2 Most Common Therapy Myths Debunked by a Real Therapist & How to Start Healing Your Inner Child

Every single morning, the first thing I. would do is cry. Just because being. awake was that difficult. I felt like a. like a ticking time bomb. It was just a. matter of when, really. Hey everyone, welcome back to this very. special episode of On Purpose, the. number one health podcast in the world, thanks to each and every single one of. you that come back every week to listen,

learn, and grow. Now, I am so grateful. for this amazing community that we have, for each and every one of you that lend. me your ears twice a week. And as you. know, I'm always always thinking about. new ways in which we can serve and. support our community and your journeys. towards a better understanding of. yourself and a better understanding of. your friends, your family members, and. the people around you, and the world. around us as well. Now, this episode is sponsored by.

BetterHelp online therapy. And today, I'm joined with Hesu Joe, licensed. marriage and family therapist and head. of clinical operations at BetterHelp. And in this new monthly series, we will. be serving real listeners of the show. and community. You'll hear the stories, the things that they struggle with, and. get to sit in on a real therapy session. with the intention of letting you know. you're not alone.

We're all dealing with something. And in. every show, we will address different. themes, different experiences. And our. goal is to bring more awareness to. taking care of your mental health and. provide everyone the tools, resources, and encouragement they need to heal. their past for a brighter future. Now, when we were thinking about this. idea, one of the things I realized is that. today we hear a lot about. therapy. People say, "Oh, my therapist.

said this to me." Or, "I learned this in. therapy.". But, rarely have we actually sat in on a. therapy session. We don't know what it. looks like. And often, our family members don't know. what it looks like. I'm hoping that this is going to be a. resource that you can share with your. friends, your family, so that they can. understand therapy better. So that you. can understand therapy better. And as a community, we can heal together. as well. Today, Hesu and I are joined by a very.

wonderful and special individual named. Ashley. And Ashley's joined us today to share. her journey, to share her story. And I. want you to welcome her and give her the. deepest, warmest, most beautiful welcome. from our On Purpose community, because. she so kindly agreed to be a part of. this today. So, Hesu and Ashley, so. grateful to have you here. I'm really, really thankful to do this. with both of you. And this is the first time we're doing. this. Uh.

it's historic and it's special. But, thank you for being here. Yeah, thank. you for having me. Yeah, thank you for. including both of us. Yeah, it's. exciting. It is. It is exciting. And, you know, we. were talking a bit beforehand. And. we really want to honor you, Ashley, and. and make sure that we serve you in an. effective way. And so, I'm going to now hand over to. Hesu. who's going to. start this wonderful conversation and. discussion. So, Hesu, over to you. I mean, just.

continuing a little bit of something Jay. was mentioning, I want to make sure that. you feel safe, that you feel. comfortable. So, if there's ever a. moment that the conversation is going. somewhere that doesn't feel right for. you, you can indicate that in whatever. way that you need to. But, thank you. Thank you so much for being willing and. open to talk about yourself for so many. people because I think part of. destigmatizing the idea of seeking. support is seeing other people. do that, right? Seeing other real people.

doing that versus just hearing. commercial after ad about doing this or. trying this new thing. So my understanding is that you've. already been in therapy for some time. and I was wondering if you could share a. little bit about what initially got you. to try it the first time. So initially, I was so against therapy. I didn't want. nothing to do with it. Like I thought I. was a lost cause. I was like no one can. help me. Like no one can. imagine what I'm going through or even. trying to tell me what I can do to get.

better cuz. in my mind, nothing could help me. 2018, I believe. I overdosed on like sleeping meds. and I was after that, I was kind of. actually forced into it. Like I didn't. have a choice. And that kind of started. my therapy journey. And from there, I. was in therapy for 2 years. So something. going on in your life led to some unsafe. behaviors like ways to cope. Like people. often turn to substance when there is. trauma because it helps numb stuff. It.

helps you not think about things. And sometimes you you feel good, right? It makes you feel not just better from. this thing that has been painful, but it. feels good. And so I'm hearing that you. had kind of like a mandated route into. therapy. You mentioned that you. wouldn't have considered it. So what. were some of your ideas about what. therapy was before? I didn't even know. where to even begin what therapy looks. like. I just thought someone would just. sit there and tell me.

"Oh, how do you feel about that? Mhm.". "Oh, how do you feel about that?" You. know what I mean? That's kind of like. what I thought or like someone try to. preach to me or like tell me what to do. or. how I should do it. But really, it. wasn't like that at all for for. It ended up being something different. Mhm, exactly. And I I know you can't. like give an entire synopsis of the. therapeutic journey that you've been. through, but now that you have gone. through some of these sessions and it. sounds like you found out it wasn't just. So, how did that make you feel? How did.

