Relationship Coach Reveals What Actually Makes It Last

What's the difference between wanting a. relationship and being ready for a. relationship? Mhm. One of my favorite. ways to frame this, uh, which I think we.

can all relate to, is you shouldn't go. grocery shopping when you're starving. Mhm. We don't tend to make the best. choices. We grab the first thing we see, we grab all the things that we want that. look exciting, right? Ooh, that'll taste. so good. I want this, I want that. Not. necessarily what we need. And that, in my opinion, applies to. dating and relationships as well. When. you go out into the world, you start. dating, you're looking for a. relationship, you want to have a pretty. solid understanding of what it is that. you're looking for. You want to have a. pretty solid understanding of how you. love yourself, how you show up for.

yourself, uh, the life you want to. create for yourself, the relationship. that would be an added bonus to that. life that you want to create. Rather. than feel like you're trying to fill a. void. You end up seeking connections. from a place of desperation that that. can't be fulfilling because it's. essentially pouring into a bottomless. pit of uh trying to fill this this. bottomless void. So, in my opinion, asking yourself those. questions first, really spending time. understanding who you are, what you. want, how you can love yourself, how you.

can support yourself, how you can commit. to building a life you like, and the. relationship that could be a bonus. I. also want to add the caveat that it's. not as if you have to go hide away, do. all of those things, and then come out. and find the relationship. It can it can. happen at pretty much the same time with. the focus being on understanding all the. things I just said, who you are, what. you want, etc., and not go looking for. love when you are, uh, metaphorically. starving. I love that truth bomb. That's. that's huge already, that idea that.

we're constantly looking for love when. we're starving rather than being really. really clear and being in a healthy. sense of hunger. Like you have an. appetite, Right. but you're not starving. because we all know that when you're. starving, you're so spot on. I I think. about all I was I was literally going. through all the bad decisions I've made. At the grocery store. >> store. Oh, what I eat when I'm starving. I will pull up at a gas station. I will. buy two bags of chips, you. >> bar. >> Yeah, totally. Like everything that you.

don't want to be having. >> Right. And then on the way home, you're. regretting it. >> And you love it while you're eating it. >> 100%. >> while it's there, right? And it's all. this is everything that I wanted, and. then 10 minutes later, you're probably. hungry again, you're probably crashed. out from the sugar high, you need a nap, and you feel even more exhausted and. still hungry after you're done. Yeah. >> I feel like that just directly applies. to the kind of relationships, the kind. of connections that we choose when we're. we're acting from that place of. starvation, desperation, um, emptiness.

Yeah. And and the hard part about that. is that it's so real today to feel that. way, to feel lonely, to feel desperate, to feel not chosen. What do we do with all those emotions. then because we're used to running for. the quick solve because those emotions. are so heavy and hard to sit in. What do. you do with all those emotions when. you're not getting to just curb your. craving by getting some fast food or. fast love? Build self-trust. Self-trust is imperative.

for liking who you are, understanding. who you are, making decisions that align. with who you really want to be, and of. course, that pays off in our. relationships. There there are four C's. when it comes to self-trust, in my. opinion. First one is curiosity. Are you. curious about who you are, why you do. what you do, the feelings that you feel, um, your motives and intentions behind. the decisions that you make, what you. want out of life? Is there curiosity? You can't trust yourself if you don't.

know yourself. And from curiosity can. come comprehension. So, it's really. important that you lead with curiosity. The second one is capacity. So, that's. emotional flexibility, emotional. stability. Like you like you just asked, what do we do with these big emotions? You build the capacity to stay anchored. in who you are even when you feel really. sad, even when you feel really helpless. or hopeless or overwhelmed, angry, frustrated. Can you find an anchor in. yourself that you can support yourself. through all of those emotions? That's.

capacity. The third one is compassion. Having humanity for who you are, having. an understanding that you are a flawed. human who makes some poor decisions. sometimes, right? And being able to meet. yourself with a softness, with a warmth, is imperative. Like it's absolutely. paramount. And we're talking a lot about. relationships here today. If you aren't compassionate with. yourself, you'll be far less likely to. be compassionate with the people around. you and and your significant other and.

such. The changes we want to make don't. typically happen from a place of. rigidity, blame, shame, judgment. They. happen from a place of compassion and. support and love. And then finally, the. fourth one is commitment. The fourth C. is commitment. Your commitment, your. devotion to being who you want to be, making decisions that really align with. that, and building a life that feels so. fulfilling, so good from within, there's. no way around it. You can have the first. three if you don't have the commitment. to bringing who you want to be to.

fruition, to building that life, things. go astray. So, you need that fourth one. as well. >> I like the four C's. Thank you. >> Yeah, and they feel like. they take a lot of time. I can't imagine. doing that in a month or 3 months. And. like you said, I think I think our idea. around doing work before dating, and you. alluded to this in a healthy sense, we. kind of at one point started to believe. we had to be complete before we met. someone. And as someone I've been. married now for 9 years and with my wife. for 12, I thought I knew who I was when.

we met, and that was a good foundation, but I have discovered so much more about. myself and grown so much more in the. last 12 years than what I thought. And. so, this idea that we have to be fully. formed, fully complete, fully perfect. before we meet someone doesn't really. add up. I would even say any of. relationship will change you. Some for. the better, some for the worse, right? If there isn't any change happening in. the relationship, you probably aren't. actually showing up to it. Mhm. And more.

to your point, when you enter a healthy, safe, loving relationship, it's going to reflect back to you the. parts of you that you haven't yet seen, worked on, grown through, grown out of, grown around, but I believe you have to. be able to discern what is growth versus. what is. judgment or a lack of acceptance or an. opportunity for for growth anyway, because Roddy could come to you and say,

"Jay, I'm I'm really noticing that you. haven't been present with me, and I I. miss you, you know? I I want more time. with you." If you don't have the. awareness that that's probably coming. from a place of love, from a desire to. improve your relationship, if you don't. have a growth mindset, you'll get. defensive, you'll snap back, you won't. listen, and you'll drive a wedge even. further between the two of you. So, I I. I think you need to practice some of. those four C's so that you have the. awareness of what growth feels like, what it's like to meet yourself so that.

when you're in a relationship that is. asking you to grow more, there's already. a familiarity there. I do I do think. that's important. >> It's so important, but what's so. interesting about you say what you're. saying, and I'm so glad you've gone in. that direction, is you're saying relationships. take growth and are almost for growth, but. we don't get into them wanting that. We. get into them wanting pleasure or joy or. relief or companionship,

and what you just said is, well, no, it's about growth. Talk to me about that difference between. our expectation. and why you think relationships are. actually about growth. As you grow, as. you know yourself, like yourself, all. the things we talked about, you don't need as much from the. relationship itself. You aren't expecting the person that. you're with to be a validation machine, to meet you in every way, in every.

moment, all the time, so perfectly. You can show up and. actually allow the other person to meet. you in this almost third entity. There's. you, the other person, and then the. relationship that you create together. And that means I get to bring my. insecurities, you get to bring your. insecurities, I get to bring my good. stuff, you get to bring your good stuff, right? And we meet each other there. And. it's it The point of a relationship is. just to relate to another person, right? To walk alongside them, to be.

a source of love, encouragement, enthusiasm, and to grow individually in your own. right, but I agree with you that I think. one of the biggest problems today. with people or for people who haven't. really taken the time to try and meet. themselves is what can I get? What can I. get? I'm not getting enough. I need to. get more. This isn't what I wanted. With. very little consideration for the other. person in this third entity that is the. relationship. >> It's something that I'm really grappling. with as we're talking about it. Today, I.

try and help people shift their. perspective because. we're not saying that it's growth that. is. growth that you. that brings you pain or stress or. we're saying it's growth that inspires. you to become better and be better. And. it may take you a second to make it. inspiring for each other. So, in the. start, it may rub you the So, for. example, as you said, when Roddy comes. up to me at the beginning and says, "Hey, I need you to do this or that." My.

ego's quite high and I go, "Well, why. don't you do it for yourself?" And then. it drives a wedge between us. And then. over time you respect and love so much. about this person that you start to go, "Well, wait a minute. Maybe they're. saying it from the right place." Now. I've grown to have the ability to. recognize that everything she says is. from a place of love. And now maybe I'll be able to receive. it. And the third time she says it, I'm. almost noticing I've been not present. myself. And I can say, "Hey, I haven't. been present." And now we're not trying. to live in a world where I am always. fully present because that's never going. to happen. That's not realistic. But it.

