Sarah McLachlan | Good Hang with Amy Poehler

Hello everyone. Welcome to another. episode of Good Hang. Very excited about. our guest today. It is the one, the only. Sarah McLaclin. I mean, so many hits, such an incredible singer, started. Lilith Fair, created a music school. I. mean, she's just awesome and talented. and nice and funny. And Sarah and I are. going to talk about a lot of things. We're going to talk about growing up in. Canada and whether those lakes ever get. warm. And the answer is no. We're going.

to talk about Lilith Fair, what it took. to start it and make it and keep it. going. We're going to talk about her new. music, making music with her daughters. and being a woman in the world today. So. many good things. Also, I should let you. know at one point I have a coughing fit. and it is really embarrassing and Sarah. is so cool about it cuz of course she. is. She's the coolest. So, thank you. Sarah. Um, before we get started, we. always like to ask people that know our. guests to give us a question and talk. well behind their back. And we have a. great one today. Also just an incredible.

musical artist in her own right. Would. love to get in here in her in here to. talk about stuff. The one, the only, the. multi- Grammy award-winning Cheryl. Crowe. Everybody. Cheryl. [music]. This episode of Good Hang is presented. by Uber Eats. Big news. Aldi is now on. Uber Eats and you get 20% off your first. grocery order with code new Aldi26.

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>> oh my god, I can't believe I'm talking. to you. >> I can't tell you. I In fact, it's funny. Are we on? >> Yeah, we're on. >> Um, well, I'll just tell you. I texted. Adam Scott. I was driving home from. visiting my parents in Missouri. Three. and a half hour drive. And my mom's not. making memories anymore, so it's always. a hard drive back. And I listened to you. and Adam on the way back and I laughed. like for literally off and on the whole. way. It was the greatest gift ever. So. great. >> Oh, thank did you say you texted Adam?

>> I did. I texted him right like right. after that. >> Wait, are you guys friends? I didn't. know that. >> Well, actually, it's funny. We were. married in a past life. [laughter]. >> No, I met him. >> I met him on the Kansas City um The Big. Slick. Oh yeah, that fundraiser they do. every year. >> It's the funnest thing ever. Um, and I'm. from Missouri, so I kind of like edged. my way in there and I met him through. that and oh my god, he and Paul Rudd and. I mean it's just it's all your people.

but it's so much fun. >> Oh, Cheryl, that means a lot. I love. you. Where are we talking to you from? >> Um, I'm in Nashville. I'm in the uh. technically the sun room, but is pouring. here. I mean, it's literally Nashville. is like the rainforest now. Well, I. always I always associate you with. Austin, but you're out of Austin into. Nashville. >> Yeah, I moved actually kind of I moved. from Austin to Nashville. I got I was. engaged, got diagnosed with breast.

cancer, split up, moved to um Nashville. basically all in and had Lasix surgery. most importantly all in the in the. process of like three weeks. >> You know what? This just leads me to my. I don't it's not even a question. It's. just an observation. Just women are. amazing. I I mean I just I can't It's. just like everyone should be saying this. every day. The things you just listed. would take any man down. >> You just pick it up and keep on moving.

>> Well, I'm I've been, you know, we're. going to we're talking to Sarah McLaclin. today and I um I had the pleasure of. watching the Lilith affair doc and two. things. one, that whole experience to me. feels like a just a great version of. what we're talking about, which is. [sighs and gasps]. creativity for creativity's sake, like. watching artists kind of try to find the. fun part. >> Yes. >> But it also. uh reminded me of how cool you are,

Cheryl Crow. Like every single time you. come on stage, I'm like, "God, look at. Cheryl's outfit. Look at her hair.". Anyway, >> no, go on. I I have [laughter] time. No, I'm kidding. That is so nice. I I will tell you, um, that tour was not like anything I ever. experienced. And the whole thing came. about at such a strange, you know, La. Palooa was happening and every time like. I can remember calling my agent and. saying, I can can I get some women on a.

bill? Like, I'd love to tour with Amy. Man. And every time it would be like, yeah, people won't buy tickets to see. two women on on a bill, particularly. men. Men won't. And around that time, Sarah had this crazy idea and uh she. wound up calling me and I was just God, it's just a perfect time for it. All. that to say is that what we took out on. the stage was it was defiance, but it. was also like community. It was a little. bit of a gentle [ __ ] you.

>> to the norms. the fact that yeah, there. were quite a few um you know, there were. quite a few gay women in the audience, but there were as many families and as. many heterosexual couples and as many. men. I mean, it was totally everything. So, it defied what all the agents and. the promoters were saying, like, you're. just going to wind up with an audience. full of women and they're and they're. not going they're not the ones that buy. tickets. She really defied that in her beautiful.

um. gentile. um gypsy way and she brought everybody. along with it. It was it felt like we. were taking a party out on the stage and. hopefully people did feel like they were. included. >> Yeah. >> I had a brilliant conversation with. Brandy Carile about it and her being in. the audience as a young you know as a. young girl and wanting to do what we. were up there doing. Um and there's. there's such beautiful power in that. It. really was not like anything else that. I've ever been a part of. >> I always ask my um my guests a question.

from someone that knows them well. And. um is there a question you have uh for. Sarah that you think I should ask her? >> I mean, one of the things I always think. is interesting, well, two things. What. would she be doing if she wasn't doing. music? Because it's so much a part of. her. I mean, she has her own school and. um but I think about that. I was a. school teacher, so I'm always like, "Well, if it doesn't I still go I still. say this. If it doesn't work out, I'll. go back to teaching school.". >> If it doesn't work out, >> if it doesn't work out. Yeah.

>> Okay. So, I'll ask Sarah about that. That's a great question. Anything else? >> Um, yeah. This is something that I just. find interesting with people who wind up. making it. Ask Sarah if she just always. knew she was going to make it. Like, did. she just know she was going to be doing. what she's doing? because I don't think. I ever knew I was going to be doing this. until. um I was like maybe eight years in. >> Great question, Cheryl Crow. I love you. Thank you so much for doing this. >> I love you, too.