And I'm sure your therapist did ask many. times, "Well, how did that make you. feel?" What do you think of therapy now. then? What is therapy if somebody is to. ask you, a seasoned client, like what to. expect if they were to try this out? Therapy is amazing. Honestly, I. recommend it to everybody. They tell me. the problem is like, "You know what you. need? A therapist." And like I don't. even mean that in like a negative It's. not a negative thing at all. It's very. positive and I try to enlighten that. But for me, when I was in therapy,

like Okay, so you have these dark. thoughts. And when you don't recognize them or you. don't even know what they are, it can. easily spiral out of control. And so with therapy, she really helped. me recognize these thinking traps, is. what we would call them. And throughout the day, I was more aware. like if I was say, "I'm worthless." Or. you you can't do that. Or like, "Wait a. minute." Like that's not true. Like. let's kind of lay it out and understand. like what this is or like where it's. coming from. That's something I still. practice until this day, every single.

day. Catch myself thinking something. negative. And obviously there's more to. it, but. something I really took away from that. Yeah, you're describing cognitive. behavioral therapy, CBT. what it is. Yeah, you you went through. this process where somebody helped you. learn to identify and then articulate. your internal process. Because when you. can start talking about it or even. understanding it a little bit better, I. think that's when you really are able to. make strides in terms of finding healing. for yourself, the ability to let the. things go that you need to, the ability.

to move on. So, you shared a little bit. about what led to your first session, right? Somebody You were you were forced. because you became unsafe to yourself. Exactly. Can you share now what you. think led to the types of feelings you. were trying to numb with substances? Well, I think it was just like a lead-up. Um. there wasn't like a particular. event Well, something did trigger it and. I can talk about that. But it's overall, like I've been struggling with it for.

since I was a young child. I think it. was like really just like a matter of. time. And I think if I like received. help sooner, it wouldn't have gotten to. that point. And for like a lot of people. like me, unfortunately, something that drastic. has to happen for us even want to accept. help. Yeah. The rock bottom experience, right? Like. people Not just people Not I should say. we we often feel like there's some kind. of like shortcoming or something wrong.

with me if I need to reach out for. support because a lot of us have this. misconception that therapy is for the. weak-minded. Yeah. The people that are absent of some. kind of strong will of their own. And it. takes a lot of courage, I think, to. finally realize like vulnerability takes. a lot of strength. Being able to open up. to someone Being able to open up to. yourself and admit a lot of stuff. Yeah. And so you mentioned like. your life led to that moment. I'm sure a. series of events. And then you also said. something about something did trigger.

this. So that's something that you're. willing to kind of open up about now? I think at that time, it would my. depression really had a hold of me. Every single morning, I would The first. thing I would do is cry. Just because. being awake was that difficult. I. couldn't even I didn't even want to. spend the day with myself. Like. mentally. That was going on for a couple. months, and I feel like no matter what I. did, like one day I would wake up. I. feel like I would do a good job.

But I feel like it was still not enough. I'm like, "Wow, I really gave it my all, and it still was not enough." I was. like, "What is the point of being here? One day my ex-boyfriend and I got in a. an argument. and I was like, wow, I will. I'm just again, I'll never be enough, I'll never be worthy. And normally in those situations, I will. contemplate. I'll have a conversation. with myself. Like, okay Ashley, you. know, one more day, one more day, like. just hold on, hold on. But that day, there was no conversation with myself. A.

switch just flipped and. I just went through with it and I was. like, worst case scenario, I go to sleep. and I wake up like, okay, but like best. case scenario for me, I go to sleep and. I I don't even know what happened. That's what I was hoping for, but it. didn't exactly go as planned, which is. probably the best. I feel like a like a. ticking time bomb. It was just a matter. of when, really. And you're describing just like living. for such a long time without knowing how. to regulate your emotions and really. process a lot of stuff, right? And it.

like blew up in an argument, sounds. like. I want to shift gears a little bit. and kind of ask a little bit more about. your previous therapy experiences so. far. So while you've been in therapy, I'm hearing you say that you've learned. some skills, you've learned some things. to like cope with and navigate everyday. life. Like, how did you learn that. stuff? Like, what is it that the. therapist was doing to teach these. things, right? So I'm a huge imagery. person. And like one thing we would do, it was.

it was kind of like, how do I describe. it? Like a court case, okay? Like you. have your like the jury, you have like. the lawyer stuff like that. One thing I. struggled with was feeling like I'm not. capable of taking care of myself. Like. I'm a grown adult, I should be able to. take care of myself and I I couldn't. And so we would break down the evidence. Like, okay, what's real and like what's. false? Like let's just recognize that. there. Because when you're this kind of mindset. you tell yourself so many lies, stuff.

that's not even true. And so I would I'm like, "Okay, well I I. do this. I do my laundry sometimes. Like. I have been working out past couple. weeks. Like oh, you do feed yourself.". You have to give yourself credit for the. things that you actually do. And you I. would we would write it down in the. evidence section. And we would write down like what was. false. And basically like the jury would come. to the conclusion like, "No, you are. capable." So yeah, you would just really. just have to in that process give.

yourself credit and kind of look at. what was real and what wasn't. And you would shift those thoughts of I. should be able to. And you change it. into. no, you are able to and you and you do. It's a lot of just shifting the way you. think about stuff, taking on different. perspectives, hearing someone kind of. re- word or like paraphrase your life in. a different way. It sounds like you've learned a lot. about yourself, too. There's like a. period of time where it sounds like you. didn't really know who you were. Mhm.

Like what parts of learning these. skills, learning how to identify. evidence for and against some kind of. thought or belief helped you figure out. who you are? Like do you feel like there. was some kind of self-exploration, self-. identification type of process? Like. it's not just learning skills, right? It's I guess I'm I'm trying to get to. your sense of any kind of change in the. ways that you perceive yourself. Like. how has that kind of shifted in that.

