to answer. your question about memories and things. I've locked away, it's when I've not. been proud of my behavior. But those are. always things that I am willing to kind. of hold my hands up to and and work on. And I feel like I've done especially now. I live here. You know, you come and you. do the work, right? It's like it's just. the grown-up thing to do. And I feel. like that's been one of the reasons I've. enjoyed being in LA so much is because. I've had this whole, obviously all the.

success with the businesses, but on this. other side I've had this huge um. awakening in terms of who I am and who. I'm supposed to be and how I'm evolving. as a person. And so, I really feel like. those are things that I'm still. exploring and I will be until the day I. die, you know? I'm always in learning. mode. I love that and you're invited. back afterwards as well. So, you don't. have to worry about the crime rate. No, no, what I mean is. I hope this is not going to be the last. time you come. But um what what's a.

memory that you'd. love to relive or you revisit often. mentally and you close your eyes and. you're like, "Yeah, I'm there. Like I'd love to live. that again because it was. so crazy. I think it's probably, I mean, feel so bad on my kids, but the birth of. my first child. Like that was so insane. and amazing. And it's really funny. because women like often say like. everything changed then, you know, it's. like so and I and for me everything. changed in that moment. I remember. having just had Gray and Jens was.

holding him on like, you know, the side. of the bed and I thought, "I have got to. get out of this bed and go to the. office. And that's all I could think in. my head cuz it was like all of a sudden. I had the reason I was doing all of this. stuff for and it had never become more. clear to me than in that moment. I was. like, okay, like now real life starts. Wow. Yeah. Yeah, that's really how I felt. I. was like, get me back like into the office like. immediately. Oh my gosh. Yeah. Forget.

the baby. Nothing Nothing about going. home and like snuggling with my child. I. was like, I have a reason to do what I'm. doing now. And that can coexist with. loving your kids 100% because again, like you can be so many different. things. It's like, I am a super. nurturing hands-on mom and I really. enjoy motherhood. I just have other. stuff that I like, too. Yeah, yeah. You. know, it's like. you think we struggle to have those two. ideas? society has set it up that you're one or. the other, right? You're either putting. on your heels and like banging out the. door and like don't see your kids and. put them to bed or you're like this.

really sweet mom. It's like, no, I'm. both. I'm actually everything. I am. every woman. Like just like tough. It Do. you know, it's like I think that. actually what it is that you know, there. are all of these like misconceptions. about what you are allowed to be and I. don't think we put those same things on. men because men can be like totally in. the office and killing the deal and like. then just be this incredible dad. throwing like a football on the weekend. It's like you're fully allowed and it's. fine. But for women, it's not so fine.

And so, you know, so much of what I do. in my work and my businesses and. actually just sort of trying to be. honest about me and and how I operate is. to dispel a lot of those myths because I. do think that we are not one-dimensional. and you can be so many different things. and and also so many different things to. different people. You know, I'm one. person to my husband and one to my kids. and if you were to come in my office, I. think they'd give you a whole different. version of me.

I get all of it. It's just though. We all have to There's. all different facets to each part of. ourselves and I wonder. about the level of acceptance, right? Like are you Are you allowed to be that. and is it accepted? And that's why you. know, Jay, it's so interesting. I don't. think I've ever listened to a podcast. where a man has been asked about. imposter syndrome. Not once. It is a. question that is the special reserve for. women. As is the question of balance. No. one says, "Hey Yianni, how you balancing.

it all? The brands and the business and. the kids." No one says that to my. husband. I'm glad they didn't ask both. of those questions. I'll just get out of. here. say it to me every day. Every single. day. What is it like to be a black woman. in business? I'm like, "What kind of. question is that?" You know, but there. are things that for women just like. we're still not able to get over this. idea that we have in our heads that we. can't be many things to many people. And. I just don't believe in that. Yeah. No,

I'm with you. I'm with you. And and and. I really feel that. naturally all those questions are coming. cuz that's what people are scared about. and insecure about and worried about and. it's as you said it's come because it's. been created in society. I read a There. was this research paper a long time ago. and I won't get it absolutely accurate, but the point was that when men and. women look at a job application, if men can do some of it, they'll apply. And even if if women can't do one part. of it, they won't apply. I see that every single day in my own. office, right? A guy will work for me.

for 6 months and come and ask me for a. pay rise. And then I will say to a. woman, "I don't think you've had a pay. rise for like a year and a half." Like. Do you know what I mean? It's like or. somebody that will come in and say like, "I speak absolutely fluent Spanish." And. a woman who's pretty 90% there won't. even mention it on her resume. So there are those obvious things and. that's just about, you know, so many. times for women there is this natural. nurturers. We naturally play down our. skills, and I think that that is just.