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Subaru Forester Hybrid and the Subaru. Cross Track Hybrid. Great cars. I have. them both. Love goes the extra mile. Visit subaru.com/hybrid. to learn more. >> Sarah McLaclin is here. I just had a. major coughing fit before we started. [laughter]. And it's good to get it out beforehand. >> It made me think about what do you do. when you're singing and you have to. cough. >> Yeah, that's tricky. What do you do on? >> Well, you cough and you just, you know, it's one of those the show has to go on,

but you're like, I'm just going to need. a moment and pack and take, you know, and take a drink and go, >> you know, can't blame that one on. menopause. There's a whole lot I can, but not that one. Um, [laughter]. >> have you ever thrown up on stage? >> No. Almost. >> I have I have a fear of that. >> Almost. Oh, [ __ ] Yeah. I um I was doing. um the tree lighting at Rockefeller. doing a Christmas show [laughter] and. >> Oh yeah. And I had I was freshly. pregnant. >> Oh yeah. >> And was just heinously ill like just.

green 24/7 and I remember being you know. it's very public and you're doing this. you know that your your sound check and. everybody's watching and I'm just. looking in the corners. >> Okay there's a poinsetta over there. I'm. just like where's a quiet corner that I. can go hurl in front of everybody. [laughter]. Oh the glamour. There's so many things. to talk about today. I'm thrilled that. you're here. Like when we talk about the. guests that we want to have on the show. um and your name came up, we thought we.

were like that would be a dream. >> Well, thank you. >> And so let's start by going back because. you grew up in Canada. >> Yeah. >> And we we started this um interview with. me apologizing and saying sorry, sorry, sorry, which does sound very Canadian. [laughter]. >> I love a Canadian. They're the best. They're so nice. Are they as friendly as. people think they are? >> Generally speaking, yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Why do you think that is? >> Um, I don't know. We just We kind of. are. I mean, you know, there's [ __ ]. everywhere, but um.

>> generally I think we're we're polite for. one thing. I think by nature that sort. of like, you know, there's a certain. thing you uphold of just being civil and. >> Yeah. >> polite to everybody. I know there's a. there's a um. an attit a Canadian attitude that's. really lovely to be around which is. basically and I think I mean I think a. lot of it has to do with the weather. which is basically like you can either. choose to complain or you can get on.

with it. >> Yeah, it's true. There's certainly a. solid amount of you know suck it up. buttercup and and [laughter]. you just don't get anywhere by. complaining. No. Also, you know, Irish. parents is like don't go thinking. anything special. >> Oh, big time. That's very that's very. Boston, too. Like very Yeah. Like like. you can't like. >> just don't don't um don't kind of fall. in love with yourself, you know, and. we're here to drag you back. >> We're going to humble you every step of. the way if you do. So, you grew up in. Canada and you when did you realize, you.

know, you had this gift? >> You knew that music was going to be part. of your life forever. Do you remember. the feeling when you were young that you. knew. >> I think I'm good at this or I think I. really want to do this. What was it? >> Um, grade seven variety show. And I have. to preface this with saying I was really. bullied. I was terribly unpopular and. this was my opportunity for redemption. I'm going to, you know, I'm going to. prove myself to my community. And I got. up there and I sang u the Gambler by.

Kenny [clears throat] Rogers on acoustic. guitar. Is it you got to know when to. hold them know when to hold them know. when to come when to walk away know when. to run. >> Makes sense that a seventh grade girl. would, you [laughter] know, relate to. that. I don't know. I just loved Kenny. Rogers anyway. So I I got up there to. sing this song and I got about halfway. through it and the mic stopped working. >> Oh god. And so my my moment, you know, my my triumphant moment was uh you know, dashed because everybody said, "Oh, that.

wasn't really you singing." That the. tape player must have turned off. They. refused to acknowledge that it was me. singing. But I knew I felt good about it. and um I felt even better about it that. they refused to believe it was actually. me and they thought it was a recorded. version of something that obviously. sounded a little more professional. So. um yeah. Okay. So, you're in Canada. You're a young person who's realizing I. have something special. Who are you. listening to at the time? >> Uh, when I was really young, other than.

Kenny Rogers, it was um Simon Agaruncle, Cat Stevens. >> Yes. >> Uh, Joan Bayaz, Jonie Mitchell. >> Yeah. And then you learning how to play. how. >> Uh, when I was four, I wanted to be John. Bayz. So, my mom got me ukulele and I. started taking lessons. I lived in a. little subdivision. So up the street. there was a little old lady who taught. ukulele. And so I walked up there every. week and took lessons. And then when we. moved into the city when I was seven, I. started with the Royal Conservatory of. Music, which was kind of classical music. was at the time kind of the only.

legitimate thing way to learn an. instrument. So I took classical guitar. for um 12 years. >> Wow. >> Took classical piano for six years. I. took voice for four years. Um, and you. know, it was a fantastic foundation to. learn how to play the instrument, but it. was never really my jam. >> Okay. So, then you're listening to all. these incredible singer songwriters, and. you decide you want to be a singer. songwriter, and you get a record deal at. 19. >> Yeah. >> How did that happen? So, the very first. band that I was in when I was 17, the.

October game, we played a gig um at the. Delhaus University sub ballroom, and we. opened up for a band called Move. And. they were on a small independent label. in Vancouver, and the guitar. [clears throat] player, singer of the. band heard me sing, and was like, "We. want you to come out to Vancouver and. join our band." And I'm like, "Cool, cool. >> I'm 17. [laughter] That sounds great.". So, I ran home to my mom and dad who, you know, promptly said, "Are you effing. crazy? Not a chance. you going to finish. high school and um so I was still.

listening to them at that time smartly. So I I I squeaked by high school and. then started going to the art college. >> there and um I was working at a place. called Club Flamingo and Terry McBride. the president of the label came with. their band Skinny Puppy which was this. industrial. skinny puppy. >> Yeah. Blood and guts and mud and gore. Yeah. Um. >> anyway. >> very different than your music skinny. Yeah. A little bit different. [laughter]. So, um, he came and I remember so.

clearly I was playing Quicksilver, my. favorite pinball game, and I was working. on my high score, and he's like, "Hey, I. want to I want to talk to you." I'm. like, "Yeah, yeah, give me a minute.". [laughter] So, waited till I finished. And he took me out to his plush Blue. Velvet tour bus and uh sat me down at. the kitchen table and put a contract in. for me, said, "We want to offer you a. five record deal.". >> Whoa. >> And I was like, "Yeah, yeah, sure. What. do you like? What do you really want? How does anybody know I'm here?" Yeah. There's [laughter] too much plush in. here. Yeah. Um but no, he was serious. and um originally they wanted me to come.