2-year period? So a lot of people, I. believe, feel like they go to therapy. and overnight they're so much better. And that's just not the case. And for. me, again, I get till this day I something I. have to practice every single day. So. there wasn't like one particular moment. where I just like saw myself in like a. better light. Eventually you keep practicing and. practicing and practicing. And. eventually. you start to learn yourself. you start. to value yourself, and you see yourself.

in a whole different light. You have You. learn boundaries, and you have them now, and you have rules for yourself, and you. don't. allow certain people or certain. situations. control you as much because you have. more confidence in the tools and the. coping mechanisms that you have. developed throughout therapy. And that's. definitely that helped me a lot and like. till this day. I really do see myself in a higher. light. And I don't let people. take advantage of me as much as I used.

to back in the day. Back in the day. people took advantage of you. In In what ways do you think that was. happening that you're able to prevent. now? Well, just one example. you were mentioning earlier, people they. they kind of self-sabotage, whether it's. drugs, alcohol. For me, I didn't do any. of that. For me, my reckless behavior. was being promiscuous, and that's kind. of like what I learned growing up was. giving yourself for.

in return for love. So, that's what I thought I had to do in. order to receive any sort sort of um. love. And so, I would give myself to guys, you. know, and like thinking, "Oh, this is. how they're going to accept me. This is. like where they're going to love me, and. this is where I'm valued.". And now it's it's not like that at all. I'm still like, "No, I have so much more. to give than my body, you know what I. mean?". And so, that's just one example of how.

things have definitely shifted for me. You're speaking of something huge here, right? Is like we as people, we learn. how to not only give love, but how to. receive love from very significant. people really early in our lives, childhood, and those people that are. supposed to love us unconditionally, keep us safe, nurture us, show us that. the world is a safe place, have a lot of. power over us as young children. And so, and what I'm hearing is when you were a. young child, some kind of event or.

series of events taught you that love. means. something, you know, specific, right? So, I I'm. curious, in your therapy experience, how. much did you go back and talk about your. childhood in that time? When I went to. therapy, we did go Well, you kind of. have to understand why you feel this. way, and it does stem from your. childhood, everything. So, we we really did start from there, and we broke it down from there. It.

really does. help. You You start to realize. what how you're acting in the present is. it stems from that. We reenact, we try. to correct what happened to us as kids. in our adult relationships, and I think. we all try to the best of our. ability, but try to correct something. that happened to us when we're six. We. didn't We didn't know any better, you. know? Try to make this six-year-old, you. know, be smarter. You should have known.

better, which we tell ourselves all the. time. It sounds like you learned to have. compassion for the small child inside of. you. Yes, 100% like even to this day. Like I'm 27 years old, and I still to. this day I still feel like that little. girl. Like I feel like it's my duty to. protect myself and be that person little. Ashley needed when she was younger. You. really do feel like it's your fault, like or you should have done this. differently, or you should have done. that. You blame yourself, and you're. ashamed of it, but really it's not in your control, and.

the people in your lives. should have been the ones protecting. you. Yeah, shame. Shame is a very. powerful thing, right? It's like. there's like a difference between when. we feel guilty for doing something bad, we recognize it, this thing we probably. could have made a different choice. But, shame is like adding some. really painful and uncomfortable stuff. on top of that. I did this bad thing. because I'm a bad person, or this bad. thing happened to me and I deserved it. because I'm a bad person. Like, in therapy, do you feel like you.

can remember some kind of shift in that. sense of shame? Like, something that. released you from feeling like all this. stuff happened to me because I'm bad. What about this process, what about. talking about yourself and your life. helped you start to shift this idea away. from being a bad person? Cuz I'm hearing. you say that you are a good person. When did that change? Like, how does. that change? There's not one moment where it just. shifts. It truly is happens over time. and within my time of therapy, the 2.

years, of course, I relationships, jobs, real-life situations are happening, and when I'm acting on them and I feel. like, oh, this is happening to me, I deserve it. anyways, I'm a piece of crap, you know. what I mean? Like, and so you would accept that for. yourself. But, over time you realize. like, wait a minute, like I don't. deserve that at all. It shouldn't be. happening to me, you shouldn't accept. that. And once you create those. boundaries for yourself. and practice it, it does get better. You.

know, a lot of people wonder like, why. do we go to therapy every week? What is. it about this cadence of whatever? And. it's like, why don't we go every day if. I'm trying to solve this huge problem. that's been part of my life for such a. long time? And really, your life, your. healing is what happens outside of. therapy. It's just 1 hour a week most of. the time. It's like, you can't expect. this 1 hour a week talking to someone on. a couch or whatever to to fix. everything. It's talking about some. stuff, learning some things, identifying. feelings and behaviors that you could.