something that society has taught us. And so, I think about it all the time. I'm quite the opposite, you know, I I'll. go in and pretend I can do anything in a. in in a pitch meeting or it's like I'll. say what needs to say to get it done. Do. you know what I mean? Um but, I do think. that for so many women there is this. like sort of magical golden moment in. your life where you're free of a lot of. constraints, you know, maybe you don't. have a mortgage, you don't have children. yet, you're not in a really serious.

relationship where there is this moment. to be incredibly selfish. And for most. women, when all of the responsibilities. pile on, they stop doing that. And I. think that actually just as women we. would do better to be selfish for longer. in our lives. And that's the type of. thing and and so many people will be. like, "Oh, I just don't like the word. Like, can't you find another way to. dress it up?" Absolutely no, because I. mean what I say. You do have to think. about yourself because nobody else is. thinking about that for you. Everybody. else is too busy thinking about this.

themselves. And so, this idea of being. selfish shouldn't feel like such a. foreign thing for women or a dirty word. for women. It's like you have to be. There is no other way to get ahead and. to do what you want to do. You have to. put your needs and your uh wants and. your ambition first because no one is. going to do that for you. Yeah, and it's. hard, isn't it, when like you were. saying you've tried to be the boss that. you didn't have. I can identify with. that. I try and be the boss bosses that. I didn't have.

And I think it. is really wonderful when you see a great. relationship building with people you. work with where they recognize you're. being the boss that they never had as. well, and you are too, and you're also. realizing they're being a great person. of your team that that hasn't been like. other people have been. How have you learned to like sense that. and know that when you're like, "Okay, well, me and this person can go and. build together and create together, or. this is the right person to recruit onto. my team." Or like, what are the things. that you're looking at and trying to.

decipher? Because I think right now, we. do live in a world where also people are. thinking about a job as a paycheck, and. they don't care. Whereas you're very. passionate, you're very driven. You. always have been since the deli. So, it's like, if you've cared that much. about the deli and the sandwich, obviously you care so much about what. you do today. Totally. How How do you do that? Well, you know, I think I'm really. realistic. Because you will have those. people in your business that come to. work with you literally because, you. know, a good American, we are B Corp. registered, right? And people feel that. they want to work in a company that.

cares about the environment, that cares. about what they're putting out. And. you'll get people that care about the. mission and the vision and the values. But I don't expect that everybody will. care. I know that there are some people. that just come, and they just want their. paycheck. And so, for me, I try to. separate. who I am and what I might need from what. somebody else might need. My expectation. is that not everybody's in there trying. to kill it for me, right? I'm pretty. sure that a lot of these people come in. and they do their job, and they're. working on their side hustle halfway. through the day. And that's okay, you.

know? It's like, that's not for. everyone. And I think that as I've got. older, I've learned not to put my. uh my type of ambition. on, you know, or not to try to reflect. that onto everybody that's around me. And those people, well, of course, they'll rise to the top, they'll make. themselves known. But it isn't for. everybody, you know? It's just It's just. a fact. And And also, you need that when. you're building a team. If everybody. wasn't ambitious, it would be a monster, it would be a disaster. You know? You. need people that are happy to come in,

grind, do their job, and leave at 5:00. That's just facts. absolutely. How did you make that leap? Like, you just said earlier, I'm just. connecting the dots. You were like, "I. was never around anyone who was an. entrepreneur or had their own business. Everyone worked a job.". Yeah. How did you. Accident, Jay Shetty. Accident. Go on. It was a total accident because, you know, I never set out to start my. own company. I was frustrated that I. wasn't being paid enough where I worked. and then was like, "All right, well, if.

you don't like that, then you're going. to have to do something else." But, I. was also acutely aware that no one was. going to come and hand me a company on a. plate. Like, "Here's this company to. run, you person with no experience and, you. know, you kind of jumped up. 24-year-old." And so, I was very like. acutely aware that I'd have to do it. myself. Um and that's where it came. from. Like, you know, I'd love to say. that I had this like great idea and this. great ambition, but it came out of like. frustration and not being paid enough. and feeling like I wasn't getting the. value back that I put in. That's the.

honest answer. Yeah, no, and I think that's very. relatable. I think most people are in. positions like that, but that doesn't. lead to the courage. Yes, to do it. to do it because we feel like, "Well, what if it doesn't work? What will my. friends say?" What, you know, and all. those kind of things that come up. because we're scared. Even for me, like, I remember I had a steady job and I was. I This is after I'd left the monastery. I'd come back home. I'd finally found a. steady job. I was dating my. a good sentence, "After I left the. monastery." Isn't it good? You just have.

to wind that in anywhere. You'd be like, "So, after I left the monastery.". I was just trying to give context. This. is This is the British banter that. Emma's like really I love it. I love it. I don't have a sentence like that and I. want one. I might just take it. After Bang it out. You've got to be fair. You've got You've. got plenty. But, no, the So, I was in this steady. job and it was like I was dating my. now wife and. I remember going, "This is not working.