goes from her saying it and me being. triggered to her saying it and me being. aware. And then me noticing it even. before she says it so that I'm actually. able to explain why I may not be. present. Sometimes I'll say to Roddy, "Hey, you know what? The next week's. really intense for me. I think I'm just going to be a a bit. less around because I've got some things. to focus on and I just want you to know. it's got nothing to do with you or I've. just got on right now. And I find that. that's really helpful for a. relationship." And that's emotional.

safety. Choosing a partner. and building a relationship that is. based in trust, emotional safety, your. your ability to. see, hear Roddy's take and trust that. she's coming from a loving place, not. from a critical place, not from a. defensive place. That requires emotional. stability. That requires emotional. safety. So when you choose a partner. look at this in early dating. Is What is. the character of the person that that.

you're seeing? How do they treat their. friends? How do they treat their family? Are they a person of integrity? Are they. typically kind and well-intentioned? Because that's going to bloom into a. relationship with with the that same. character. Right? Where. someone gives you feedback, this person. that you're building a relationship with. gives you feedback, can you trust. that they're well-intentioned in their. feedback? That what they're asking for. or what they're reflecting back to you. is for the greater good of your. connection. Right? Um or of simply a. request to love them better, to love.

them in the way that they want to be. loved. And assuming you want to be a. person who does that, assuming you want. to be a person who participates in the. emotional safety and the stability, then. you're able to hear. that underneath the request or the. feedback or etc. rather than get. defensive. But it it requires trust and. it requires emotional safety. Yeah. And. and how do you know the difference. between someone's request being. inherently good versus unreasonable? Because I imagine when people are. dating, they may hear quite often, "Hey,

I don't think you're present." Or "You. missed my friend's birthday." Or "You. missed this, you missed that." And you. almost feel like they're not hearing. you. How do you make sense or decipher. between someone's feedback being. inherently good and for the relationship. versus just being an unreasonable. request? If there's too much black and. white. thinking. If someone comes to you and says, "You. skipped my friend's birthday. You didn't. remember that important meeting that I.

had last week. And you forgot to take. out the trash. You must not love me. You. don't care about this relationship. And. I I won't stand for it. I won't have. it.". That's unreasonable. That's that's ego. speaking. That's an insecurity. That's. not kind. That's not a loving way to. communicate or to think. If someone can come to you and hold the. nuance there, can see the color. "Hey, you've been really stressed, right? You. had a really busy week. You forgot about. my meeting. You missed my friend's. birthday. You forgot to do the You. forgot to take out the trash like you.

said that you would. I know you've been. busy. Can I help support you in some. way? And is there any way that you can. make the event next week with me? It'd. be really important." Right? So it's. being able to hold, "Hey, this hurts. Hey, I see where you're coming from. You're a human with finite capacity. And. I don't expect you to be a a superhero. here. And the relationship is important.". Right? There's there's so much color in. there. So I think the straightforward. answer to your question is if it's black. and white if it's demanding.

and if it really only considers one. perspective, one side then. you might want to consider a different. approach. Yeah. And that's really great. awareness for ourselves as well. Because. we all want everyone else to communicate. with us in an emotionally intelligent. way, but then when it comes to us. sharing our needs and I It's so. interesting when you were saying that, it resonates so deeply. It makes so much. sense. And then I go. where do people even learn all of this? Right? Like we're doing this podcast so. that people can learn and grow, but.

I'm listening to you going, I don't know. anyone who naturally communicates that. way. because. they didn't see that in their home, they. didn't have that through friends or. family, they didn't. have any training, of course. And so we. all do the other thing, which is you. always choose yourself, you never show. up for me, you don't love me. We we all. do that version. And so sometimes you're in a. relationship with someone and you see. that, but then you're like, "But I've. been with everyone else and they you.

know, they're worse than you. So I guess. this is it." You hear all the time love. is consideration. Right? Love is an action. Love is. consideration. Yes, but not consideration beyond. someone's capacity. Right? People can only meet you as. deeply as they've met themselves. They. can only meet you. given whatever whatever emotional. resources they have available to them at. any given time. And where we get stuck. is expecting someone to anticipate and.

meet our needs all the time. Uncommunicated. And then there's this. devastating disappointment when they. don't, when they don't show up the way. that we want them to. That's not a lack of love. That's dependency. That's a parent-child. dynamic. Not having to ask, having all. your needs tended to without it, you. know, any forewarning or insight. That's. not an adult-adult partnership. So you. you have to consider the kind of. relationship you want to build and the.

partner you want to be as the other half. of that because I'm assuming it's. someone who is patient who is willing to. see the the limited resources that. someone has available at some time. Right? Can can tolerate a certain amount. of disappointment when you aren't met in. the ways that you want to be met. Someone who's loving and warm in their. communication and their understanding. When you know you want to be those. things, then you can start practicing. Even if it wasn't shown to you. You can take stock of where you aren't. showing up in those ways, where you can.

be a little bit better at showing up in. those ways. But I really really think it. starts with accountability first. Take a. look at your side of the street. When. you've taken a look at your side of the. street, if you're in a relationship, then bring it to a conversation, right? Like, "Hey, let's co-create this thing. together." Yeah. How can we do this. together? Yeah. I think that's the way. On eBay, every find has a story. Like if. you're looking for a vintage band tee, not just a tee, the band tee from the last show your.

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Discover more at. chase.com/sapphirereserve. I feel so many people right now, I'm sure you hear it all the time, are. burnt out and exhausted with dating. They're just tired of dating. And they've either developed mindsets. like there's no good men left. All the good men are taken. Or, you know, well, she's not quite. right. Whatever it may be, right? Everyone has their version, but people. are exhausted with dating. We talked about what happens when you go. out there starving.

What do you do when you feel exhausted? Well, you have two options. Number one, you can stop. You can not date. That's an option. Take. a breather. It doesn't have to be a. full-time job. It doesn't have to feel. like a full-time job. It's good to focus on other things. Or. you can shift your expectations. Not needing to walk into every first. date as if you're interviewing for your. future spouse. For the position of your. future spouse. Like such high stakes,

such high pressure. Can you go in and. try to have fun? You know, can can you. change the the energy that you want to. bring to the room where you're just. meeting someone new? You're going to go. grab some dinner, you're going to go. grab coffee, you're going to go grab. drinks, whatever it is. Can I enjoy myself? Can I have fun with. it? And deciding the energy you want to. bring to the function typically allows. you to enjoy the function more, rather than feeling like, "Okay, here we. go again. Another disappointment, you. know, another let down, another waste of.

time." Don't do anything with that with. that mentality, with that energy or. attitude. Um. so you can either stop or shift your. energy, shift your perspective. >> Yeah, I was speaking to a friend the. other day and she was saying she goes. she said to me, "I just wish men. realized how long it takes a girl to get. ready." And she was like, "I got ready. She was like, I looked real cute." And. she was like, "He didn't say anything.". She was like, this guy that she was on a. first date with, he said she didn't say. I looked lovely, he didn't say it was. nice to see me, he didn't say it was.

lovely. He was just he was just like, I. didn't feel like he. Yeah, and she was so let down and she. was just like, I I really put effort. into how I. you know, got ready. I was excited about. it. Yeah. And it just felt like it. wasn't just that he didn't notice her. visually. He was she was like the. conversation didn't go either. But I can. imagine that that kind of feeling. repetitively gets tiring. But at the same time. you're so right that. it gets tiring when there's really high.

stakes on it every time. and it being perfect or being the one or. being the moment. It's almost like. it's almost like you made it you made it. harder for yourself. by going out. wanting it to be the night. Yes. Whereas. if you'd just gone out and even if you. did put in all that effort and. everything, but you like that about. yourself. >> And if you had fun right I I'm a girl I. love getting I love my 2-hour long. process of getting ready for an event. and you know, the music's playing, the.

vibe is good. That's fun. I enjoy that. I enjoy that. So I. do it more. I do it when when I want to. It's it's a process that I I want to. engage in. I also think I I'd like to. start a petition to bring back flirting. in general. I think we we've lost the art of. flirting cuz flirting is fun and not. flirting that has to lead to anything. Mhm. Not for you. You find someone attractive, there's a. little bit of chemistry, you share a. 5-minute conversation, it's flirty and. it's fun and it can end there. It can.