try to start working on in a different. way. It's in your real life outside of. the session that this transformation is. really happening. For some people, very. gradually and over a long period of. time. You mentioned you're 27, that's. like, you know, potentially 25 years of. learning how to be in a particular space. in a body and. it's going to take time to like unlearn, relearn, and start seeing the world in a. way that is safe, right? So, what would you say like if you had not. gone to therapy,

you know, where where would we be? Where. would you be? Oh my goodness. Like, if I. never went to therapy, I would not be the person that I am. today, nor be the person that I'm. becoming. My self-awareness has grown so. much, and I'm able to take care of. myself more mentally. I'm able to. value my thoughts more. Or just like, again, if I'm negative, I recognize it. real quick and I try to change it into.

something more enlightening and more. actually true. I go from false to true. You know, people come to therapy and. over time after what's called the. assessment period where your therapist. is getting to know you and asking you. about your family history and like all. your school stuff and everything you. remember from your family childhoods, whatever. Once you move past this. initial period where you're building. this relationship, you start thinking. about goals. What are the goals that I. want to work on? And so you and your.

therapist like agree on these usually. two or three major things that you want. to achieve through this process. And. usually you're looking for something. called smart goals. People talk about. this all the time. You want to be. specific, measurable. What's not always. explicitly stated as a goal is increased. self-awareness, but I think that's. always going to be an outcome. At least. I think most therapists are hoping that. that's an outcome for their clients. So, I'm really glad that you were able to. even identify that that's something.

that's shifted for you is. self-awareness. honestly without my self-awareness, I I. I would be so lost cuz I do believe. self-awareness is the first step. Like. you have to even recognize what you're. doing or how you're behaving or what. you're thinking about yourself. That's. where it's starting like from. recognizing it. So if you don't. recognize that you really can't move. forward or even try to get better. You. were talking about the assessments. Right? And so maybe like every 6 months. we would review. And when I was feeling better, you know, I'm doing better.

We were reviewing from 6 months ago. And. it was so. sad. I was I was my heart was breaking. for 6 months ago Ashley. And she was say she was saying referring. to her as another I'll say as but that's. how I feel. It's like I feel like a new. person. Like honestly, but she was just. referring to her like as self like. unworthy, I'll never get better. She's. like it was this very very dark. thoughts. And I was so sad for I'm like, oh my.

god. I'm like that was me. Are you sure. you're on the you're on the right. assessment? And like how I said these. things? And yeah, it's true. It was like. it was a transformation and. to reflect back on all of those and like. how I was feeling where I am today. Um it was a good feeling cuz I wasn't. feeling that way any longer. Yeah. What. you said is like exciting to me because. you're describing this very powerful. component of not just therapy, but just. like tracking tracking your thoughts, tracking your moods, your behaviors.

This is like why a lot of people choose. to journal. They like to look back and. see how far they've come. Like if you. never wrote down or put somewhere where. you could remember where you were, it's. very very hard to identify how much. better you've become, how much better. you're feeling. So in therapy it's a. really like. specific, intentional place to be able. to have someone else doing that with. you, tracking stuff, bringing your. attention back to like, "Remember what. you said last time? Cuz that doesn't. really fit with what you're saying. today." I'm hearing that you had a great.

therapist, really. It's like somebody. that Yeah, is with you in this moment, but also taking you back to relevant. moments in the past to make connections. This is what helps people gain better. self-awareness, because self-aware. people think about themselves in every. chapter and season of their lives, try. to relate the past to the present, and. how that's going to affect their future. And really, somebody that's not. self-aware is going to be really hard. for them to practice empathy, the be. able ability to feel for another.

So, can you say anything about like your. experience with empathy and whether you. notice like a shift with that with your. improved self-awareness? Yeah, so I was. considered myself an empathetic person. even before then, but there would be times where I'd feel. like a robot, like almost incapable of. feeling sorry for somebody. I like just. I feel like I might I feel bad cuz I'm. like I feel like I should. feel something towards them, but I. don't. And I I I really do. I think that.

helped me. later on down the line to be more. empathetic, 100%. That's like a big life. thing. It's like I think we're all. hardwired to connect, to want to be with. other people, to have intimacy with. folks that are important to us, and how. can you do that if you don't even know. who you are? Yes, 100%. When you're. really not sure of. who you are, I'm I'm I mean, I don't know who I am. I'm still growing, you know, but at that. time, when you you're just kind of like. I would describe myself as a loose. cannon, you know what I mean? Like I.

couldn't process any type of emotions or. receive love. Like I didn't know what. that looked like. I didn't know how to. accept it nor like return it. It really. affected how I dealt with relationships, friendship-ships, careers, just because. I didn't even know how certain emotions. or certain situations would look like. Like I didn't know what was normal. We. have these wounds inside, right? That I. think a lot of us want to heal. We. attempt to heal them in so many. different ways, whether it's substance.

that helps numb these wounds a little. bit, or reckless sexual behaviors where. we're trying to connect, where we're. chasing intimacy, but it's still a. little bit different. Or, you know, burying ourselves in work. Like, all. this stuff that we're trying to do to. feel normal, like you say. What I'm. hearing is like a larger acceptance of. just you as you are, that you don't have. to perform, that you don't have to be. like a specific model of someone in. order to be worthy of anything. You. really accomplished a lot. Thank you.