for me." Like, and I wasn't killing it. and I wasn't doing badly. I was I was. doing all right. But, I just knew it wasn't my place. And. I remember I probably spent. two years there feeling that way. Totally. Right? And you kind of just. you're just thinking about it, reflecting on it. You're like, "What do. I do? What if it doesn't work?" And so, walk us through that a little bit. because I think a lot of our listeners. may actually be feeling that way. A lot. of our audience is actually listening. going, "You know what? I'd love to. I'd love forget doing what Emma's done.

now. I just love to get out where I am. now because it's it's You know what I. mean? I think the truth of it was that I've. never been that scared of failing, right? And for me, at that time in my. life, I was making a small amount of. money. It's fair to say that I didn't. have any, you know, no one was relying. on me to to pay rent. I had a tiny, tiny. little I lived in like a high-rise in. East London with no front door and a. gate on the door. No oven, just a. microwave, no fridge. I put my milk on. the balcony. Just to paint the picture.

of like where I was at that time in my. life. It was rough. And honestly, what I. thought is that. how could I lose? Like at this point, I. could always go and get another, similarly, not inspiring job. And so, that idea of like fear of not failing. was really key. But I also. was really I've always been very honest. with myself. Like, you know, everybody. has a voice in their head. And some. people have a voice that like chats them. up, you know, it's like I do. But I also. have that voice that's like, "Emma, like.

know what you don't know. Like, don't be. too silly in this situation." So, I. think that I really in that instance. where I decided like let's get out of. this job and try to go and do something. else. It was. enough understanding of it wasn't that. good where I was. If it really didn't. work out, I could always get back into. something like that. But also, that that. thing that just says, "What happens if. you don't do it?" You know, like for me, I was miserable and I really saw a.

better life for myself and I was like, "I will just regret this when I'm 35, for example." And so, it was really. about just going like, you know, no. one's going to take a chance on me. I. have to take the chance on me. And then. maybe someone else will be inspired to. take a chance on me, which is ultimately. what happened. I left that role. I got. employed in another job. And then when I. got into that job, my now husband and business partner at. the at that time, they kind of saw me. and they were like, "Well, this girl's.

like kind of good. She has something.". And they ended up being my first. investors when I was 25 years old. That's incredible, isn't it? Which was. which was crazy which to me, even at the. time, it felt crazy. And I remember. questioning and I was like, "Why would. anyone invest in me?" And then I. thought, "No, of course they'll invest. in me. Who else are you going to invest. in?" Like, "You might as well. I'm as. good as anybody else out there." And. that's when that thing started kicking. in. So, I think sometimes you've just. got to not be too afraid to lose. And. you know, the truth is, Jay, I have lost and failed more times than.

I've succeeded, right? We don't talk. about that. That's not in the articles. They don't post that on Instagram. But. that's just the facts. Like, I've made. so many mistakes. Before I got here and. had three very successful companies, I. had a dog of an agency that I opened. here in a very successful business that. was thriving in London and thriving in. New York, and I opened an office in LA, and I embarrassed myself. I completely. let the you know, I let the company. down. I let the ball down. I let the. staff down. I under-invested. I did all.

of the classic mistakes. And, you know, at the time I felt like it was the end. of like my company and my career, but it. wasn't. It was just a failure. I've had. lots of things like that happen. Lots. of, you know, public embarrassments and. things that didn't work out. And it's, you know, sounds like such an obvious. thing, but it's like, "Well, well, how. do you recover from that?" And so, for. me it's like always been this thing of. like, "All right, well, I'll dust myself. off. I've survived worse, you know?" And. I think a lot of that comes from my. upbringing. You know, it's like you see.

a lot of stuff go down and you can get. through things. And I think I'm pretty. good at getting through things. is that Quincy moment where I'm like, I. didn't even know. Like, you know, it's. like See, there you go. Yeah, it's amazing. It's just like you. just, you know, you it's so fascinating. how quickly we are It's It's so. fascinating how quickly we point out. people's faults and then forget about. them. 100%. And And it's so that happens so fast. not as fun a story, right? People want. At the end of the day, I believe in, you know, the goodness of.

humans. We default want good good stuff. for each other and we want to see each. other win. And people are very happy to. celebrate alongside you. You're much. more concerned about your failures. You're much more concerned about your. fears than anybody else out there. And I. think every now and again I kind of just. have to tune myself back into to that. piece of it. Yeah, and it sounds like What I really. like is that you've got this ability and. I've been watching the whole interview. and it's like you've got this ability to. know what the different voices in your. head are.