end there. You show up to a first date. can I tap into that? You know, the the. back and forth, the banter, the fun, the. chemistry. with no strings attached, just for the. the sake of connection and fun. Mhm. Mhm. Yeah, I would. agree. >> We're going to figure it out. Bring. flirting Bring flirting back. >> Yes, bring back flirting. >> Yeah, I want to I I feel like it's. disappeared mostly because people aren't. used to speaking in person in the time. that things are flirty. So most of the. flirting happens over message. And then.

by the time you get in front of each. other, you have to have a real. conversation, which is kind of like a. hard shift to go from flirting on the. phone to you know, through text to then. being interesting in person. Absolutely. >> So yeah. Do you Do you believe the spark. is real and does it matter? Absolutely. Spark is real and it matters. but it changes. and it fades and. it grows in other in other instances. I. I I think you need to feel an immediate.

attraction to someone that you are. romantically interested in. That doesn't. mean you are flooded, overwhelmed like. hot and sweaty can't can't catch your. breath, you're. doesn't have to be that. But you do need to think I'd like to be. a little closer to them, scootch my. chair a little bit closer. You know, I'll just figure out a way to to talk to. them, you know? But that's that's not to say that. connection and intimacy and attraction. can't grow over time. They absolutely. do, especially for women, especially for.

women. But you you should find the. person that you're dating attractive and. there should be a spark of yes, I want. to be physically closer to them, but I. also want to know more about them. There's some magic here, there's some. some something something to work with. I. think there has to be. But. as you. get to know a person as the novelty. wears off. that spark will change and that's okay. I don't think we need to discount anyone. if there isn't some immediate firework. and we should prepare for that spark to.

change if you plan on on starting a. long-term relationship. Yeah, when when. can the spark mislead us? How does it. mislead us? When it feels like you're on. a roller coaster, when you find yourself. pining for someone. There's a I I like to say. we only obsess over people who aren't. fully available to us and that spark can. really be mistaken or the obsession can. be mistaken for a spark where there's. something we're projecting onto someone.

that is so full-on, it feels like an. obsession. And. there's this this gap between who they. are and who they could be. The. relationship that you could have and the. relationship that you actually have. And. that gap in between is a reflection of. who you would get to be and how you. would get to feel if the fantasy became. a reality. And that can feel like a. spark, can feel like a deep overwhelming. obsession. Anyone who's who's been. through this knows how all-consuming it.

can be. But when we're projecting a fantasy onto. someone that spark can can take us away. into a whole other world. Yeah, I fully. agree. And and it's so hard because when. you're doing that, you don't even know. you're doing it. >> Nope. Nope. I um. typically not at first. If you you. experience it enough times, it is that. it'll be a pattern. It's probably. happened if it's happened once, it'll. probably happen again unless you catch. it because you shouldn't feel like.

you're falling off a cliff, right? You. shouldn't feel like a free fall of of. adrenaline and anxiety. You should be excited to see someone, excited to to be around them, to to get. to know them, but it should not feel. like the ground falls from underneath. you Mhm. um when you're with them or not. near them or uncertain about what's. going to happen. What's the difference. between chemistry and compatibility. and what's more important over time? I.

think compatibility in terms of shared. values and visions of the future. People often mistake compatibility for. similarity in all aspects, right? I need. to find someone who likes the same. movies I like, listens to the same. music, prefers to eat all the same foods. that I do, goes to sleep at the same. You don't need a an identical copy of. you. In fact, that would probably drive. you crazy. What I think compatibi-. compatibility really boils down to in a. more important sense is. how do you. value your time, attention and energy.

when it comes to the most important. things in your life? If you are someone. who values family, you want children one. day, you want to be married, you want a. long-term partnership with love, honesty, trust, all those things. You need to find someone who values. family, kids, being married, um prioritizing. the family above just their own innate. desires, right? You have those values. have to align. Otherwise.

you're headed for a disaster. Same thing with visions of the future. If you start dating someone who wants to. live out of a van and travel around the. country and wants to kind of have this. nomadic life and you want to. live two blocks away from your parents. you know, in in Iowa and forever and. that that's home for you, I love that. for both of you. You're probably not. meant to be together. That'll be a. really contentious relationship. I I. like to say don't order what's not on. the menu when you meet someone.

If they say work is their most important. priority, that's their top value. don't get into a relationship expecting. to change that about someone. It's not. fair to them, it's not fair to you. That's compatibility. Chemistry, in my opinion, boils down to. the magic that you feel. just being around someone. >> Yeah. It can It's almost palpable. There's.

whether that's a quiet intimacy, like a. soft intimacy, you're pulled towards. each other, whether it's banter and wit, have a similar sense of humor, whether. it is physical attraction, you just want. to jump their bones and you can't help. but kiss them and all the things. That to me is chemistry and you want you. want that. But chemistry won't build the long-term. relationship, the long-term partnership. that some people want. Not everyone. Some people don't, but.

I loved your. distinction between compatibility and. similarity Mhm. because I think that's. to me, that's the real hurdle for people. because I I talk about this where me and. my wife are just completely the opposite. people in terms of we don't have a lot. in common when it comes to likes and. dislikes and things like that. But from a values and vision point of. view. we respect and we don't even have the. directly the same values and vision, but.

we respect each other so much. that it allows for a healthy. relationship. So my purpose, my work is. my number one priority and my wife's is. her family, but I love when she spends. time with her family and she loves. seeing me pursue my purpose and. therefore there isn't conflict. Whereas. if she said, "Jay, you have to give up. your purpose to be with my family." Or. if I said, "Well, you've got to give up. your family to spend time with my. purpose.". That wouldn't work for us. And I find. that to be a really common thing I hear. from people where the biggest mistake.

you can make in a relationship is one of. you wants the other person to change for. them. and the other person doesn't want you to. change at all. Mhm. And the truth is. you're both going to change, but not in. the ways the other person wants you to. You're just going to be become who you. are going to become. And it's so interesting to me that I. meet so many people who almost want. their partner to play a very specific. role in their life. Not realizing that that human is. evolving, growing, and shifting.

themselves and is unlikely to do that. There's a real opportunity to see beyond. ourselves if we find find that dynamic. at play. Where I need them to show up in this. way. They need to be just so. That's. black and white thinking. That's right. It's It's limiting to you. It's limiting. to the other person and it's limiting to. the relationship. That's the And that's hard to accept. because if you're. outsourcing all of your needs, desires, and wants onto another person,

you're going to be disappointed. And if you expect to be met in all the. ways you want to be met all the time, you're going to be disappointed. There. has to be a bit of accountability there. Mhm. Where am I not taking care of. myself? Where am I not pursuing what I. really want to spend my time, attention, and energy on? That's. There's probably a bit of that that's. lacking. Because if you expect someone. else to do it for you, to change in all. the ways you want, that's a that's a.

self-centered view. Mhm. And you can at. the very least consider. how important is everything that I'm. asking for right now. Could I live. without this and still be okay and still. be happy? Maybe it's a season. Maybe. it's just a season. People think love is supposed to. carry them through decades and decades. of relationship. Just love, just the. feeling. That it should be peaceful and. restful all of the time. Sometimes it's. work. Some seasons are work. Where hey,

I really want this and they say, I. really don't. And your top value is your commitment to. each other, then you're going to figure. it out and that's probably going to be a. stormy season. But no one really likes. hearing that. >> Mhm. Because it means we have to. tolerate some disappointment and take. some accountability, which doesn't. always feel very good. Is love enough? Love the feeling or love the action? You tell me. Love the action is. Because love as an action. is willingness.

Willingness to find the color, the. nuance, the balance. Willingness to learn to love someone how. they want to be loved. Willingness to show up. and be loving when you feel the least. loving. You know, people say. I would die for my partner. I love them. more than anything in this world. I. would literally lay down and die for. them. Okay, but would you put your phone. down. when they're telling you about your day? Do you take their hand when you're.

walking down the sidewalk with them? Do. you notice when they come home from work. and their mood is a little off? Do you. take the time to stop and ask them about. it? To remember the little things that. they tell you? To care? That's love. That's love as an action. That's what keeps connection. Love as a feeling will be fleeting if we. don't follow it follow it through, follow it up with action. Mhm. So, there is a difference between love. the feeling and love the action. I think. so. Do you? Yeah, no, I agree. I agree.