What would you say were your initial. goals? I mean, you know, past the point. of like being forced into therapy, when. did it become a choice to you? There. were times where I I I would look. forward to therapy. And things would happen throughout the. week. And I'd go to therapy I used to go. to therapy once a week. I would leave the room the the house and. I'd just be like, my therapist is going. to get a earful today. Like, I couldn't. wait to share what I was going through. with my therapist. Like, someone who. understand, wasn't judging me, someone.

who can break it down for me. And that. was really refreshing cuz I didn't I. don't I don't I I still don't really. have that support system family-wise. So, having that one person. in my life that I can trust and turn to, it was amazing. Somebody that's. listening to you to respond to you about. you. You mentioned like, I don't have. this in my family. And like, even people. with very loving, very caring, very. well-meaning families. still don't really always have that with. family because those good intentions.

also come with their own baggage and. their own feelings and their own agendas. of what they want between them and you. Just somebody to break it down, just. hear you out, help you help mirror. stuff, right? Like, therapists say like, we we're just here to hold up a mirror, right? To help you see. see yourself a little bit better. cuz we all go through trauma that that. makes it very difficult for us to like. see past. all this stuff that we build up to. protect ourselves from future traumas. In therapy the therapist asks you a lot.

of questions. What's your sense of like. what these questions are for? Why do we. ask so many questions or why do you. think that we ask so many questions? In the beginning obviously I'm just like. nosy. I'm like okay like. I was like. jeez my social security too? I'm like. But really it's it's come to find out. like again holding the mirror up it's. really reflection of like who you are as. a person how did you become this person. why are you acting this way? So every.

question there is really intention. behind it it's not just some aimless. question like trying to be nosy you know. like they're not judging you. So I feel like every single question. from my therapist you know there was she. was just looking out for me and wanted. to help me become more aware of why I. was behaving a certain way or acting or. thinking a certain way. Yeah all the. questions intention I like that you used. that because. you know sometimes therapists who are. just people we're just people.

um sometimes those curious questions or. how you would say nosy they do pop up. here and there. but it is like a a therapist's uh kind. of duty to refrain from doing that. Like. you might be talking about something. from your life and then you mention like. a restaurant that I've been to and my. initial reaction of wanting to talk. about and make this connection like oh. I've been there and I got this item from. the menu. Like those things. we often refrain from that because in. therapy it is about you. Of course it's. going to somewhat be about me cuz I'm a.

human and we're connecting as two people. and my experiences beliefs and values. are going to be present in this room. Um. but it's very important for therapists. not to impose those things right or like. make you have particular goals or try to. get you to think the way that I do. Very unbiased. Yeah. Very judge non-judgmental. It was very. neutral. Like you said, she didn't try to. impose her opinions or thoughts.

To an extent with the thoughts, but. opinions she she never really did that. Right. Right. The opinion stuff were. like we're taught and trained to like. leave that stuff outside the door. Go to. your own therapist so you're really sure. of what your stance is on a bunch of. stuff are so that you don't have to come. into a session and argue clients about. it. Yeah. Especially like, you know, heated climates like we have in current. modern society. Um I can't imagine going to a therapy.

session she's telling me no, you're. wrong. I'm just like. Right. And like this debate, you know. what I mean? It's not like that at all. I'm very glad you had that because a. personal experience, which I think a lot. of people can relate to, is we turn to. sometimes a best friend and, you know, older family member, maybe our mom. We. turn to these people with the. expectation that they will be there for. us without judgment. That they'll. respond to us in a way that's loving and. caring and nurturing. And a lot of times. those responses are loving, caring, and.

nurturing, but they're also filled with. the judgment, the criticisms of you. could have done it this way. It probably. would have been better if you thought. about it this way. So, family very. well-meaning, but also emotionally charged, also like entangled into your life and. they have their own like motivations, things that they're trying to accomplish. to propel this relationship in whatever. direction. When you're in such a. vulnerable state and you don't know.

what's going on, and even though maybe a family member. has the great great intentions and. they're basically putting their thoughts. and opinions onto you, you're in a. really vulnerable state and you might. take their advice, and it's just. totally wrong and totally not the right. direction to go. So, even though family. members are supportive, therapy is. definitely. highly recommended from my end. Makes me wonder like what what big. differences You've shared some already,

but some other differences that you can. think of between going to like a really. close friend for support versus talking. to a therapist? So, even just. when I was a teenager, I turned to my best friend, and it's not. her fault because. she's she's not licensed. She's She's. just a kid, too. And I'm like, "Hey, I. think I'm really depressed." And she's. like, "You're not depressed. You're just. sad." I was like, "Okay." And then my. ex-boyfriend from around that time, I. would try to express my thoughts and my.

concerns, and he thought I was looking. for attention and make a little like. snickers with his friends like, "Oh my. god, this girl's crazy." You know what I. mean? Like, "Psycho." And at this point, you're. like, "You don't even understand. yourself." She's like, "Oh, I am psycho. I'm real crazy. Like, I'm going to show. you crazy.". Like, you act on that, you know? Cuz. that's what you believe you are. And my mom, that's a different story, you know? I. tried telling her I'm like, "I'm so. angry. I feel this way." I'm like, "I. don't understand why. Like, I think I. need help.".