Yes. very clear about like, this is the one. that's being real. This is the ego. This. is giving me the hype that I need right. now. 100%. But also, you know, I know they're. voices. I know they're not me. Yeah. And I always knew that. Because I have. an ability, like, my whole superpower in. life is about being able to turn it on. and off. And so, I am acutely aware that. those are just things and that I have at. my disposal and sometimes they work to. my advantage and sometimes they work to. my disadvantage. But I don't think that. it's me. Does that make sense? Like, it's like I know who I am. Like, like it.

ain't all of that. It's not the chatter. None of it. It's just I'm something. else. Yeah, it's I mean, that's a incredible. distinction to know and have and build. Did that come from Did you read. something? Did you learn something? Or. was it just you started listening to. yourself? Did you spend a lot of time. alone? I'm intrigued as to what you did. to gain that skill because it's a skill. and you're obviously aware of it. I think I'm just that like Oprah. generation. Do you know what I mean? Like, you come home right? you you come. home every day from school, Oprah was on. the TV telling you to be grateful. You.

think, "What What do I have to be. grateful for? Have you seen my house? Have you seen my trainers? I need new. shoes." Like, you know, and it's like I. didn't get it then, but I started to. believe it and I started to read, you. know, I am an avid reader. I read so. much everything and always have since I. was 13. And again, it was that means of. escapism and so I started reading things. like, you know, The Power of Now or like. you know, like all of these. things that like Conversations with God. I remember, you know, it's like I read.

that book and I was like. like just blew my mind cuz I didn't know. anybody that thought like that. Um and. so maybe I just absorbed it, bit of. Oprah, bit of a couple of books. You know? And it it went in. Like I. understood it and it made sense to me. No, it's as simple as that. And I the. same generation, like we I grew up in. the same way and. it's so true how like these tiny little. messages just start connecting dots and. and that's kind of what kids are built. on and and young people are built on. It. isn't You could have heard the same.

thing at school every day, but because. it wasn't simplified and easy and. digestible. You don't remember it, but. you remember the random TV show you. watched. Your parents had one in the. background. Yeah, so true. amazing. Yeah, no, I love I love. witnessing it in an interview with. someone where you like, "Wow, this. person is so aware." And I want to talk. more about Hopefully this is what you. don't get to talk about as much or maybe. like you're saying like men get asked. this stuff and maybe women don't. I'm. intrigued. But like we were talking. earlier, you're a brand marketing. genius. Like you you you're super.

attentive, aware, conscious. You have. this ability to think about products and. brand in a different way. How do you. select problems to solve? How do you. choose which problems you want to work. on and then make sure that you build. something that actually solves that. problem? I think about it in the sense. of myself. I think it would be very. difficult for me, and I'm not saying. other people can't do it, but to. do things that you can't relate to, right? So, I always start with the idea.

that if it's a problem for me, likelihood is it's a problem for other. people like me, whether that be other. young women or other women in the middle. of America, but it's like the starting. point is always, what do I find. problematic? And then I think the lens. and the the kind of red thread that goes. through all of my companies is this idea. that and again, I hate saying it because. in the last kind of 5 years it's almost. become like this sort of buzzword, but. when we think about inclusivity in.

business and what that actually means, including and thinking about the most. amount of people possible. When I. started Good American, it was actually a. reaction to. this idea that so many women, women of. color, plus-size women, are just. completely left out of the fashion. conversation. And why is their dollar. any less valuable than anybody else's? And so I had worked in marketing for all. of these years, for 15 years I grew this.

incredible agency, and I'd done castings. and, you know, put projects and. collaborations together for the biggest. and best brands in the whole world, and. I'd been part of actually falsifying an. image of inclusivity. You know, it's. like you have a good cast, you need a. black girl and an Asian girl and then. this and this and this, and it actually. when you thought about the product and. when you thought about the senior. management of those companies, it looked. nothing like that, right? It just the. product didn't work for anyone over a. certain size, and the boardrooms were.

just all made up of typically like white. men making the decisions usually for. women, and I just sort of thought to. myself, there must be a better way to. start a company, but it came from. problem-solving for myself. And I go. back to this idea of like, you know, when you think about businesses, it makes more sense that they would be. geared towards serving more people. That's just good business, right? Forget. D E and I, forget like, you know, this.

idea of diversity, equity, inclusion. doing some being something that. companies need to do now. It's just good. business. And when I talk about it this. idea of inclusivity and diversity being. a superpower in business, it's not something that I just say, it's. something that I do. That's where the. process actually starts. I'm thinking. about how can I best serve customers, the most amount of people. And then when. there's an acknowledgement of someone. who isn't usually acknowledged, of. course it goes without saying that. suddenly they feel seen, they feel.

heard, and they're like, "I'm going with. this girl. I'm going with this brand.". because it's the first time anyone's. spoken directly to them. And I think. that that's such a it's such an under. thought about part of business. You. know, people usually bolt it on at the. end. Yeah, yeah. like, "No, no, no, no, it's right where. you start. It's in the inception of. those products. It's in making 32 sizes. It's in doing nine different shades. It's in the very, very beginnings of. what you're creating." And then you can. dress it up and make it look nice and.

put the right kind of branding on it, but actually it starts way earlier than. that. And so I I actually think about. customers in a way that I think most. people don't. Where did you not learn. that, but where did you learn to look to. understand that obviously it started. with yourself, but I'm like, "Why didn't. people do that before?" Cuz like you. just said, it's better business, it's. better financially, it makes more sense, it makes more people happy. What do you. think blocks companies? comes from where decisions are being. made, right? Because it's like you don't. know what you don't know. And I've sat.