out to Vancouver and work with a bunch. of other network bands. Then when I got. out there, they're like, "All these. other network bands hadn't been asked.". And like, "We're not going to work with. this punk kid. She's got no track. record. She hasn't written anything.". Nah, never mind. Wow. >> But I was already there. So at that. point, they were like, "Well, let's just. see what you come up with." And so I. just kind of started writing. Wow. To. the best of my [clears throat] ability. I mean, obviously I had, as I said, a. great foundation of understanding music. and theory. I had done deep dives into.

my favorite artists, which at the time. were Peter Gabriel and Kate Bush. >> Um, oh yeah, just. give up. >> Sorry. No, it's good. [laughter] It's. good. I hear you. I feel you. Um, so I just, you know, I I just kind of. fake it till you make it. I I just made. my first record in about a year and um. started touring and toured and toured. and toured and then, you know, just kind. of went from there. >> That's the thing that I think sometimes. we kind of like, you know, we're kind of. tough on ourselves and we look back and.

and look at our naive about things and. think like, oh, we didn't know what we. were doing. But there's such a freedom. when you're young about kind of not. knowing what's around the corner. Sometimes it's better to not. >> Ignorance is bliss. >> Yes. Sometimes that's true. If you knew. how important your decisions were that. if you did went left rather than right. it would change your whole life. You'd. never take a step. >> You'd work in you'd be living in fear, constant fear and constant uncertainty. So you're right. Just that that sort of. you know dumb and green.

>> Yeah. >> And totally just like the world is kind. of your oyster and and all these. possibilities feel endless. >> Do you remember your first time you ever. heard anything that you'd ever written. on the radio? >> Yeah. >> Where were you? I was in a taxi cab with. my first publicist Tony on our way to. Toronto to do our very first promotional. tour for the record and Vox came on the. radio and the two of us looked at each. other and just started screaming and the. you did not know it was going to be on. >> taxi driver was like what the hell's. [laughter] going on and said that's me. that's me on the radio and he's like.

sure no we we got out and we pulled out. the you know the albums that we were. bringing with us to sign for the record. or for the radio station and he's like. can I have a picture with you that's. Yeah. Suddenly he wants a picture. >> Yeah. But it was like it just felt like. like validation. >> Oh yeah. >> Oh my god. How is it that this is. already happening? It all felt so. surreal up until that moment. And. >> I mean honestly there were still many. many surreal moments after that. >> Well, you've had so many hits like. throughout your career. I mean we were I. was listening to your music all morning.

and your new record which is great. And. um I it it's so hard to like you're I. imagine. >> I I imagine that songs h you know just. like any piece of art they just kind of. have a life of their own. They take all. these journeys. They. >> they bloom. They come back. They mean. something different the next time. around. Some of them you think oh these. are going to be the ones that are going. to really go and they don't. Or others. that you think like this is the one. that's like the one that everyone's. always singing back to me that you have. so many hits and so many songs.

What like do they does that does does. songs feel that way to you? Your songs. that they have their own life and. journey that like out of your control? >> Absolutely. I mean music is art is so. subjective, right? It's like you see. something, you hear something, you read. something and it resonates with you or. it doesn't and it you then. >> impart you you put your own story into. it and then that that's where you draw. inspiration from. That's where that's. how it affects you.

and say, "Oh my god, you know, this song. you wrote in this way. I brought it with. me on my trip and you know, like I've. met so many people who went through high. school with my music or went through. university." So, you know, really. pivotal times and huge changes in their. worlds, losing a parent, >> losing a child, like. >> Yeah. So. all these stories um about what it means. to other people are beautiful and and. cool to know that there's something I've.

created has made some kind of impact in. someone's life and been there with them. on, you know, a beautiful journey, a. tough journey and somehow helped them in. some way. >> I mean, you've been like a serino for so. many people because they. >> they've used your music to tell someone. how they feel about them, you know? I. mean, we came up in the era of like. mixtapz and putting music together. It. was such a big deal to, >> you know, hand someone over a bunch of. music that you picked for them. And it. was always, >> here's my playlist. >> Yeah, exactly. This it was basically. [laughter] like this is how I feel about.

you. It was like, it was like, I can't. tell you, but I'm going to have you. listen. And there was always like coded. language and what we put together for. people. And so many of your songs and. your music did that for people. they. allowed people to kind of, you know, feel through you, you know, and is there. is there I mean, you're there's so many. hits. >> Is there a song that like became bigger. than like is it that still kind of is. like surprising to you that it like it. had the kind of journey it had?

>> I Well, I suppose that would be Angel. >> Yeah. >> Um, and that was one of those very It. very seldom happens as a songwriter that. something happens quickly and easily for. me. It's like music is flowing all the. time, but lyrics are really hard work. >> It's like extracting blood from a stone. often for me. And I'm super add so. trying to, you know, it's like give me. any distra distraction when I'm trying. to do something that is hard and. challenging in the sense of, you know, trying to focus. >> Um, but Angel felt like I was just a. vessel and it just came through me in.

like two days and it was done. And I. remember thinking at the end of uh when. I first put out surfacing like the rest. of this album's crap, but Angel's. angel's solid. I mean, obviously I had. no perspective. I mean, now now in. hindsight, >> you know, there was actually some good. songs on there, but. >> yeah, [laughter] a few a few. >> But that is, you know, that's that's. that mindset when you've just worked and. worked and worked at something and you. don't have any perspective. Yeah, >> but Angel has had. >> um you know such a life of its own and.

has done you know so many things as I. said talking about how it's helped. people through you know individual tough. situations so many stories of my I've. played this my mother played this when. she was passing and really helped us. >> um you know the SPCA obviously you know. >> well you raised $30 million. >> well that was within the first year I. think so who knows what has happened. since. >> do people assume that you um like Do. people assume you've you're constantly. fostering and adopting animals? [laughter].