And I didn't know what was wrong with me. or why I'm this way. I just knew it. wasn't normal. And. she doesn't even lack or she doesn't. even. have the depth to understand such a. concept. And so, maybe she cared for me, but she wasn't. the ideal person to try to go for help. And so, those were my three closest. people in my life. Again, it's not my. ex-boyfriend's fault or my best friend's. fault. They they don't know any better. Yeah. But as a.

a parental figure, I definitely needed. more guidance and more direction, and a. lot of people don't have that. And I think that's another thing that. stir like steered me away from wanting. to receive any more help. Just because. of those kind of experiences. I'm like, "Wow, no one understands and no one's going to. want to help me." Yeah, I mean this is. what happens when I open up is I met. with like rejection or someone. withdrawing or someone shutting down or. someone telling me I'm wrong, invalidating my experience, saying that.

I'm not really feeling the thing that I. think I'm feeling. You feel like you shouldn't be feeling. this way. Like you don't have a right to. or like you're just looking for. attention or. I people have it worse. You know, like why do you feel that way? You You have no right to feel that way. So, that really does affect you and. Yeah. how you. betray people. There are people out. there that have it much worse than you. I think that is like someone's attempt. to help you feel better because they're.

like trying to minimize the issue that. you're bringing to them. Or even your. friend, like, "You're not depressed, you're just sad." I can see that being a. 16-year-old solid attempt. at making the situation less scary, but. not just for you, but less scary for. her. Oh, yeah. Same thing with your. ex-boyfriend, like making a joke of this. thing that you're bringing up that's. actually really uncomfortable for you. A. lot of people respond that way because. they don't know how else to handle it. They can't hold space for it because. they're not really sure what to do and.

they start feeling heightened. They. start feeling emotional themselves and. then their own defense mechanisms start. coming out. And some people use humor, um which can be very harmful to like the. people around them. Yeah, and then, you. know, with mom, it's a lot of moms. They really mean. well, but they are also people and a lot. of moms have I mean, plenty of moms have been to therapy, but. I think a lot of them haven't. And this thing that you mentioned of. like maybe she doesn't have the depth, it's probably she doesn't have the. training, she doesn't have the.

understanding to help you. feel safe in the feelings that you're. having. And also, you know, our parents'. first instinct is like, "Oh my god, my. child is hurt. I have to make them feel. better." versus "My child is hurt. We're. going to hold space for that and let. them know it's okay to be hurt." Right? And that's like a big difference between. parents and a therapist. A therapist is. not going to try to immediately put a. band-aid on it, but it's like, "Let's. like really get in there.". Let's take the band-aid off. Let's see. what's How bad is this wound? Like, what. happened to it? Like, how did you even.

get the wound? You know what I mean? Oh, the wound. Bring it back. I think I. forgot to close that loop, you know? We. have wounds inside and we do all these. things trying to heal them. Ultimately, if you don't heal that. stuff, it will end up like bleeding out. on other people. Yes. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, it's the gory scene. Yeah, the gory scene of like our. emotional blood and baggage just like. following us around everywhere and it's. it's contagious, you know? It's like any. feeling is contagious when you're with. other people and when you're not well,

other people feel that, right? So. I imagine. a cloud over me. It's just raining, you. know? I have my boyfriend here. He's. getting rained on. It's poured. And I. feel like it was almost my fault. Like, I brought this into your life. Like, you. didn't deserve this. I'm just. I really felt like I was bringing people. down with me and they didn't need that. And that was another thing that led to. why I did what I did. Everyone Everyone. would be better off without me. So, if. you don't address the help,

blood's everywhere, you know? I think. we're we're. touching on so many stuff that's very. relatable to a lot of people and I'm. hearing you sing praises of how. therapy's been helpful. Like, what would. you say to someone that's like maybe in. a similar head space to where you were. before of thinking like it's just not. going to help. Anytime I've tried to. open up to somebody, it led to something. worse for me. Any pieces of advice to give to someone. that's still very skeptical, resistant, fearful of trying this thing? Number.

one, I would say, do not tell them. how you think they should feel. So, if. you try to tell someone like they're. going to automatically tune you out. Like, you're automatically disqualified. like in that like who are you to tell me. cuz like So, just listen to them. Like, listen to what they have to say. And I wouldn't, again, put your opinions. or your personal thoughts on it. For me, personally, because I have been through. it, I would just be there with them and. this is so powerful to me. Rather than,

oh, you should do this, I would say, we should go to therapy. Like, let me help you find somebody. Because I didn't have that support. I. didn't have someone who was going to. hold my hand and help me find the help. So, for me, I would I would just hold. their hand and. try to find somewhere. to get them help that they're feel. comfortable. And you're like I'm trying. feeling like emotional because that's. what you're doing here, right? You're. like figuratively holding the hands now. of so many people by sharing your.

experience and being so open about all. this stuff that you've been through and. like you know, rehashing a lot of your. own thought process from the past that. weren't very healthy. Sometimes people. just need permission. I don't know if. that's like from themselves or from. other people to. do something good and do something nice. for. themselves. Nice for me. And while your. your journey to therapy wasn't quite. like I'm going to do this for me today. Um you know, at some point you were. choosing to keep going back. Yeah. Mhm.