in enough rooms trying to pitch enough. businesses to a group of people that. aren't my end audience. And I have. actually said in in meetings before, "Maybe you should phone your wife or. daughter." Like literally, like phone. them. Because you don't understand this. because it's not for you. You know? And. so I think that decisions are made in. such a abstract way in most companies. And you know, you see this when you. know, companies make mistakes, right? There we've seen a lot of like big. fashion brands and big consumer brands.

make mistakes that have seemingly kind. of come across as like insensitive, racist, completely misogynistic. That's. just where a decision is made. A company. isn't inherently racist, the whole. company. It's just the decision-making. process is flawed. I.e. there's not. enough people in the room of a different. background to say, "Hey, perhaps put the. t-shirt on the other kid." Like then it. won't be an issue. So I think that this. just comes from the the idea of like. where are the decisions made in that. company and who's making the decisions.

And I know that the more people you. bring around the table from different. backgrounds. just talking about race. here, we're talking about age, education, the full gambit. Like the. better the company will be. Yeah, that. is such great. I I love what you just. said about asking someone to call their. partner or their daughter or their son. or whatever it may be because you're so. right. Like I think so many people sit. in meetings. And they're looking around going, "These people don't know what they're. talking about." Or like they just don't. understand. How have you maintained like.

I guess the question is how many of. those meetings have uh did you have to. sit in until you felt like, "I'm just. going to do this." Or we're just going. to figure it out. Or did you look for. someone who. agreed with you and had your values and. did the research? Or was it kind of like. we're just going to build it ourselves? Like how much Give give us a bit of that. because I think a lot of people say to. me. You know, it's so interesting. I'm at. that point in my career now where I. don't sit in a lot of meetings. Now they. pitch me. Which is lovely. The shoe's on the other. foot. I'm like, "Come over here and I'll.

let you know if you can come in.". Good for you. I love that. I love that. the early days, you know, I I think that. I sat in a lot of situations feeling. like. um. You know, the great thing is I never. doubted myself or any of those ideas. I. just thought I hadn't found the right. people yet. It's a little bit like you. can you know, I'm happy to kiss a lot of. frogs and I always have been because. again, I don't think it should be so. easy. When you're doing something that. is new and without so much definition.

and unproven like it's supposed to be. hard and again, it's like anything. I. never let it get to me. I just was like. Poor poor chicken. He doesn't get it yet. and he will do and he'll kick himself, you know? And that's fine. You know, it's just. it's part of it and I don't mean that in. a smug way, but I never I never doubted. what I was doing. I was very very clear. especially when we started Good. American. I was like, this thing people. don't understand and. we'll just get them to understand it.

Yeah, definitely. Yeah, no, and I think. that's such a great mindset to have and. to not have the the smugness or. bitterness It's accurate. It's accurate. You don't know what you don't know, right? space. They didn't get it. It's totally. totally cool. I feel like that all the. time. I'm like, I'm trying to find the. people who want to be part of this story. and if they don't want to be a part of. this story, that's totally cool. Of course because they won't be great. partners to you down the line, right? It's like you either get it and you want. to be part of it and you are happy to. know that you don't know it all, right?

Because it's it's about new space. If. like if we were all doing the same thing. and trying to set up the same companies, we'd never find a Skims. You know, it's. like you'd never land on it. You'd be. like, that's too complicated. That's not. how we do things and and you'd skip over. the great stuff. How have you managed to. continue to stay. hungry and also stay innovative when. things are good? Like before you talk. about I didn't like my job. I wanted to. get out. You know, milk was outdoors. I. was you know, like there's a there's a. pain that pushes you in a better.

direction. I'm not saying you don't have. pain anymore. Of course, there's. stresses and challenges. that much pain. I have daily I have daily dramas, but. the pain is gone. You know what it is? You are fueled. every day by. a piece of it is competition, right? It's like I I look at everything. There's no one who knows more about. jeans and knickers than I do. I look at. every competitor. I go out in the. market. I see it. I know like the. promotion and all cadence. I know.

everything everybody else is doing. And. I think that that that natural um. inquisitiveness is part of what keeps me. good. Um but at the end of the day, it's. like I just want to win. Mhm. You know, it's like I don't feel satisfied. And. also it's like, how could you? It's just. been a couple of years. There's loads of. people that have had successes for six. and for three years. I don't think. that's the end goal. The end goal is to. build like you know, generational or. generationally defining businesses. And.

that doesn't happen quickly. And also. I'm not stupid enough to think like or. to let a few years success get to me. There's a lot of people that had a few. years success, you know? That's not the. end game. And so I think about Now it's. about. you know, really taking the foundations. of what we built, not sacrificing any of. your principles, and still being able to. grow and to thrive and to hire people. But that gets more and more difficult.