>> Oh, yeah. >> Because you must get that productive not. believe [laughter] the and also just, you know, like the, you know, 10 or 20. letters a week about, you know, people. sending me, you know, all their rescues. and or I'm doing this charity, I'm. working with this, can you help? And um. yeah, you know, and it it it took on. such a life of its own. I I remember I. was doing a a food bank charity gig in. New York eight years later and they. said, "Can you please not play Angel. because it's so synonymous with this. other charity? There's going to be some.

brand confusion." I'm like, "Fuck that. Are you serious?". >> Is it true that I will remember you was. a b-side like that that that song was on. a like in a film? >> Yeah, it was uh um Brothers of McMullen. It was Ed Burn's directorial debut. >> That's right. And it just that that's. like one of the many monster hits. >> Yeah. How many how many how many how. many number one like how many hits have. you had [laughter]. >> you're asking the wrong people. I. suppose I should know this too. >> We're going to look Hold on. We're going. to look it up. I'm going to laugh. You. know what I want to do? I want to brag.

about. >> any number one hits. >> I'm so sick of it. You know, we're. always like, "Oh, I don't even know.". And we should know. >> No, this is this is embarrassing that I. don't know either of them. >> No, it's it's totally normal. And. actually, it's it's why you're such a. you're you're a normal person who. doesn't look at their hits. But I'm. going to look at your hits right now. Okay. I'm going to read them right now. Okay. >> Sarah, can you handle this? This is very. American. >> Not very Canadian. Well, I just wrote. Sarah Mlaughlin hits. >> You consulting the oracle?

>> Okay. [laughter]. Building a mystery. Sweet surrender. Possession. Better broken ice cream. Oh. yeah. >> Angel. Vox. We talked about Fox, heard. it on the radio. Into the fire, elsewhere, fallen, fumbling toward. ecstasy, Adia, possession, sweet. surrender, building. Everybody listening. right now is having this moment of like. h. cuz [laughter] remember I mean monster. hit Sarah. >> Hitmaker.

>> Thanks. Sorry, [laughter] I'm just going. to brag for you. Okay, so then you leave. Canada. You're in a band. Uh, sorry. You're you're you're making music. Are. you in a band at that point? No, you're. just kind of making music under your. You're you're it's never Sarah. McGloaclin and the. >> You mean when I got signed? >> Yeah. Yeah. No, they that that was the. other tricky bit of that when they came. and offered me that deal. My band that I. we hadn't been together about a year cuz. they had gone off to school, so we'd. kind of split up, but still they were. all they knew about it and they were. like, "What did you say?" And I'm like, "Oh." You were like, "Well, I had this. beautiful this sort of excited moment.

and I was like, "I think they just want. me." [laughter]. Yeah. Yeah. That's always. [clears throat]. >> So that was a bit of a tough a tough. moment, too. But um. >> now you're you start to tour. And when. how old are you when you asked Paula. Cole to open for you? >> 21. >> Maybe 22. Yeah. >> And And why did you ask Paula? >> Cuz I loved her. >> Yeah. [laughter]. >> I loved her music. And. >> how did you find out of her music? >> Um I think just radio. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. I was, you know, listening and.

watching what, you know, what else was. going on out there and discovered her. I. was like, "Oh my god, what an incredible. voice." She's so powerful and I love her. lyrics and love the melodies and h. wonder when she'd want to come sing. >> Well, what I love about the Lilith Fair. do, which is on Hulu, is that it it. talks about the kind of slow process of. realizing there's a way to work. Like. there's a way to choose how to work. It's very relatable, I think, for a lot. of women who, if they're lucky enough, get an opportunity to figure out, is.

there a way I like to work that I could. figure out? Like, it's that that's the. dream. >> Yeah. >> Um, and you asked Paula to join as an. opening act and you two realize this is. fun. This is actually fun. >> Yeah. Well, it's a back then, I mean, I. was all my crew were men. My band were. men. I had a female backup singer, but, you know, it was just us and the sea of. men who I adored and love. They were my.

crew and they're a wonderful bunch of. people, but um I just, you know, having. Paula there was just this breath of. fresh air for me and this awareness of. like, you know, we we we kind of need. each other. This is a weird industry. It's isolating. we make music alone and. you know um she's just really nice to. have her around. >> Really it was great to connect with her. Oh my god, we just saw her at the a. TIFF. She showed up. I didn't even know. she was coming and we both burst into. tears. [laughter] I was like, "Oh my. god.". >> Oh, that's so nice. I mean I mean it's.

it's wild to me, but there are people. that don't really understand what what. Lilith Fair was. And for people who. don't um they they should watch this doc. certainly. But in a nutshell, um, how. how do you describe it to people who are. who have never heard of it or didn't get. a chance to go see it? >> Um, it was a celebration of much of the. great music that was being made by women. in the late '9s. Um, and it was uh, >> yeah, it was basically that. And that.

was the simple origin story. And then we. were told we couldn't do it because you. shouldn't put more than two women on a. stage together. You certainly can't play. two women back to back on radio. And I. had felt that. I had seen that and. witnessed it time and time again. And I. just never understood or liked the. competitive nature of it. Yeah. You. know, I didn't think music should be put. into those kind of pigeon holes. >> I didn't think we as artists should be. Um I certainly didn't notice it. happening with men and that pissed me. off as well. So, uh, though it didn't.

start out as a political statement, it. be kind of, you know, it be kind of came. became that when I was told, "You can't. do that." I'm like, "Oh, >> oh, yeah, that doesn't work for me. No, you just, it just put a fire under me to. to prove them wrong.". >> Because they people were saying, "There's just no way anyone's going to. pay this money to see all these women. performing." Like, there's just. >> Yeah. How insulting. We proved our point. in 1996. Yeah. And then went, "Oh my. gosh, this was so amazing and so fun. let's do a full tour next summer. And. that was the point at which it was like,

oh yeah, no, you can't do that. >> So funny. >> Really? Really? And and and it was. still, you just can't do it because we. won't sell tickets. >> Yeah. No. Promoters would not take any. risk. They were like, you can't do that. You can't. I said, well, we just did and. we just sold out 15,000 people. And they. were like, well, that's a that's a. one-off. That's an anomaly. >> They're like, this isn't going to last. >> It's not going to last. It was, you. know, oh, that was just a little blip, >> a little fatter, a little trend. And. then I'm like, "No, no, no. We can do. this." And again, that back to that. naivity of just Yeah. You know, going,