Yeah. And would you ever do it again? Would you ever go back to. 100%. Like, I already know I'm going to. go back to therapy. Not because I'm. depressed, but because I just need that. extra helping hand, you know what I. mean? I I. I definitely think I'll need therapy for. the rest of my life. Not because there's. something wrong with me or like I'm. suicidal again or something like that. Just because it really is helpful. What's helpful about it? It really helps you. understand. why you feel a certain way about a.

certain certain situation. And I know as. I get get older, maybe marriage or kids, I'll have those. conflicts of like, I'm letting my child. down. I can't provide for them. And you. know, that will probably stem from how I. feel certain times today or how I can't. provide for myself. And I know that probably will not be the. case as I get older, but I'm sure therapy will. help me understand that. So, it's helpful for navigating life's.

everyday challenges, right? Like we're. all posed with a thousand decisions to. make per day. And most of the time we're. making those decisions largely on our. own. And that's the interesting thing about. therapy. It's not that your therapist is. making further decisions for you, but. helping you identify what decisions like. lie in there already. Like you already. know the answers and the truth to what. life is. We all know that for ourselves somewhere. deep inside, and I think therapy really. helps us like unlock the stuff that.

we've pushed down. You know, things like. not having confidence or not believing. in ourselves to make the right choices. or not feeling worthy, not feeling. adequate. It really makes it hard to. listen to ourselves and to hear those. deep down truths that already exist. Yeah, like you don't believe the truth. at all. Like you could look in the mirror and be. like, you're so ugly. Like obviously. obviously like you're not ugly. You know. what I mean? But all truths are out the. window and like you don't even value. your opinions. When you're dealing with. like mental health issues.

Yeah. So, you mentioned you've experienced. depression, which does sometimes include feeling. sad, but like what how did depression. manifest in your life? Like what made. you feel like this is the word I'm going. to use to describe how I'm feeling to. other people. For somebody listening to. this conversation like that might be. feeling depressed themselves, but they. don't have the words to articulate that. yet, like what would you clue them into? Like how do you know that you're. depressed? For me, I was very, very angry. The moment I.

woke up, I just filled with so much. rage. And it'll be to the point where I. just want to cry. That's how like angry. I was. And obviously, you're being suicidal. I. don't want to live. That's not normal. Like I just want to. end my life and you're sitting there. have a pro pros and cons list trying to. think out like, okay, like why should I. not do it? Like that's not normal. And. just constantly feeling. worthless, like not feeling like you.

deserve to live. These I knew were not normal. I felt that way. like as a young child. Just It started. with the anger. That's why I can tell. you it was It started with anger. And that's insight because if you ask a. therapist, how does depression manifest. in youth, in small children, and anger. is actually something that someone needs. to assess for. Um temper tantrums, this like really disregulated. way of being. If you're waking up really. pissed off every day, that's not normal.

Yeah, and I definitely encourage parents. cuz I see it a lot. Like if a child does. act out every all children act out, but. if it's like a constant pattern and. you're punishing them, I think that's. like the worst. I'm like, no, take a. take a moment, listen to your child, try. to have a a conversation and understand. why are they feeling this way? And. you'd you'd probably learn a lot about. your child and realize punishing them, sending them room, making it worse. essentially is not the way to go, but.

getting help and probably the parent. needs help, too. You know, it's it's a. it's a. partnership between the child and the. parent. Yeah. Some education around just emotions, how. they how they creep up, like what they. look like in kids. I mean, small kids. especially like. their primary language is not English or. whatever language it is where they're. growing up. It's play. They they. understand the world through how they. play, how they engage in a very active.

way outside of just like verbal. communication. So yes, like paying. attention to kids' mood, so you paying. attention to your own mood and. recognizing something's not normal. Yeah, and if I like my mom was more. aware. and more educated about something like. that, I probably wouldn't. have. grew up the way I did in certain ways. Yeah, plenty of parents they mean well. They really tried their best. Um, this speaks to like the importance of.

education around emotional intelligence. and maybe incorporating a little bit. more into like standard curriculums at. school, how to just like tune into your. feelings, how your feelings affect your. everyday life. I imagine many of us. could have benefited if our moms were a. little bit more aware about all this. stuff. Yeah, 100%. Yeah, I don't mean to laugh, but some. people are really they're really are. clueless, I should say. And I really. think it's very helpful to start with.

children or even teenagers. I think. that's really where it begins cuz that's. where you start to become programmed to. be a certain way. And you're going to move out of your. parents' house and you're going to live. live your life, but yet you're still. acting a certain way. And like you don't. even realize it's coming from your. childhood. Like you just think you're. some like adult with an anger problem or. you're just like super depressed and you. don't even know why. And that will carry. on with you if you don't recognize that. you have you have a.

a mental health problem. And therapy. helped you in in those ways of. recognition and. you know, connecting the dots between. what happens in childhood and how you're. relating to other people now. Mhm. Thank. you, Ashley, for opening up so much and. sharing about your journey. It's really um. you know, just sitting and listening to. you both have a discussion. about the journey you've been on. Also hearing you open up about your.

feelings as someone who's in the room. observing. It's actually really quite remarkable. when you get to. just be patient and listen to someone. reflect on their own emotions. because it encourages you to do the same. for yourself. And so I know that, you know, to. the hundreds of thousands of people, millions of people that will listen to. this afterwards, I'm hoping that everyone who's listening. and watching is also. thinking about the questions that Ashley. is asking, thinking about the.