the bigger you get, right? There's one. thing saying, "Oh, we're going to do. business this way." when there are 10 of. you and you're doing a million dollars. It's very, very different all these. years in because there's there's no. model. There's nothing that you can go. out and emulate. We are making it up as. we're going along. Yeah. How do you How. do you define winning now? Like is that. how you define winning or You know, I. define winning now by doing things that. excite me. Like, you know, it's like we. just launched this insane push-up bra at. Skims and everyone's talking about it. It's all over the place and you know,

like that's exciting to me because like. some one of my girls in England will. call me and be like, "Oh my god, I need. to get that bra." You know, it's like I. love that. And I still get a thrill. from, you know, it's like I love what I. do. Like I genuinely really love it. And. I just want to keep getting better at. it. And for me it comes in so many. different ways. It's like I love giving. people opportunities. I love the hiring. part of it and getting to work with all. different people. And I think that those. things for me feel really successful.

But if you'd ask me just to like boil it. down, it would be like to continue the. growth in what we're doing without. sacrificing the principles that we set. the companies up with. Mhm. Right, right, right. Yeah. I don't want to. dilute down because we're, you know, reaching some kind of like critical. mass. Yeah. Yeah. How How do you. you know, we were talking about that. You have daily dramas, you said not. pains. Nobody talks to me when things are going. well. My life is just a series of problems, you know, from the minute I wake up to.

you know, the minute I go to bed. Like. that's just a fact. The stress level is. unbelievable. And I do think that it's. important because. you wouldn't know that looking at me or. maybe just speaking to me, but you know, my my job is not all, you know, trying different fabrics out and hanging. around with models. Like that's just not. what I do. Exactly. Yeah, what what do. you find to be the most stressful thing. about building a business and what do. you do in order to.

deal with it? I think the most stressful. thing is probably the expectations, right? That that comes from the outside. I honestly believe you're only as good. as your last launch. I never ever drink. the Kool-Aid, ever. Um, and I think that, you know, I happen. to work in extremely high-profile. businesses where everything that we do. is scrutinized and with that comes a. level of stress. It comes back to that. thing of being very ritualistic. I, you. know, um, militant about the things that. work for me. You know, I suffer with.

migraines. I get super, um, you know, I. carry stress like in my body. And so. it's like I get up very early. I wake up. I work out. I meditate. I make sure I. have to be up before my children are up. because I need like. quiet time. I need time to like focus. I'm like religiously grateful. Like I've. trained myself to focus on the great. stuff in my life because I feel like. there is so much noise, you know,

whether I like it or not. And so I could. be overwhelmed every day in the things. that are going on around me. And at the. end of it, I'm like looking up going, "Wow, the ceiling in my bedroom, like. how could you even have a ceiling?" I. could never imagine that I'd have such a. beautiful ceiling ever. You know, it's. like I am someone who truly stops to. smell the roses. Like quite literally. I. can find good happiness, joy in in. anything. And I really make it a point. and a priority to do that every day. And. even as I have my tea, you know, it's.

like I have special tea from Japan and I. have a special pot that I put it in. And. I just like taste it and every day it's. like I'm tasting it for the first time. But if I didn't do those things, I would. lose my mind. You know, I would lose my. mind. And so I think I've just trained. myself to like enjoy the the kind of the. rituals and the small things and be. hyper grateful because there is no. difference between me and all of those. kids that I went to school with in East. London. And I should be so lucky. It's.

like we're here in the sunshine. overlooking the whole of LA. I'm. chatting to you. I'm going to go into my. office where I'm the boss and people are. going to film me chatting about stuff. Like. I don't have anything to complain about. Yeah. But but I bet, and from what I've. learned today, you were like that even. when the milk was outside. 100% almost. I was like at least I have a balcony. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I don't have a fridge, but I have a. balcony. Yeah, because because if it wasn't there. then it wouldn't be there now.

100%. Yeah. 100%. If you went on a walk with little Emma. as a memory, you like held hands and you. went on a little walk with her, uh what do you think she'd say to you? I. think she'd say, "Well done, love. You did it. Keep going. Keep going." Yeah, I think. so. What would you say back? I'd say, "I. am.". Well, I'm trying. I'm doing it. I'm. doing it. I'm walking forward now. Stop putting pressure on me. I always sit here and I think, "Oh my. goodness, like I'm so proud of myself.".