"What are you talking about? No, we're. going to do this.". >> Right. >> Um, and you know, we took for the most. There's like no guarantees that we took. all the risk. >> Um, >> by taking the risk, did you make more. money because you took the risk? >> Uh, [laughter] yes. >> You know what I mean? Like that's good. I mean, it's like you had some control. >> We had some control. We had a ton of. control. Yeah. And we got, you know, we. raised over $7 million for local and. national charities over the three years. as well, which was amazing. >> People don't, you know, again, I can't I.

can't stress enough to watch the dock. Um, but. >> on top of everything else you were. doing, I think what was so incredible. about Lilith Lilith Fair is it really. did feel like a fair. It was there were. people walking around. There were boos. everywhere. There was fundraising. constantly. There was backstage everyone. was hanging out. All the women were. bringing their kids on tour. I it was. like it's like a it was like a utopian. version of what it would look like. >> if women were in charge of most of the. systems of how to work. And it looked. and still looks like this ideal way in.

which to be part of a community and. still feel like you're an individual. with you know you had a lot of artists. who were very very different on that. door. >> Yeah. >> And yet they still all wanted to hang. out with each other. They took care of. each other. you you know you you paid. you know you gave health insurance to. crew who often never had it on tour like. >> Yeah. And they never had it before. That's kind of unheard of in the. industry. Yeah. I mean, listen, it was. um it was just an extension of the way I. live my life and again looking at what.

it is as how it is as an artist, as a. band member, a crew member coming into. someone else's environment like how how. would I want to be treated? How would I. want to be made to feel? I want to feel. respected and um taken care of. And that. was just the MO. It's like we're going. to take care of everybody. We're going. to make sure everybody feels good, respected. This is a this is a safe. space. This is fun. You're all going to. get fed really well. I mean, I'll never. forget, you know, crew came in first day.

of new new artists and they're always. super grumpy. I mean, you know, I've had. that experience going into a festival, you know, where it's like, are we even. going to get a sound check? Are we going. to get fed? It's going to be a long day. >> By the end of the day, everybody's. happy. Everybody's smiling. They're. like, "Okay, this is this is going to be. great." And that is the environment that. I wanted to create for everybody there. It's like this is an extension of me, of. my of my hospitality, of my ethos. >> Yes. >> You know, this is how you want to work. >> Be respectful. Treat treat everybody the.

way you want to be treated yourself. Just, you know, like live and let live. Let people be and let's just. >> I know sounds very woowoo and utopian. I'm still like that though. I mean, I. just. >> cute, man. It's like [laughter] I mean. why. >> why can't we all just get along? Why. does it why do we have to keep and also. why do we have to say these kind of. things and then apologize for like how. earnest and like because like you. >> it's hopeful we need to stay hopeful. it's like you know that was the thing. about the doc is that what I felt was.

>> you know you didn't no one can get. anything exactly right right so what was. really wonderful about what I felt like. you were doing was constantly pivoting. taking feedback and adjusting like there. was a lot of adjustments you made. What were some of the things that you. you know when you were making that fair. in it second or third year you realized. oh we have to adjust here? >> Yeah I mean we the the big adjustment. was very early on which was like you. know white chick folk fest and I mean I. I knew that was coming and I was I. agreed with that. I you know and I was.

frustrated by it because we asked. everybody we asked all these different. artists from all different genres of. music. Um, but you know to to be fair, their management teams would look at the. lineup so far and go, I'm not sure where. the place is for my artists in this. And. you know, in my head, my naive head, I'm. like, >> I listen to all different kinds of. music. I know that most of my friends. who are fans of music, they don't listen. to just one genre. They, it just depends. on their mood. They have. So why are we.

being so um you know uh minimizing of. the you know and and sort of looking at. our fans and going oh they they can't. handle this. Of course they can handle. it. They they want it. They're hungry. for it. And so to create that. opportunity that you know for all of us. to showcase our unique talents. It just. again it just it felt like the most. natural thing in the world. >> Yeah. But it was but it was a struggle. to get those get a lot of you know black. and brown artists. for sure. Like I.

don't know where my place is. >> And they want to see how it does and. they want to see. >> So the success of the first year then. allowed us way more latitude and way. more freedom to go hey you know you know. go back and push and say look this is a. really great opportunity for your. artists to expand their fan base. >> Yeah. >> Um and you know we in the second year we. also um we realized there was an. opportunity again to how do you expand. your um fingerprint in a community after. you leave? not only giving a dollar. every ticket sale to a local women's.

shelter, but having a stage for local. artists in every market, you know, so. just creating those opportunities, tons. of tableabling of various local. organizations, um, you know, women's. organizations, local and national, like just raising. awareness, creating this space where. there's open dialogue about all these. things. >> Yeah.

and the women that came through that. festival. I mean, pretty diverse and. dynamic. >> So, can we talk about them just for a. second? Like, okay, so we've got. >> we've got. >> Paula, we've got Shawn. Incredible. We've got um. >> Cheryl Crow. >> Yeah. Erica Badu, Michelle and Deoello. Uh, Queen Latifah, >> Missy Elliot. >> Missy Elliot. First time ever on tour. >> I know [gasps] that was a coup. We were. >> How did you get Missy? >> Um, well, you'd have to ask Marty that.

I mean, he was [laughter]. >> Yeah, that was above my pay grade. But, um, somehow he got Missy and uh, that. was that was awesome. I mean that. footage of her coming out on stage like. >> in the. >> in the giant when she was when she wore. that big when she the big garbage bag. stuff with like all the inflatable stuff. in that style. So she's incredible. >> and and such an incredible. >> and you saw the entire audience. instantly stood up and was like, "Oh, okay. Wow. What is this? This is so much. fun.".

>> What about you had the Indigo Girls. join? >> The Indigo Girls were such a an amazing. anchor for me. um they came on early on. and kind of got everybody, you know, feeling comfortable about singing. together. Like I was still a good. Canadian. Like I was I was afraid to. ask. I really wanted to sing with. everybody, but I didn't quite know how. to do it. And it's funny watching the. doc how Juel was so, you know, said it. exactly the same way. It's like I didn't. know I was allowed to do that. Um. they're like, "Oh no, why don't why. don't why is everybody singing. together?" I'm like, "Oh, we can do.

that." She's like, "Yeah, let's go just. go do it." Um, and they so they just. opened up this huge opportunity for all. of us to really feel a whole different. kind of connection and that's when. things really took off. >> And I also love what they say in the doc. the Indigo girls are basically like you. need some like openly gay girls here to. to teach you how to party. >> Um, [laughter]. you had Pat Benitar. >> Yes. >> Amy Lou Harris. >> Emmy Lou Harris. >> Bonnie Raid. >> Chenedo Connor. >> Yeah. >> I mean.