No, I never thought about it like that. I think love the action requires. so much more emotional intelligence and. maturity than love the feeling. I think I was in love when I was 16. All. the time. And all the time. And. I did not back that up with actions. I. think going back to the piece about. people changing, I think people change. for people. because they're so scared that that. person has so many options. So, I'd. rather change to be everything you want.

me to be so that you don't leave me to. find someone else. But in that process, I'll become someone I don't even. recognize. because I didn't want to become that. person at all. And now you'll leave me. anyway. because. you can tell I'm not really. authentically that person. So, it almost hurts twice. One in. unbecoming yourself and then in losing. the other person anyway because you. didn't become who they needed you to be.

So many people today feel like there's. plenty of fish in the sea. There's so. many options. What do you do when you meet someone? You like them. but you can tell that they have some. detachment because they have this idea. that there's plenty of fish in the sea. And you're trying to hold on to them. You can tell you're trying to hold on to. them. Knowing that they might ultimately let. you go anyway. Do you value commitment? Do you value someone who also knows what. they want? If you have a.

If you have a clear vision of the kind. of relationship you want, the way you. want your relationship to feel, consistent, reliable, warm, fun, and. playful. When you understand that, becomes a lot. easier to discern who's for you and. who's not. Someone who's still worried. about all the other fish in the sea, who's easily distracted, who catches. that catches their eye, that catches. their eye, and you feel like you have to. control them. If it feels like you have. to control them, it's not love. And you can't build a relationship of a.

feeling relationship from that place. So, if you notice that they don't value. the same things you do. They don't value. commitment in the same ways, then. they're probably not for you. Because. the last thing you want to do is chase. after them trying to convince them to. want the same things that you want and. please I'll show you how good it'll be. if you'll just choose me. Then you end up losing yourself in a in. the very ways that you're trying to. avoid in the first place. Mhm. It's always hard. I always find that. we're willing to tolerate bad behavior. from someone we're really into.

versus someone we're kind of into. And so, when we say we want reliability, if the person we're really into doesn't. message back, we'll be patient. But if someone we're. kind of into doesn't message back, we're. like, "Ooh, red flag." That was me. That was I mean, that was. that was a childhood childhood wound of. am I lovable? Am I difficult to love? Who do I have to become to get someone. to choose me, to pay attention to me? Right? So, ooh, you kind of like me? You.

kind of are interested? You kind of pay. enough attention? I'm going to get the. other 50% of that attention from you. I'm going to earn it. I'm going to. tolerate the hurt, the disrespect. because you're giving me a little bit of. what I want and I'm going to prove it. And then I'd get into relationships, fully chosen, stable love, very good. people, and I'd test them. No, you don't hear. Mhm. I'm going to show you that I can. rebel against this. I'm going to show. you that I'm hard to love so that then I. can come back and earn it again. That is.

an. That is a childhood wound that doesn't. heal until you take accountability for. it. It wasn't until I realized the. pattern at play. And I got sick of my own. I got sick of the same hurt, the same. anxiety, this the same cycles. Like, I. don't want this. And then I took accountability and. realized that the stability and the love. that I was looking for was going to. require me to make value-based decisions.

first and foremost. And really show up. and support myself and soothe myself. when I wanted to run or when I wanted to. beg or when I wanted to to react, I had. to learn to respond. So. Little little tidbit about me. I was. going to ask you what what did. How bad did it have to get for you to. take accountability? I really lost myself. chasing. the feeling of being chosen.

I'd given up on dreams, lost all confidence, tolerated. just the worst possible behavior. Just. was a shell of myself, really and truly. And when you reach that that level, when. essentially rock bottom, you either have to pull yourself out or. you realize how deep and dark it'll feel. until you find the courage. And you. don't want to live like that. I didn't. want to live like that. I knew that.

there was an option and I knew it was. going to be hard and I knew that it was. going to take a hell of a lot of time, uh attention, understanding, patience. for myself. But. one of the best things One of the best. things I've ever done. A big piece of. what actually got me into this work, quite frankly. Mhm. Tell me about that. The pattern I was just talking about, you know, choose me, see me, what can I. do to earn your attention? That. primarily came from my mother. And my mother died of cancer.

um. back in 2019. And there was something about her death. that was so devastating. and yet so. healing because of the the way we were. able to repair before she passed. So, we had we got to have these. conversations, peel back we're so. honest, so honest in the safety and. space it created, feeling seen and.

chosen and loved in such a way, even. though it was the end. There was. something about that moment. And obviously the journey of grief that. came after that. that changed me to my core. And this was all happening around the. same time. The the feeling like I was at. rock bottom, the the death of my mother. There was so much going on there where I. realized that I was looking for evidence. to confirm or deny the beliefs that I. had learned in this mother-daughter.

dynamic growing up. That I was hard to. love, that I was difficult to love, that. I needed to fight to be chosen. I was. looking for evidence to confirm that. everywhere. And it felt awful. It felt awful. So, there was a bit of the love and. support and honesty. that I was able to find in these. conversations with my mother. And then the work that I did after she. passed to learn to show up for myself.

and no longer tolerate. those beliefs, no longer take those. beliefs as fact. And that was really. where where the work was. That's where. the work came from. First of all, sorry for your loss cuz it. sounds like a. really difficult time. through everything that you just. mentioned. And at the same time, my question is.

how useful was it. to repair with her? And could more of us. heal our relationships with our future. partners. by repairing our relationships with our. parents. in any way? If you have the option. if you have the option. it's worth a try. But you don't need to. Mhm. You don't need to. And I I was. so blessed and so lucky to be able to.

number one have the time. before she passed because she was sick. Um but for her to also have an open. heart and an open mind to meet me there. Mhm. I know that that's that's not a. luxury that everyone everyone gets. And that's really hard. Mhm. If anyone. can relate to that, I I just want to. acknowledge how there's a grief in and. of that. You know, that you that you. don't have a parent that will meet you. in such a way. You don't have a person. of such importance that will meet you. meet you there.

But there absolutely is a process of. a similar strategy I just explained that. you can do on your own. Mhm. Which is meeting yourself in the ways. you wish that parent would meet you. What What do you wish they would say? What do you wish they would validate. about you? Because my guess is what you. wish they would validate about you are. the same things you bring into those. romantic relationships. I wish you would. accept me. I wish you would just love I wish you.

would look at me and say I'm so proud of. you. I see you. There's probably a few flavors of that. that show up in in your conflict with. your romantic partner. Right? And if you're with someone who is. safe and loving and patient. romantically, you're. you can have some of these conversations. with them. Hey, I feel this way. You. know, maybe it came from mom or dad, maybe it didn't, but communicating that, sharing that. that's how we grow in relationship is by. bringing these beliefs hey, what I'm. feeling is this. What I'm hearing in.

this conversation, I heard you just say. that you don't love me and you don't. care about this relationship. And they. look at you like. I just told you that that I that I would. just going to be home 2 hours late. What. do you I didn't What? Right? That's And. that's where the understanding and the. healing and the reprogramming really. comes from, but it takes a hell of a lot. of vulnerability. Yeah. That's not. always comfortable, but it's always. worth it. Yeah. Always. Yeah, one of my. early experiences of love was.

I was overloved and then I was made to. feel guilty for not reciprocating back. at that level. And so when I first started dating my. wife I would do exactly the same. I. would overlove and then guilt her for. not. loving me. in the same amount back. Scoreboard. Totally. And her reaction. was very human and eventually helpful. because my love her and there were so. many other things that were so worthy of. love that.

her reaction was just she pulled away. because. she didn't understand because at one. point she'd be like, well, I didn't ask. for you to overlove me. And then she'd be like, but I am loving. you just not exactly perfectly in the. way that you're saying it. Like and. because I believed her because I. believed there was truth to it I. remember the moment the penny dropped. for me where I was like Oh my gosh, like. this is exactly me repeating a pattern. Mhm. No wonder no one wants to be And I.

saw my sister do the same. And I just I. just noticed how like that was how we. were trained to love. And I remember the moment I realized. that and I could find all these other. patterns in how I loved my wife in a. unhealthy way. it just transformed our entire. relationship because now there weren't. there wasn't any of that. And it's so. funny because I felt so righteous in. that belief at the time that I was like, I must be right. Of course I'm right. I'm the one who's. doing everything.