ideas that you're mentioning and. are gaining that self-awareness and uh. regulation of their emotions and their. understanding of themselves. because it's strange to sit in on a. conversation, I think. Most of the time we spend our time in. conversations thinking, "What am I going. to say?". Yeah. Like, "Oh, what what should I say. back to that person?". And obviously, as we see with Ashley, what she's doing is. she's trying not to project her own. feelings so that she can truly listen to.

you. And then I've just been silent for. the last nearly 40 minutes, 45 minutes, and that's actually a really powerful. practice, too, because. now you're not sitting there thinking, "What should I say?" or "How do I. sound?" or "Oh, I can relate or not. relate." or judging, but I can just. observe. And so I think this has been a really. powerful practice even for me to just. sit and listen and and sit and hear.

I think it's just been a healthy. conversation to have a discussion about, you know, the benefits you've seen and. the growth you've seen and I think. that's a great. uh starting point for this series and. and just understanding the benefits of. therapy and someone who's, you know, committed to 2 years, 2 years, right? Someone who's committed to 2 years of. therapy and and the benefits they've. seen. So, I'm very happy with the fact. that everyone who's been listening and. watching has had the opportunity to. sit in on a conversation with a. therapist and and see how where some of.

the questioning can go. And and also to sit with someone who has. done therapy. who is able to articulate and explain. their experiences, you know, clearly Yeah. and concisely. I know there's a lot of. people. who are like me. Like, I don't have a. family to turn to or at the time many. friends. I didn't have a huge support. system. So, I really truly felt very, very alone. So, to take those steps,

it takes a lot of courage and I hope. people listening. really take away like, even though I am. I am alone, like I don't have that. support system, there's still hope for me. Like, I'm. still worthy. And I hope I really, really, really, really hope that. they do the research and really find. someone they they connect with and I do. not want them to just get discouraged if. they get a therapist and there's. they're not connecting cuz not every. therapist is going to be for you and I. think it's very, very important to find.

the one that that is for you. And. I really just hope people who are. listening really, really, really, really. do receive the help that they need cuz. there's. nothing wrong or negative about therapy. whatsoever. It truly is life-changing and I do not. regret it at all. I know I'm going to do. it again. And I'm so grateful for my therapist. When we like how we were on the phone. during the COVID times and we were like.

saying our goodbyes. You know, she's. like, "I'm so proud of you, Ashley. Like, you really have come so far.". And I I just started crying cuz she. really was almost kind of like that. mother figure that I never really had. and like someone who truly cared about. me and wanted better for me. Yeah. You're just crying so many like. pinnacles of things that therapists. learn about in grad school. Like, you know, psychologists love to label. label human behaviors with all kinds of. words and stuff. But like, the therapist.

becoming like a mother figure to you, that's. that happens a lot, right? It's It's. what we call like a corrective emotional. experience. This person that is. validating of you, that can listen to. you, nurture you, kind of show you what. gentle love and acceptance looks like. and feels like in a really controlled. safe setting. And it's not that like, you know, therapists are not set up to like become. your new family. I didn't say that, but. I think experiences that come through. sessions can help someone recognize.

like, "I can create my own family, whatever that means to me." Like, the. stuff that I feel like is supposed to. come from family, which is love, acceptance, support, I can provide that. to myself and I can learn how to do. that. Yes. With this other person that. can model for me because unfortunately. my mom didn't or, you know, whatever it. is. Amazing. Well, thank you both so much. for. helping us sit in on that conversation. and to observe and learn and listen and. um just really grateful for both of your.

honesty and transparency and. As if for guiding this conversation and, you know, asking really. insightful, thoughtful questions to. really extrapolate the learnings and I. hope everyone who's been listening and. watching back at home, uh you felt you've got a bit more of an. insight. And we're going to be doing a. lot of these episodes where we. dive into different themes, have. different conversations, uh look at this from different angles, and I'd love to hear your feedback. I'd. love to hear your thoughts. I'd love to. hear what you learned, what surprised.

you, maybe maybe something you didn't. expect, or maybe something that you felt. reassured by. I genuinely love to hear. from you, so make sure you share your. feedback in the reviews, on Instagram, on Twitter, wherever else you're active, please do let us know, because I'm. always looking out to see what is it. that resonated with you, what is it that. connected with you. And for those of you. who don't know, this episode was brought. to you by BetterHelp, which is helping. millions of people by making. professional therapy more affordable and. accessible than ever.

And I have shared my own top three. reasons why I believe everyone can try. therapy. Uh and to check that out, you can visit. betterhelp.com/jaystop3. Uh and so that's betterhelp.com/jays, j a y s, that's my name. t o p 3, uh and when you do that, everyone who. does that will get 10% off your first. month of online therapy when you sign up. as well. So that's for our On Purpose.

listeners. And so remember that you. deserve to invest in yourself, and. BetterHelp is a great way to start to do. that. Thank you so much to Asu, thank you to. Ashley. Yes, thank you. Thank you both for joining me today. If you want even more videos just like. this one, make sure you subscribe and. click on the boxes over here. I'm also. excited to let you know that you can now. get my book Think Like a Monk from. thinklikeamonkbook.com.

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