>> that was the part in the documentary. I. mean, I've seen so many iterations of. this over the edits, but I cry every. time. >> Tell me why. >> Well, because she's gone and she was. >> such a gift. And. >> what was she like? >> She was really shy at the beginning, but. wow, did she open up. She was a little. [ __ ] as well. Like she was super. playful, like a jokester, prankster. Um, we had so much fun together. And then to. get to sing with her, you know, it's. like being in the presence of, you know,

a goddess basically. Uh when she opens. up her mouth and starts to sing, it's. just it's otherworldly. >> Yeah. >> And I I got to be part of that and I got. to sing with her a number of nights. And. uh. >> yeah, that was pretty magical. And then. just, you know, getting to watch that. like all these moments that were so. powerful and important to me and and and. watching myself grow up on screen like. not a lot of humans get to have a gift. like that given to them where it's like. this is. >> such a powerful and important time in my.

life um that has been. >> so succinctly and beautifully captured. >> Yeah. Um, so yeah, watching watching. that it's just she's she's gone now and. I know. >> it's so sad. >> So sad. Such an incredible talent. >> Yeah. And she was, you know, she she. suffered even back then like she just. she was really misunderstood and. >> Yeah. >> You know. Yeah. It's tough. >> Tracy Chapman, another beautiful artist. who I love in the documentary. You talk. about how she was the one everyone one.

of many people that everyone came out. and watched. >> Yeah. Oh, every night. I mean, she's. just talk about grace. >> Yeah. >> Just this quiet, graceful presence. She. was very shy, too. >> Yeah. >> Um it was kind of hard to draw her out. >> So funny that people who are performing, you know, it's it's thing we learn over. and over again, obviously, but we're. reminded that people who are performers. are not necessarily extrovert. >> She's such an introvert. Yeah. Um. >> who's the most introverted? I Who's the. most introverted on that tour and who is.

the most extroverted? Uh Tracy is. probably the most introverted and. extroverted. Um. maybe Cheryl. Um I mean me, I was, you. know, I was pretty extrovert actually. Okay. I mean Amy and Emily for sure. Yeah. >> Cuz they were just loud, you know. They. were loud and proud of let's have fun. Um so they brought that really like they. said this really sort of geeky fan. energy. Um, >> and you had like you talked about Emmy. Lou Harris, um, uh, Bonnie Ray, Chrissy.

Hind, >> and and. >> I don't know if you feel this way, but I. know I do because in, you know, I've. have I grew up in a generation where I. feel like women my age right now are. working together all the time and. feeling really good about that and. loving that experience. And when you. meet someone who's maybe 10 years older. than you, they just haven't had that. experience very much. I've been on many. sets where women um in their mid60s have. said, "Oh, I've I've never, you know, been on a set with this many women, you.

know.". >> Yeah. I mean, they grew up at a time. where we, you know, in whatever industry. we were in, we were being offered a tiny. sliver of the pie and we were in. competition with each other in every. element, like it or not. And think about. what they what they came up against as. they were coming up in the world that. was even, you know, I would argue more. toxic and more marginalizing towards. women. >> Yeah. >> And, you know, you just kind of had to. deal with those were the social norms. then. >> Yeah.

>> Um, you know, you you walk into a radio. station and get your ass grabbed. >> [ __ ] hell. >> Or or just knowing that that may happen. or just the comments, you know, like and. >> it. out. >> Yeah. Well, because it was normalized. >> Totally. >> And you just you suck it up and you keep. going because well, if you make a stink. about it, then you're you're pushed out. even further into the merchants. >> Yeah. And you're hanging out in a room. full of boys. >> Yeah. >> And if you want to be in that room, >> you kind of need to tow the line. It was. the same thing. I was, you know,

thinking about that. Um, like Anne. Powers is in the documentary. Love. Powers. >> Yeah. You know, I didn't like Anne. Powers back then because she ripped the. [ __ ] out of us. And I'm like, are you. kidding me? >> And she kind of claims it, right? She's. like, "I didn't get it." She's like, "I. saw it.". >> She couldn't have though because she was. in a room full of guys and she was a. single woman female critic. Like, I. forgive her because I understand now. I. didn't at the time. I'm like, "How could. you be doing this?" But the room that. she was in was her male counterparts. And if she, you know, spoke.

appreciatively or in reverence to what. we were doing, she would have been. ostracized. >> Yeah. We all suffered. We all suffered. in our 20s in the '9s with deep. internalized misogyny that we didn't. even know we had in an attempt to. assimilate. We were like, I want to be. in the room. I want to figure out how to. work the system and I'm going to without. even knowing, I'm going to buy into a. system that I don't believe in and. that's actually hurting me. >> Yeah. And what I love about Anne Powers,

who's a journalist in the film, who kind. of owns up to the fact that she wrote. about, you know, wrote about how she. didn't wasn't getting Lilith Fair and it. wasn't for her. She realizes like much. later on that she was grappling with her. own like sense of trying to fit in. >> Yeah. >> I mean, Lilith Fair got teased like. ridiculed. >> Did you care about that at the time? How. did you. feel? Um, it was it was hurtful. It was.

annoying. But I just kept going back to. the fact that well, you obviously haven't come. >> Yes. >> And seen it and felt it because if you. had, you'd think differently. So, I just. was like, well, you can have your. opinion, but I'm having the time of my. life. >> No kidding. And I don't want to. >> You're missing out. Sorry. [laughter]. >> Yeah. It's Yes, that's right. And I. loved how you guys did press conferences. in every city that you went to. That was. so painful. Did you ever think about not. doing them? >> No, because there were there was a there.

were two elements to that. There was one. to, you know, the press wanted access. We understood that that was part of the. beast that you have to feed. >> Um, and the the beautiful thing is at. the end of the press conference, we got. to give attention to a local woman's. shelter. >> Yeah. you know, to sort of raise. awareness for the issues that they were. dealing with and to show that we were. and not to be self- congratulatory, but. to show that we were giving money to. this and to raise awareness for it. Um, and I tell you the it felt so good to.

have that cherry at the end of this, you. know, typically annoying and demeaning. and. >> uh dumb press conference where I just. got besieged every day with, you know, why why do you hate men? Why aren't you. doing this? Why aren't you doing that? You're too much of this. You're not. enough of that. Very typical. Don't be. too pretty. Don't be too loud. Oh, you're too, you know, you're too quiet. Like, >> you can't win. And that was that thing. that I. >> hadn't experienced until I was, you.

know, >> in in this this quiet radical movement. that we were [laughter]. >> Yeah. >> that we were doing of just, you know, just basically being ourselves and. celebrating each other and celebrating. the success that we were all having and. appreciating that and lifting each other. up. again like why is that so radical? Why is that so threatening? >> It was it was kind of shocking. Yeah. >> Um so yeah the press conferences were. painful but they were also um an. important thing to do. >> I mean you handled those conferences. from what I saw really really well for. the most part. Yeah.