But honestly, Jay, when I think about. what that means for me now and the level. of responsibility that I feel, that is the thing that really fuels me. today, because when I do something, I. feel a weight and an expectation of a. group of people that have been. historically left out and marginalized. from a lot of these conversations and a. lot of these opportunities. And there is. this huge sense of responsibility that I. have for women, especially sort of young.

black women and minority women, and kids. that just grew up poor anywhere. Like I. think about all that stuff every single. day. And I think that real success for. me will be when I am, you know, able to. really. pour what I've got and what it is that I. kind of like strive for and continue to. achieve and and have that affect a lot. more people. And I do that in ways, you.

know, like through my chairmanship of. the 15% pledge. That's been like a huge. undertaking and an amazing amount of. work that I have been able to do. But. for me, it's like is only kind of. scratching the surface, and I think more. and more of my work will be in how can I. help so many more people that are like. me, you know, get out of their. circumstances and be able to contribute. more because it just is. mesmerizing to me that I've been able to.

go so far. And it ain't because I'm. something special. It's because there. were a series of circumstances and then. enough kind of grit and determination. that I was able to do it. And so, it's. like, how do you put other people into. the same circumstances so that if they. have the will that they can do it, too. And so, that's where I'm fixated right. now. What's been one of your favorite. success stories from that? Or like a. memory or story from that was. know, it's so funny cuz it happens again. in the small in the smallest ways, right? It's like, I'll have a chat I get.

hundreds of people reach out to me to. say, "Listen, I'm starting a business. I, you know, I'm selling $10,000 a month. in this carbon brand." And it's like, I'll jump on the phone and I'll give. someone some advice. Like, you know, I. had a girl a couple of years ago. She. was like, "I think I'm going to get into. Selfridges and I want to know how to do. that. How do I structure the contract?". Anyway, fast forward 2 years later, I do. my first ever like ask me anything cuz. my team pressured me into it. Um I'm like, social is just not my vibe. But anyway, so I do the first ask me. anything and all the girls are asking me.

the same questions, right? How do you. start a business? How do you thrive? Da. da da. And this girl comes up and then. she says, "I just want to let you know. that I now do however many tens of. thousands a week at Selfridges." And it. was all because you helped me walk. through that contract and I took your. advice and I, you know, I stuck to the. distribution plan and did it. And I was. like, "Oh my god!" You know, And so, it's always those tiny things for me. Um. and again, that's just about giving. someone your time. So, I'm really trying. to think thoughtfully about how I can do. more of that in a.

a more systematic and a and a bigger way. because sadly, I can't answer every. phone call or every DM that comes. through. What are you talking about? That's so. beautiful and I I think that that. component is such a big part of. happiness and success. Like. it is. Because you're so right. Like no. one who's. got to the top is any more special. Just. going back to what your mom said at the. beginning. It's like You ain't better. than anyone else. And as soon as you. start thinking it or people also start. thinking it that oh yeah, that person's. there because they're faster, smarter,

better. Or when we do the opposite when. we go, they don't deserve to be there. I. should be. Exactly. No. Both of those just take it. away and uh. 100%. I I look at your journey and I'm. I'm so. I I I like really admire the way you. live and think. Oh, thanks. Like it's. really it's it's such a wonderful. mindset and it's such a strong you've. been able to craft something that's so. resilient. And and you can. a good word. And yeah, it's so what. you've been able to build and and I'm. talking about almost like if we were to.

physically look at your mindset, it's so resilient because I can hear as. we've from so many different points of. view. It's like you have such a clear. philosophy on how you live, who you are, what matters, what doesn't matter. Yeah. And I look at that clarity when I. when I see you as like that's the reason. you are who you are and where you are. It's because you're just so clear. And. and I feel like no matter what what. would happen either way, it's like that. is what you're betting on and that's. what you've been building and focused.

on. I think so. Yeah. I think so. Someone write that down. I really mean it. I really mean it. It's so kind. It's so kind. No. I love that you say that. It makes me It. makes me so happy because you never. think about yourself in such clear terms. like that, right? It never. You are who you are in so many ways, you. know? And I see that with my own kids. They're like four people that I think. you got exactly the same upbringing. We. all live in the same house. I don't do. one thing different. And yet they are. just these like four tiny individuals.

And at six months is like, you know. exactly what kind of kid you've got. Like you know if this kid is like super. anxious, if this kid is super obnoxious. Like you know exactly who they are. I'm. sure there's lots of things and changes. coming in their lives, but so much of it. is just in you, right? And you know, and. then you lay a circumstances onto that. And you know what you're capable of, what you can and can't affect, and what. you should be doing. And then so I. always look at it as like I was living. like a very nice, very privileged life.

in England. And I moved here. specifically for work. And it's been. wonderful for work, but in so many other. facets of my life, being in LA has been. an eye-opener. And it's actually fueled. me in a way that I really never. expected. And I always think, you know, if you elevate your health, you elevate. your life. It's like if you elevate your. thinking, you elevate, you know, what. your capabilities are. And so for me. it's just been wonderful and an amazing. moment to be here because I've been able. to elevate so many things that I do. And.