Where did it turn? What do you. >> Where Where your realization? When did. it Was it something she said? Well, it. was it was her pulling away. Mhm. And it. was almost like it kind of made the. scoreboard not work. Mhm. Because in my. relation with love, if someone did that. to me I just turned up how they wanted. me to turn up. But what was the thing. that helped you realize that it was a a. personal pattern? The the accountability. of oh that's my stuff to own. >> it would it ended up if I because it was. so long ago now I I believe it was.

probably a ended up being a conversation. where. I think my wife said something to me. like I. just don't know what I could ever do to. make you happy. Like I'm like I just. don't know. Like even if I did this and. I did this and I did that, I don't even. know if it would ever be enough. Mhm. And. I think when she said that to me. and I thought about it, I was like, yeah, I think she's right. I don't think. it would have. Even if she did all those. things that I said I wanted Yes. or.

thought back it would never be enough. because I'd just find something else. And when I also started to realize that. when I went above and beyond for her it. was never because she asked for it or. wanted it or even wanted the things I. went above and beyond for. So, that was. also self-inflicted. And actually, if I was more present and. aware, then maybe I'd meet her with. where she wants and what she wants. >> Almost like you almost so like you could. get love. Correct. Absolutely. That I.

felt I had to earn it. And so you're. giving a lot thinking that's how you get. love not realizing love was in the. everyday and the little things and the. beautiful things and the. you know, the things that are there. And. then. and then there was another conversation. that we had. This was a few years later. that was really illuminating was. I said to her, I feel like I'm always. planning. our vacations. And I do all the planning and the detail. and everything and it's almost like I. don't feel like I get the break. And she was like, I'm more than happy to.

plan it, but the difference is she was. like. when you plan something, I'll happily do. whatever you plan. But when I plan something, you'll have a. hundred things you'll find wrong with it. and you'll be unhappy about it. And that really hit me because I was. like, gosh, she's so right. Like that's. exactly what I would do. I would I would. be upset at the schedule and the. timeline and everything because I have a. viewpoint on how it should be done. Yeah. And therefore she allows me to. plan it because she knows I'll be. happier that way on both accounts. But. so it's so interesting how so much of it. is self-inflicted because.

I I found the more the more I take. responsibility for how I need to change. and the more she takes responsibility. for how she needs to change the better. our relationship gets rather than her. telling me how I need to change and me. telling her how she needs to change. >> Well, and what a common I I call it the. criticism withdrawal loop. One person says, I want more. The other person says, why is nothing. that I do ever enough? And that can quickly spiral. Yeah. Taking your taking your story for. example.

hey, I always plan these things. I would. love it if if you would plan the. vacations more. Yeah. She could easily. say, I I. threw out this idea last time and you. shut me down and I tried to throw out. this idea before and and you won't go. for it. Nothing I ever do is not Where. do you want me to go with this? >> Yeah. And it turns into this spiral. And then. after that, there's a withdrawal or the. criticism gets louder. I told you you. didn't plan this last vacation and you. know what? You haven't planned any date. nights either. It all falls on me. What's really being communicated is hey,

can can I share this mental load? Can I. Can Can we share in in the emotional. labor here a little bit? I Can you show. up and can you help? Can I get some. support? Can I feel your connection? Right? That would mean a lot to me. And I'm a. little overwhelmed. I feel like I can't. quite find the right words or the right. thing and if it feels like. you don't accept me. Like you don't. like nothing I do is valued. Mhm. Same.

same driving intention, very different. ways to approach the conversation. Yeah. Right? So, our ability to understand why. something is bothering us Yeah. and. communicate that is paramount. >> Mhm. In addition, being able to listen. in for the intention even if your. partner can't explicitly communicate it. is also really important. >> Mhm. Maybe you and Roddy can give. everyone a. a master class in No, I. I think we we we both generally just, you know, it's been I think for us.

generally they've been very healthy. conversations because we both have a. similar understanding of not raising. voices, not getting angry. Like we we. both have a good. set of rules that I think we set early. on what we wanted conflict to look like. or disagreements to look like. Did you. know to pick someone with. such a temperament? Was it apparent when. you first met each other or was it. something that was communicated. or happened coincidentally?

I think I got lucky at the start. and then. became more conscious of as we got more. serious. And I've become even more grateful as. years have gone by. Mhm. And so I think. there was a bit of luck in the beginning. and then. then consciously developing it. >> Maybe you were really naturally drawn to. her temperament, maybe. For sure. For. sure. Yeah. Yeah, there's definitely. that. There was a natural draw, but it. was an unconscious Mhm. experience in. the beginning, then became more. conscious and focused and developed. And.

I always think that it's like you you. can get a lot of things right without. not know without knowing. Mhm. But then. once you know, it's good to focus on. getting them better. Yes. Um but I. wanted to ask you this question. You say. one of my favorite things that you say. You said in a video that you can tell. how much you love yourself by the. partner that you've chosen. Tell me about that. Well, I pose it as a question. because. if you hear someone say in in the. video I think you're referring to. It's.

how would you feel if someone said. that they can tell how much you love. yourself by the partner that you've. chosen. Does that feel like a compliment. or an insult? And what it that really distills down. to, I'm not passing a judgment on your. relationship, but the way you feel about. that question can offer a lot of. insight. Have you a. tolerated. treatment that. really really doesn't feel great. Mhm. It doesn't really feel loving.

It's not what someone would put up with. if they loved themselves. Or. man, I've chosen a really patient, loving, incredible person. You know, some part of me must like. myself enough to choose someone who. loves me in such a way. It's really really most mostly about. reflection. Mhm. What is it that we're. choosing and am I am I making decisions, building relationships, investing in. relationships. that reflect love, love for myself.

and and back to the values. Mhm. Do you know, am I making decisions based. on my values or am I stagnant? Am I. complacent? Am I participating in this. this negative dynamic as well? It's really about reflection and seeing. what comes up for people. Yeah, it's a. great reflection. Such a great question. And it's a great way if you're dating. right now. to really make the right shifts and. changes. Absolutely. >> And and if you're married and you feel. like you made.

the wrong decision, what would you do? If someone's listening to that and. they're going. Oof, like I'm listening to you right. now, Q, and that. that feels tough. Because my partner's not present. I don't. I know they love me, but. you know, I'm not sure we I think we. lost it somewhere along the way. What. would you say to them? I love that. distinction, too. I I say dating is. dating is about discernment. Marriage is. about devotion. Mhm.

Not the other way around. Say that. again. Dating is about discernment, not. devotion. Devotion is to be saved for. marriage or long-term relationships, long-term partnerships. That's important as you're making. decisions. But what I would say to someone. who's realizing that maybe their. relationship dynamic is not as loving as. they would want it to be. first things first. take a look at your side of the street. That doesn't mean Mhm. that doesn't mean.

it's your fault. This is not a blame. game. But if you envision the kind of. relationship you want with this this. with your husband, with your wife, with. your partner. what does it consist of and how can you. add more of that now? How can you be the. first to add, to try? How can you show up as the partner you. want to be? Where is the appreciation for the ways. that they are making effort? It's really. easy to get sucked into the into a.

disappointment spiral. Like you go down. the rabbit hole and all you can see are. the things that they aren't doing, the. things they're doing wrong, the ways. that they aren't showing up. Pull. yourself out of that. >> Mhm. If you want your relationship to. work, you have to pull yourself out of. that. >> Mhm. Even if you choose to leave, don't. choose to leave in the bottom of the. disappointment spiral. Anyway. Yeah. Clean up your side of the street Yeah. and go first. >> Great advice. Yeah. That's what I would. say. The follow-up to that is have a. conversation with your spouse.

Hey. I want more of this because I love you. I feel really distant. I feel really. lonely. We both have a lot going on. Can. we come up with a plan to reconnect? What do you want more of? Here's what I. want more of. Can we get on board? It. doesn't have to be. uh so humdrum, you know, neg Oh, we have. to fix this. It can be an exciting thing. if you want it to be and if you come. with the right energy. Mhm. And if it is. the right person. then they'll at least try to meet you. there. Yeah. What's the difference.

between. keeping someone accountable and trying. to change them? I don't think you can. keep people accountable. Mhm. I don't. really believe that it's possible. Or. hold someone accountable. If you were someone. who's really lacking consistency. They're not really following through on. their word. And you're thinking. I I I need a little bit more here. They. they're not taking initiative. I can't. trust them to do what they say that. they're going to do. You can bring that up.