>> You really did. Was it hard sometimes to. be running the festival [clears throat]. while you were in it? Because everybody. else kind of gets to come in and like. have a good time. >> I wasn't running [laughter] it. >> Uh Dan Fraser was running it. I mean he. had a hell of a job. kind of the, you. know, you're the, >> you know, to your point, you're. >> I'm the face of it for sure. >> And you have to worry about stuff like, >> yeah, >> you know, it's like having the house. party, right? >> Yeah. There were a ton of day-to-day. decisions that had to be made. There. were a ton of fires that had to be put. out, someone didn't show up, someone.

slept with someone else or, you know, there was just and then and then they. were like someone was angry and hurt or. someone said something that hurt. someone's feelings and you had to deal. with like HR. >> Was there an HR? Great. [laughter] You. me you were. >> me and Dan. There was no freaking HR. We. were just like, "Okay, shit." Totally. You just managed. >> You put on a blazer and you were like, "Okay, let's talk.". >> You know, it's like it was kind of Julie. the cruise director, right? You know, saying hi to everybody, making sure. everybody felt good. Um, writing letters. to every new artist and, you know, it's. like a hund and some artists in one.

year, you know, so it's just this. constant flow of meeting new people and. making sure everybody was great. Yeah. >> Um and then yeah, putting out the fires. of the day or just being involved in all. these little decisions that you know we. kind of had to make on a daily basis. So. yeah, it was exhausting and. all-encompassing, but you know, again, the the gift at the end was like I I got. to watch all these artists. I got to. perform with all these artists. Okay. So. we do this thing on the um on the pod. where we ask people who know our guests. to speak well behind their back um and.

to give me a question to ask them. So, we talked to Cheryl Crow this morning. >> Oh my gosh. >> I know. And it was so fun and so fun to. talk to her about those times and you. guys performing together and you know, I. was saying to her, you know, it was just it's so it was. just it will never get old watching you. all be each other's fans. You know, like. >> you're you're an artist and you're also. a fan. And she's such an incredible. talent. And she wanted me to ask you two. questions which I thought were really.

interesting questions to ask. They're. kind of opposite but also feel like. they're in the same world. One is if you. were not making music, did you ever. think of what else you would do? >> Um, ever so briefly because I don't know. what else I would do. Um, and. um either a hairdresser. >> Oo. >> Or um a jewelry designer. >> Oo. >> Which honestly I still kind of do. You. >> design jewelry. >> Yeah. Just really simple stuff. Like I. made last two Christmases ago, I made.

like 30 necklaces for all my friends and. I'm crafty. >> You're a crafter. >> Um, you know, I need something to do. with my hands or they're in my mouth. >> Yeah. >> It's not healthy. >> I love that. Okay. And and and that. makes sense hairdresser, too, because. you like touching people's hair. >> Yeah. I was a dance mom for years, so I. got to do all these, you know, >> for your daughters. Yeah. >> And are you good at a blow do a good. blowout? >> Um, I'm I do a pretty good blowout. Yeah. Do you like I like the French. braids and the. >> Oh, you can do the intricate stuff. Well. done. Yeah. >> Okay. And then so that was one question. And then the other question was, did you.

have a sense um did you know deep down, you know, people ask this question from. a lot of artists, but was there some. part of you that knew that you were. going to make it, that you were going to. be famous with Cheryl's question, but. like was there a part of you that sense. that or knew that? >> No. No. I can honestly say no. And mostly. because I didn't even know what that. meant. Yeah. >> I did not know what that looked like. I. did not come from a culture of celebrity. of looking at famous people and and you.

know hoping to achieve that. >> Yeah. >> My thing was I want to do something that. makes me feel good. >> Yeah. >> It was so naive and so simple but it's. pure. >> and and pure. >> Yeah. And I just, you know, again this. sort of blissful. um time in the world where we could kind. of just figure it out figure out as we. go. >> Yeah. Um and we were there were so many. more opportunities uh to just you know. to fumble around and try and figure it. out. Like I just feel like even both my.

daughters there was just so much. pressure to decide you know what. university to go to and you kind of have. to make a decision about the whole. trajectory of your life. I'm like oh my. god half my friends in my 50s still. don't have a clue what they're doing. You know, I just got really really lucky. >> that I had this, >> you know, this path that I kind of got. off I got offered the golden ticket at. 19 and it's like, well, this will be. fun. >> I'll go do this. And my dad said, listen, if this doesn't work out, our. college is still it's always going to be. there,

>> but this will not. You got to try it. And of course, I wanted to, but yeah, I. didn't. It's funny in my yearbook, someone wrote. Destined to Become a Famous Rockstar, which is hilarious. And I'm just like, haha. Yeah, but we didn't know what that. even looked like. I know. I know. [laughter]. >> That's very woo woo. >> I know. >> Destined to become a famous rock star. >> Yeah. >> Somebody knew. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> So, I guess it's combo see, you know,

other people can see things that you. can't see too often, right? >> And you talk about your daughters, too, and I love the beautiful aspect that. your daughter sings on this record with. you. Yeah, that was a great full circle. moment for me. >> How why? >> Um well because they you know they. they're they both have beautiful voices. They won't sing around me and I guess. because you know I I sing and that's. often the case with kids. They kind of. try and go the opposite but we cannot. deny they both have beautiful voices. Um. but the song in particular one in a long.

line. is the last song I wrote and I. think it was this, you know, looking at. what's going on in the world and the. erosion of women's rights, not only here. but all over the world and. thinking about what do I need to say? I. I I feel like now is not the time to be. silent or complacent. Like I I've. always, you know, tread that line. carefully and not been political, but. I'm like I I have to say something about. this. I'm just I'm so frustrated and. angry and scared and I have two. daughters and they're they're going into. the world and you know we we need to.

speak loudly about the things that we. believe in even even though I was afraid. to. >> Um so and I've always used music as my. vehicle to for expression. Yeah. >> So um that song. >> to have both my daughters sing on that. with me just felt really powerful. Yeah, >> that's so cool. And what was it like. being in the studio with each other? The. stewed. >> Well, we actually weren't. It was in my. daughter's phone in my daughter's. bedroom on my iPhone because.