I think that that should only end up in. like a a bunch of other people being. able to benefit from that. Absolutely. Well said. Write that down. Print it. out. That was Yeah, no, that absolutely. Like I think. it's it's incredible how, you know, I. think a lot of people label LA as. Hollywood and think of it as just that. But it's like I feel the same way as. you. Like moving here, like my eyes have. opened up to so many more things that. Totally. that are really valuable, important, insightful. I've met people.

who are doing incredible things. You. know, what you just said now of like. opening the door and trying to break. down we had, you know, just a few months. ago we had Lewis Hamilton here talking. about 44 and talking about how he's. trying to help you know, trying to help. people of color get into the world of. Formula 1, which which is a normal which. him and his father were able to do. Like. you you start seeing that happen across. fashion, sports, business. And and. that's so incredible because you start. thinking about all those little Emma's. and little Lewis's and and everyone else. out there.

Totally. Who who's just trying to figure. out whether they have a shot. Yeah. And. 100%. Yeah. Emma, we we end every episode with. a final five, which we sit down and do. as a fast five, which means every answer. has to be one word to one sentence. maximum. One word to one sentence, all right. I'll rein myself in. I always ruin it because I get. intrigued. So, all right. Okay. So, Emma. Grey, these are your final five. The. first question is, what is the best. advice you've ever heard or received? I.

wish that I could make this sound as. powerful as it was for me. It's the. first thing to say, but it's a good one. It was to make a decision and move on. Mhm. Because you can be so stifled by. your decisions. And when you are just. stuck, it just does so many other things. to you. And so, I think it's served me. really well in so many ways. I I used to. think about it just for business, and. now I don't. I think it's make a. decision and move on. Yeah. Yeah, I. always say to people, stop trying to. make the right decision. Just make a decision and then make it.

right. Totally. You know, you. 100%. You can go back. You can go back. afterwards. Yeah. I love that. That's. great. We've never had that on the show. I love that. Uh question number two, what is the worst advice you've ever. heard or received? Stay in your lane. What was the lane? Oh, I don't know, but. someone was trying to stifle me. And. lucky enough, I listened to my little. Emma inside and gave her a big old beep. I love that. Never stay in your lane. But it's interesting cuz I think all the.

growth in my life has come when I have. stepped outside of whatever lane I was. in at that time. And so, it useless. advice, Absolutely. Uh question number three, how would. someone who doesn't know you that well. describe you in three words? I wish if you're listening to this, you. just missed out on the best facial. expression. You need to go to YouTube. right now. It's always such a worry. I mean, goodness me, the things I've been. called. How would someone describe me? I.

think they would describe me as like. kind. Mhm. I'm a kind person. Ambitious. And like not to be messed around with. Got it. I like it. I like the third one, not to be messed around. think of that the one word, right? I. know, I know, that's good, yeah. I think. that's what people think about me. And. also tough. Yeah. Tough. Tough, yeah. Kind but tough. Yeah. There you go. And ambitious. Question number four, how. would someone who knows you very deeply. describe you in three words?

Sensitive. Very thoughtful. And um. tough. That's brilliant. We need to get your husband on the. podcast as well. Yeah, to verify. Just to verify, for. sure. He got tough, tough, and tough. I. love it. And Emma, your final question, uh fifth and final question, if you. could create one law that everyone in. the world had to follow, what would it be? You know, very specifically for the time. we're in right now, it would be to lead.

with kindness. Mhm. Nothing else. Yeah. We need it in in. every little interaction. In everything. It's so powerful and it's what I teach. my kids, you know, it's like. just be kind. Mhm. Like it doesn't take. much and it goes so unbelievably far. Mhm. You know, and when I say that about. myself being kind, it's like that is. something that I think about every. single day. Mhm. Like.

how am I treating people? What do people. get from me? And I'm talking about. everyone. Mhm. You know, like everyone. Mhm. It's just a fact. Just be kind. Emma, great. Thank you for coming on on. purpose. This was incredible. Everyone. who's been listening and watching, wherever you are, whether you're walking. your dog, whether you're at the gym, whether you're driving to or from work, whether you're listening with your. friends, I want you to know that please. go and tag me and Emma in the moment. that stood out to you. Maybe there's a. quote, maybe there's There was so much.

wisdom sprinkled across this entire. episode. I hope that you find the ones. that resonate with you. I hope that this. helps you make a shift in your career. I. hope this helps you make a shift in your. mindset about how you're trying to. balance what's going on in your world. I. hope this helps you think differently. about the choices and decisions you're. about to make. Please, please, please. tag me and Emma across social media to. let us know what stood out to you. Please show her a ton of love. Emma, thank you for doing this. Thank you for. opening up. Thank you for being so real. and wonderful to spend this much time.

with. Oh, it's been a pleasure. I've loved. every second. I'm so grateful to you. too. Me too. Thank you, Emma. Thank you. If you love this episode, you will also. love my interview with Kendall Jenner on. setting boundaries to increase happiness. and healing your inner child. You could be reading something that. someone is saying about you and being. like, "That is so unfair cuz that's not. who I am." And that really gets to me. sometimes. But then looking at myself in. the mirror and being like, "But I know. who I am. Why does anything else. matter?".