This is what I'm noticing. I'm finding it hard to rely on you. because you haven't done the things that. you said that you were going to do. I. mean, can we talk about this? And if they say, "I want to be a more. consistent, reliable person. Thank you. for bringing that to my attention.". Great. Now they want to make that. change. You've brought it to light. It. is on them to make the change. >> Mhm. You can lovingly, "Hey, again this thing. didn't get done, but it's the buck stops. there." Yeah. You can't be you can't be.

breathing down their neck. You. definitely don't want to meet them with. criticism or or constant disappointment. People don't actually change from that. place. >> So if they want to make the change. themselves, great, beautiful. The onus. is on them. You can be loving and. supportive in the process, but I don't. believe that we can really hold people. accountable and we definitely can't. force them to change. I fully agree. And. and I think the hardest part of it. is you know how hard it is to change. yourself. So even when someone says they want to.

change themselves you got to realize how. hard that is. Right? You may have your. partner say to you, "Yeah, I I really do. want to work out and get in the gym. more.". And then they're never in the gym, they're always watching sport, they're. hanging out, whatever it is. You know how hard that is to do. And so it's such a interesting dynamic. because we almost think change should be. really easy for other people knowing. that it's really hard for ourselves. And then when they don't change, we're. upset or disappointed in them. And if you just thought for a second.

about how hard it is to change yourself. and build good habits yourself. I think you'd have more empathy and. compassion. for someone else. That's that's how I. see it, at least. We tend to judge. ourselves by our our intentions and we. tend to judge others by their actions or. their follow-through or their result of. their thing, right? Mhm. >> So, I meant to go to the gym five days. this week. I really only made it once, but I intended to. I you know, I had a. lot going on. My intentions were good. I. I tried. They don't go to the gym five times a.

week. They only go once and suddenly. it's a reflection of their character. Mhm. Right? They're unreliable. They. lack discipline. They aren't motivated. Let's hold on here. Let's Let's find the. color amongst all this black and white. thinking. Yeah. agree. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It's It's It's the toughest one I see. It's. I always just feel like. and that's why I love that you said. start on your side of the street because. I think a lot of relationship language. and you podcasting and conversations. right now are all about how do you spot.

if someone's good? And I'm just like, ooh, I it's a. dangerous game to play because in that. scenario, you're always the detective. and the secret agent and the other. person's always the villain in some way. And while that can be true in in certain. cases where there's extremes, the. reality is most of us are all flawed and. making mistakes at the same time. And if. you want. a peaceful, emotionally intelligent. person, right, with all the all of these. traits that are that are wonderful. I.

love that for you. You have to be the other half of that. relationship. Mhm. Right? You also want. to be. patient and calm. slow to conflict, kind with your words. even when you're frustrated. You can. handle some disappointment and you're. you're you. you want to be the other half of that. loving relationship. It's not going to. come from focusing on all the red flags. you need to look out for and and all the. things that the the specific ways they.

need to show up to prove to you that. they are who they say that they are. Focus on your side of the street. Focus. on being the other half of this. relationship that you want so badly. rather than trying to figure out the. quick fixes to avoid all of the bad fish. in the sea. Mhm. It's a waste of time, in my opinion. You said in one of your videos, "The. only people who are upset with your. boundaries are the very same people who. directly benefit from you not having. any.". I love that. Can you explain?

Someone who loves you. wants you to have boundaries. Someone who loves you wants there to be. limits on what you will and won't. tolerate, what you have capacity for. don't have capacity for. That is. necessary. Mhm. Someone who loves you. and better yet someone you want in your. life. We can argue all day, do they love. me or do they not? If they're. disrespecting your boundaries. you probably don't want them to have. much access to you.

energetically, emotionally. At the end. of the day, boundaries aren't designed. to keep people out. They aren't designed. to hurt anyone's feelings. They're. designed to maintain your. finite amount of energy and attention. Right? I I can't say yes to everything. It It doesn't have I can't say yes to. everything and still show up in the ways. that I want to show up. You know, keep. the character and integrity that I. really like about myself. There's no way. to do that. Someone who loves me is. going to encourage that and respect. that. Mhm. And the people who benefit.

from you not having it, the people who. want to take more from you, who want. more and more and more, who are more. self-centered, they won't care. Mhm. They won't care if. it's for good for you or bad for you or. not. They're more focused on themselves. and that's disrespectful. That's not. loving and that's not someone who should. have. an infinite amount of access to you. Mhm. How do you set an effective boundary. because I think we've got used to the. language,

but we don't really know how to do it. We think that a boundary protects you. from other people, but really a boundary. is something that protects you from. yourself and your natural triggers or. ways of behavior. So, how do we set a. behavior that protects us rather than. trying to keep other people out? A. boundary is. I will or won't blank if blank. I will or won't blank if blank. So, that is It is all within your.

control. I won't participate in this conversation. if you yell at me again. I won't. Well, I I'm going to have to. walk away. Yeah, and you're not saying that to. them, you need to know that as well. Yeah, yeah. And either or, right? I I. don't want to participate in a. relationship with someone who lies to. me. I won't. I will not. You need to. know that for yourself. Absolutely. You. can share these things with other. people. Back to the the conversation. with difficult parents. Contentious relationships with your.

parents, you know, I really value our relationship, but I. won't stay if you keep talking to me. that way. Mhm. If you keep bringing up. that issue, I'm going to walk away. I will blank if blank is a boundary. Not. you can't blank blank blank. Not you. better not. It's not a threat. It's a rule for yourself. Mhm. And your. boundaries are for you to respect. >> Mhm. And that's the hardest part, right? I. feel like we compromise our own.

boundaries. So, we say things like, I won't. participate in this conversation if you. lie to me, but then we continue to participate. because it's not really a boundary. It's. hoping they won't lie to you. Mhm. Or. we're saying it hoping you'll stop lying. if I threaten you. Yes. But you just. said it's not a threat. It's a boundary. if we recognize I have to leave now. So, if you're lying, I know I have to walk. away, but we don't want to do that. because we're hoping they change. Yes. So, it's like a secret hidden hope as.

opposed to a boundary. The manipulation. that you just kind of described, like, I'm going to say that I won't tolerate. it, but then if you actually do it, then. I will say cuz what I'm really trying to. get is is you to show up for me and. trying to get you to love me, so I'm. going to mix in this threat. That's. That's That's a hell of a lot of. manipulation. Mhm. Rather than having. your own back, like really respecting. yourself enough to say, I will not. tolerate this.

My self-respect is not worth the. emotional turmoil that comes from. allowing this kind of behavior. That's. really hard. Mhm. That's really hard. You have to choose yourself-respect over. your desire to be chosen. Mhm. Or your. desire to not be alone. That's That's paramount. Absolutely. Is. there such a thing as the one or a. soulmate? The one is the one that you choose. The one.

is the person. whose natural essence. complements yours in a way. that makes love and growth a little bit. easier. Little bit. Right? It's a little. bit. Sometimes it's still hard. But ideally you choose well. You use discernment in the beginning. You admire someone's integrity. You. really respect them. You really cherish.

them. You like them. Which is often an overlooked one. You know, it's he's he's this tall and. he makes this much money, so he he'll be. the one. Well, okay, but do you like the. guy? You know, it's really important. And then you build the relationship from. there. Respecting the other person, respecting. yourself, and again creating this third. entity. One thing I also think is. overlooked when it comes to choosing the. one.

and being the one. This is a This is. This works for both sides. You need to. be your partner, your person's. biggest fan. I I mean that with my whole heart. You. need to be your partner's biggest fan. And if you can't, then you either need. to check in on your insecurities, you. either need to pay attention, or you've. chosen the wrong person. Mhm. If you don't want their dreams to come.

true, if you don't want them to succeed, if you don't want them to be their. happiest best self, do not promise to spend a lifetime with. them. I really really think that that's. important and and not talked about. enough. I don't hear that very much. We. talk about the conflict stuff, right? We. talk about how to handle boundaries and. how to do all of that, but. you want someone in your corner. You. want someone in your corner on your. worst days, on your best days, and you. want to feel like you're on the same. team. And I deeply believe you need to.

be your your person's biggest fan and. that contributes to them being the one. and building the right relationship. >> Mhm. When you were saying that, it was. reminding me of wedding vows. And I was thinking about how. we spend so long. planning a wedding. and not building a marriage. And just the discrepancy between the. two, even how long you'll take to write. your vows. But then to live up to those vows takes. a whole different set of skills.

And. we don't really put that much effort. into building those skills and working. on those parts. Maintaining those. skills. >> Maintaining maintaining those skills. How. do you know if you're in love with. someone or just the idea of them? How do you know if you're in love with. someone or just the idea of them? Is. there a difference. between how you. wish they would be and how they actually. are? Mhm. How wide is that gap?

How much of. the relationship do you actually enjoy. Mhm. versus how much time are you. spending trying to change them, trying. to change the dynamic? I like to say, if you allow your person to be exactly. who they want to be without molding. them, without controlling them, without. micromanaging them, but you allow them. to show up just as they are, does that help you feel more or less.

like the person you want to be? Does. that feel more or less like the kind of. relationship you want to be in? Mhm. And. it doesn't mean it's perfect. Doesn't. mean it's all the time. Yeah. >> But if you It doesn't mean that they. won't Yeah, yeah. change. Doesn't mean. you can't change, but if you really. allow them to be, if you accept them for. exactly who they are, does that help or hinder. what you want love to feel like? >> Mhm. That's one question to ask. >> Yeah, it's a great question. I love that. question. It's It's such an important.

question because. that is who you're with. 90% of the time. And that is what you'll experience and. yeah, if you're in love with the idea of. them, then you're absolutely right. Your. answer to that question will be no. Mhm. Because I want them to be a bit more. this, a bit more that, a bit more this. >> And do you need a bit more Is Is that. bit more that you're missing really. really important to you? If it is, by all means, do what you got. to do. Yeah. But I think a lot of times.

we fool ourselves into thinking that the. little bits that we're missing. are make or breaks. And. we forget that loving someone. is such an honor. And this is more so geared towards. long-term relationships, marriages of. sorts. But it's so real honor to be able. to love someone through several seasons. of their life. Mhm. To be able to be. their support system, to be the smiling.

face that picks them up on a day when. they feel shitty, to be there when they lose someone that. they love or they lose an opportunity or. they hit their highest high, to sit with them on a Sunday night on. the couch every Sunday for years and. years and I mean, it's an honor to love. someone and to be there. And sometimes I just think we need to. reframe. the way that we view the person we're. with as. a whole human all on their own that we.

get the honor to love. And that tends. That tends to clear out a lot of the. little bits that we aren't getting. Yeah, that's beautiful. You look at that. person and you think, my god, I really. do love them. Mhm. Look at the way that. they do the dishes or tie their shoes. I. love the way that that they drive. And. the way they dance to music. I love I. love to watch them get ready and put, you know, do their morning routine. Whatever. Like. you just look at that human and remember. that it that it's an honor. Yeah. to.

love them and maybe. that'll clear out some of the bits that. you're missing. Yeah. What do you wish people asked themselves. before they got married? Do I want to be a partner. or do I want a spouse? And the difference there. is when you want to be a partner. when you want to be. someone's support system, when you want. to be the co-creator.

of the marriage that you're about to. step into, the life that you're going to. build. There's accountability and. responsibility in that. And. it really allows you. to focus on what you can control. which is how you show up. Now assuming you're walking to walking. to that altar. and you know this person pretty damn. well and you've spent a good long time. seeing who they are, understanding their. heart, really caring for them, all of.

that. You're going to have to remember. that sometimes the best you can do is. show up as the partner you want to be. That you want to be. Even if your seasons are are misaligned. Um Matthew McConaughey has this great. bit in a podcast that he did where he. says sometimes you're walking and. they're running. Mhm. And sometimes. you're running and they're walking. And you just have to make sure that one. doesn't get too far ahead of the other. Mhm. And I love that. Yeah. I love him. Yes. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, I love.

that, too. >> that's well said. Yeah, absolutely. And. And I think it's about how you. communicate when you are that. I've. always thought about it as. sometimes me and my wife. are driving to the same event but we're. driving separately. She's going to get there early and I'm. going to be late. And so I'm on the. phone and I'm like, "Hey, I'm going to. be late.". And she's like, "Well, I'm going to be. early." And I'm like, "Okay, well, do. you want to wait for me because you want. to go in together or do you want to go. in without me and I'll follow you in. there?" She's like, "No, I want to wait. for you to go in there together." And. it's like you're both driving separately. but you're talking to each other the.

whole time Yeah. about where you're at. And that's that conversation that calms. you both down rather than you have no. idea what time that person's getting. there. One of the challenges I find is. that everyone wants their A lot of what. I hear is people want their partner to. talk to them more emotionally and tell. them more. And. there's a lot of people who don't want. to do that or don't know how to do that. or don't feel the need for it. And the person who wants to talk. kind of gets a bit annoyed and. frustrated and and upset that their.

partner won't talk. What's your advice. in that scenario? What's the loving. thing to do? Mhm. You know, and that that probably. requires. both sides of the aisle to adjust a. little bit. You're not going to get. perfect words all the time. It's not. going to happen. And you're going to. have to give imperfect words a lot of. the time. Mhm. You're going to have to. try. The my aunt and uncle. are in their mid-70s, early 70s. They've. been married for 25, 30 years, something.

like that. And we were just having a. conversation the other night. I was asking my Uncle John, I said, "What is your secret to to the What's. the magic? How has this happened?". They're probably the happiest couple I. know. And And incredible. And he said. "She tells me what she wants to hear and. I repeat it back to her.". And he meant J He meant it with his full. chest. I've seen them do it. >> Yeah. My Aunt Beth will say, "I need you. to tell me that this is going to be. okay. You hear me. You've got my back. and you've got it covered." And he will.

re- recite it right back to her word for. word and they say, "Okay, I love you.". And leave it there. And some And some. people will think, "What if I have to. say it it did If I have to tell them. what to say, it doesn't matter. It's It. It erodes the value and this that and. the other.". If your person is asking to be loved in. a specific way. put your stuff aside and show up. Yeah. >> To the best of your ability. They will. not be perfect all the time and it sure. as hell won't. But do the loving thing. And that is. typically to show up in the ways that.

your partner is explicitly asking you. to. If you want bonus points, anticipate. some of those needs, right? Pay. attention and try to do it without. having to be asked. But don't knock the the direct. communication Mhm. and then choosing. the loving thing to do. Yeah. Yeah. How do you. start to trust yourself again. when someone breaks up with you. that you thought you were going to be. with for a long time? Well, step one, grieve.

Yeah, there's an acute phase of. heartbreak where you don't have to do. anything. right or well. You can just be. That's step number one, especially if. it's a. a breakup after a long long. relationship. The next step. is reflection. You know, right now the story might be. they left me, they didn't love me, all. those years were wasted, how could I. have done that? I should have known. You.

right? I I must be disposable. It's a lot That's harsh. There's more color in that story. So. what were some of the red flags or some. of the even just the disconnection, the. things that weren't working? Take some. accountability in that. You know, I I. didn't communicate as well as I really. wish that I would have. Or you know. what? I stayed way too long cuz I tried. to communicate and that person wasn't. meeting me. That was really difficult. Take some. accountability around how you may have.

contributed, what you want in your relationship. moving forward, and more so focusing on who you want to. be now that that chapter has closed. Because I can tell you one thing, the. person who is for you is the person who. wants to be with you. Mhm. If they. aren't willing to try, they're. definitely not your person. Mhm. And I. think that most things, most. relationships can be worked out if. they're if two people are willing. Mhm. If you wanted to.

Barring some extreme cases. But. if they're not willing, they're not your. person. Now when it comes to moving on. specifically. I always say stop trying. Because we think that if Okay, if I just. do all of these steps, I have to do this. in the morning and this at night and. this is my evening routine and then I'll. wake up at someday and I'll be moved on. as if it's a destination. I say imagine yourself. tomorrow morning you wake up and you get. what you wanted. You want to move on. You want to trust.

yourself again. If you knew for certain that you would. wake up tomorrow and that was your. reality, what would you do with. yourself? >> That's a good question. What would you. think about? How would you spend your. time? What would you invest your your. energy into? Who would you spend your. time with? What would you think about? What would you talk about? And then just start to do some of those. things. >> Mhm. Bring the grief with you. It's probably. not going to happen as fast as you want. it to. But you want a direction. You. want a clearer vision of where you're. going so that you can head in that.

direction. Yeah, so good. That's such a. good answer because. yeah, all the little tips and tricks to. try and move on quick, it doesn't. process like that. And And I love the. idea of what would your life look like. if you'd already moved on because that's. what you're waiting for. You're waiting. for that anyway. You're waiting for the. day you've moved on and you can say, "I'm over it and I'm ready for. whatever." Yes. What is it? What does. that look like and start mirroring that. today? That's brilliant. >> the thing, right? I just want to move. on. Yeah.

>> that even mean to you? Like let's define. it. >> Yeah. >> That gives you something to to move. towards which is so important. And. moving on doesn't even necessarily mean. that you don't care. You might still. care. You might care about that person. for the rest of your life. >> Yes. But you want to build whatever your. next chapter is to be as enjoyable and. intentional as possible. >> Yes. And that gives you somewhere to go. Yes. And And mostly I was I was coaching. someone earlier this year and they were. going through a breakup. And the first month they broke up.

they talked about it every day. The second month after they broke up. they talked about every other day. The third month they talked about it. every 3 days. The fourth month they talked about it. once a week. Mhm. And then the fifth. month they thought about it once a. month. And I had to remind them of that because. to them every reminder was as sharp as. remembering it every day. Yeah. And I like you to think about it like. that. You're not trying to get to a. point.

where tomorrow you don't think about it. at all. You're just thinking about it less. because your life looks like how you. want it to be and what it would be like. if you were free. And I've always. thought about that mindset even when. I've had Even when you think about. physical pain, if you want to wake up. tomorrow and you've had surgery or. you're hurt or whatever and you want to. be completely healed, it would never. happen. You'll only ever be 1% better if. you did all the right things. Mhm. And. as soon as you accept that all I need to. do is be 1% better today, all of a. sudden you see that progress. But when.

you're looking to be 100% better and you. aren't, now you feel 99% behind. And it. just becomes so amplified and that's. what it feels like to be wanting to heal. from a breakup and you're constantly. feeling on why haven't I healed yet? That's that 90%. And oftentimes there. are. beliefs, almost almost identities that. we find ourselves trying to. finding ourselves wrestling with when a. breakup happens. No one will choose me. I'm never good enough. Nothing that I do. is good enough. No one will stay. It was.

all my fault or it was all their fault. How could they And we find these these. absolutes that are really really. difficult to do anything productive. with. Truly. I mean, it doesn't it doesn't. make you feel better emotionally. You. You can't really move yourself forward. from there. And And that's what I say. about just be. Be malleable with the story. Mhm. For a while, for the first month, for. the first what add a maybe. Mhm. Add a. question mark to the end of that. Like,

I'm difficult to love? Question mark? Mhm. And just just That's good. Don't. wrestle with the absolutes. Give yourself time and space to consider. another narrative cuz I promise you. there's color. There's nuance in that. Mhm. They didn't leave because you're hard to. love. Someone choosing not to love you is not. a reflection of how lovable or unlovable. you are. So, you know that. Don't wrestle with. the absolute. Give yourself time and.

space. Would be another piece of advice. >> I like the question mark. That's good. Yeah. It's true. It's true. It's totally true. It's totally true. I love that. Q, have you ever had your heart broken? Many times. In many different ways. Yeah. And it's. I have a I have an interesting. relationship with grief now. And in part, of course, my mom is is a. big part of that, but losing. relationships.

and growing through heartbreak has. always been a catalyst for me. And I don't say that as. like, I'm so high and mighty and this is. so impressive. No, it's usually quite. ugly and it's usually quite messy. To to really look at yourself and put. the pieces back together and and try to. move on, but I've always come out the. other side liking myself more. Mhm. Accepting uglier parts of myself that I. don't think I accepted previously.

You got to take a real look at. why you did what you did, how you showed. up, the people that you chose. And sometimes that means accepting like, man, I've been. I haven't been making the best choices. And I have to you have to love that. You. have to accept that. And. it expands your capacity in a way. that allows for the emotional. flexibility we were talking about. earlier. Where. the deepest heartbreak, losing my mom,

losing people that I thought I would. spend the rest of my life with, losing. that. makes everything else a little bit. easier to process. If I can survive. that, >> Yeah, yeah, yeah. I can survive. a lot. Yeah. A lot. And I've been there. through all of that. I've picked myself. back up. I've built a support system of. people who who remind me of that when. when I forget, right? There's. But I really learned to like myself. I.

really learned to trust myself. And I really learned that. there can be beauty in the mess if you. stay put. and go through it long enough to find. the bigger story, the bigger meaning, the bigger narrative. Q, we end every. episode on purpose with a final five. These five questions have to be answered. in one word to one sentence maximum. And so, Q, these are your final five. The first question is, what is the best. love advice you've ever heard or.

received? Do the loving thing. Mhm. Comma, and choose appreciation. I love it. You can do that. That's. Commas are fun. That was that was very. well done. Uh second question, what is. the worst love advice you've ever heard. or received? Match their energy. Two wrongs don't make a right. That's the reality. You don't Matching. someone's energy. means you're handing over your power. Mhm.

Cuz your power is in how you respond. Your power is in your intention. Are you. going to. add more negativity to a situation you. don't already you already don't like? Maybe you can choose how you want to. respond rather than matching someone's. energy. Mhm. And even more so, maybe. your love your decision to meet them. in a way that they can't seem to meet. themselves in that moment is exactly. what they need. Mhm. Love that. I always say to people, you. don't.

you don't mess up your living room just. because someone messy is coming over. Yes. That's well said. You just don't do. that. Like it's like I'm not going to. match that energy because then I'm going. to start walking over my rugs with my. dirty shoes and Right. >> Like, why would I do that just because. someone's coming over? It's like, no, they're they're a messy person. That's. fine. That's their mind and their space. and I'm not going to mess up my mind. because. we're interacting. It's a very. inauthentic way. to move through the world, to build.

relationships. Absolutely. Uh question number three, what did you used to believe to be true. about love and romance that you don't. anymore? I used to believe that. love, the feeling, Mhm. was enough. It's. fantastical. It's alluring, right? That someone will show up and. your whole life will be better. Everything will be whisked away by by. their love and live happily ever after. That's not a story that you really want.

>> Mhm. You know, you you want. to build a relationship intentionally. Mhm. You want to choose to give love and. to build love and to build this. relationship. And sometimes it takes. those those shitty moments, those really. tough moments to remind you how much you. value the really good moments. And I. think if love was just a feeling, we. would miss a lot of that. >> Mhm. Love is consideration, the action, the willingness. to continue showing up and.

creating more of it. Mhm. Love that. Question number four, what's something. that you used to value that you don't. value anymore? Being understood. People can really only meet you as. deeply as they've met themselves. Mhm. Which means that some people simply. won't have the ability to understand you. and that's okay. Mhm. You don't need to fight. to be heard, to be seen, to be approved.

of. Sometimes it's just okay to say, we don't agree. Mhm. I don't think you understand. And let it be. Love that. Okay, fifth and final question. We ask. this to every guest who's ever been on. the show. If you could create one law. that everyone in the world had to. follow, what would it be? To live within your integrity.

To decide. for each person individually, like, what. is right. to you? What kind of person do you want. to be? What is true for you, your truth? What kind of person do you strive to be. so much so that it feels in your bones, in your heart, just right. Mhm. I wish it was a law that everyone had to. figure out what that meant to them. And then they had to act on it. Mhm. Consistently cuz I I really believe.

that most, if not all of us, would would. choose to be good people. Mhm. Would choose to make value-based. decisions, kind decisions, loving. decisions, not. fear-based, hurtful, destructive. decisions. I really believe that if we. were all living within integrity, if we. had the courage to understand that for. ourselves, that we we would do. a lot of good. Yeah. I love that. That would be real. Q, thank you so much. Everyone who's been.

listening and watching, whether you're. walking your dog, whether you're driving. to or from work, whether you're cooking, I'm so grateful that you joined us. Please make sure that you follow Quinlan. Welfare on social media across platforms. and. I want to know what resonated with you. I want to know what connected with you. So, tag us both, take the clips, post. them, let us know what resonated, what. really got through to you. Share this. with a friend who may be going through a. breakup issue, maybe moving in with. someone, maybe a friend's getting. married soon. This could be one of those. episodes that I think you can listen to,

your friends and family can listen to. and connect with no matter where they. are on their love and romance journey. And again, Q, thank you so much for. showing up so authentically. It was so. great to just go back and forth with you. and dissect so many different themes and. topics. I'm so grateful to spend time. with you and I can't wait to have you. back. Thank you, Jay. Such a pleasure. Thanks so much. Hey, everyone. If you. love that conversation, go and check out. my episode with the world's leading. therapist, Lori Gottlieb, where she. answers the biggest questions that.

people ask in therapy when it comes to. love, relationships, heartbreak, and. dating. If you're trying to figure out. that space right now, you won't want to. miss this conversation. If it's a. romantic relationship, hold hands. It's. really hard to argue. It actually calms. your nervous systems. Just hold hands as. you're having the conversation. It's so. lovely.