>> Perfect. >> Yeah, it was kind of at the I wrote that. song right at the end of the record and. um you know, Will was actually mixing. the rest of the record and trying to. trying to organize my kids. You know, there was a bit of convincing to get him. to do it in the first place. I'll do it. next week, Mom. And I'm like like okay. [laughter] like we're mixing the record. Will needs these tracks now. So we just. actually sat in the bedroom with my. eldest and she sang it. She just put. headphones on and iPhones are amazing. for that now. Um and then Taja, my. little one, went down into the studio.

She wouldn't let me near her when she. did it. >> Yeah. I was wondering if they would let. you watch. >> No. Yeah. >> But my 23-year-old, you know, just. earnest full voice sang right in front. of me. So uninhibited. It was so. beautiful. voting on this is deeply more. powerful because of the challenges and. the struggles that we've been through. for so many years as mother and. firstborn daughter. >> Yeah. >> Cuz it was tough. >> What what what what did you what have. you been learning about being the mother. of a daughter of daughters? Like but. what was what was tough about it? >> You know, I mean there's there's so many. things I could say about that and I wish.

I wish I knew what I know now to be able. to go back, you know, without feeling. >> yourself knowing what you know now. Um, I would have been I would have been. softer on her in a different way. I was. a hard ass. >> And and it's funny because I thought so. clearly in my own mind that I was being. the antithesis of my mother. >> And I looked at the way she parented and. I thought, I'm going to do everything. completely different. And then her words. come spewing out of your mouth in a. moment of anger [laughter] and. frustration. You're like, oh my god, I.

can't believe I did that. Um, but I. just, you know, I she was undiagnosed. Um, we thought she had ADHD and, you. know, when things got hard, this wall. would go up and she'd just rage and be. so frustrated. And so, you know, I. looked at that and going, how do we how. do I help you with this? How do we move. past this because the world out there is. scary and big and you have to have some. grit and you have to do hard things so. that you know you can. So, I was tough. and what we didn't realize is that was. it was actually anxiety and all this.

came out. We did family systems. counseling and. >> peeling back all those layers of the. onion the way I was communicating to her. like was just making her feel shitty. about herself instead of building her up. which was completely the opposite of. what I thought I was doing. So, you. know, I had to eat a lot of humble pie. and take stock and go, okay, look, I. want a relationship with my kid. So, >> I need to learn how to communicate. differently with her. >> And in doing so, she also got to take. some responsibility for the way she was. reacting and recognizing that that's not.

where I was coming from anyway. So it. was a long process but it was beautiful. and powerful and we have such an open. loving relationship now because of that. Um. >> it's so great Sarah that you talk about. this. I just have to say because it's. the way that women help each other. constantly is to just like break free. from the narrative that we are getting. everything right as mothers. Like it's. it's it's a joke. >> It's such a joke [laughter] but but it's. really hard. It's it's it's kind of the. last. >> we all live in constant judgment. You. know, it's like, you know, you watch.

people look at you out of the corner of. the eye when you let your kid cry in the. grocery store floor. That's right. You. know, it's like, oh my god, corral that. kid. You're a bad parent because you're. doing this or you're doing that or not. doing this. It's like again, just. constant judgment. >> Constant judgment and pressure and the. most coming from within on ourselves. And anytime we share any version of that. out loud or just even in our friend. group, like you just feel this feeling. that everyone wants to say like. >> that's an exhale. You know, me too. I'm. feeling that too. What you know, like.

it's it's wild how we still do this to. ourselves over and over. I mean, we get. it done to us, of course, too, but we do. it to ourselves. There's an alarm. There's a siren right there coming to. pick us up cuz we're such bad moms. [laughter and gasps]. >> I mean, it's the same thing with. menopause, you know, like it just there. was no conversation about it. and just, you know, all the changes that we go. through. Um, and thank goodness, like I. I kind of love social media for that now. because there are so many platforms that. women are now talking about this and all. and and doctors are finally paying.

attention to the hundreds of thousands. of women who suffered and who went. through all sorts of [ __ ] and the. doctors just like, "Hey, you know, it's. just. >> it's just a thing. Just suck it up.". >> Yeah. It's like, "Is my frozen shoulder. because of menopause?" And doctors are. like, "We'll never know.". >> Yeah. And I'm like, no one's going to. put any money towards research on that, you know. >> Yeah. They're like, "Huh, maybe.". >> Oh, if men could bleed, [sighs] you. know, things would be very, very. different. [laughter]. >> That would be a good um heavy metal um. band name. If men could bleed, >> a double bill. If men could bleed and.

Skinny Puppy. >> That's perfect. >> Um Okay. I got a few um rapid fire for. you. >> Okay. Okay. First of all, how do how do. you what's your sleep routine? I love to. ask people this. Do you love to sleep? >> I love to sleep. >> Are you good at sleeping? I'm really. Yes, I'm good at sleeping now that I'm. on estrogen and progesterone. >> Totally [ __ ] when I went into menopause. Yeah. >> Yeah. And do you take any sleep? Um, do. you take anything to go to sleep? >> Nope. And what's your ritual to go to. sleep? >> Well, you know what? Red light therapy. has been my friend. I.

>> Hold on. Talk to me about it. >> I have I. >> I don't know about this. >> I have a massage table and I basically. have this like six foot long panel of. red light. Especially because you know. when I'm skate skiing three hours a day. as I was doing a lot like your body. needs your muscles need. >> you say for the first skate skiing. >> Yeah. You know like it's like like cross. country. >> So there's classic which is in the. grooves and skate is on the corduroy and. it's like you know bathlon four words. I. don't know. [laughter]. >> Grooves and corduroy. Are you on ice. skates? >> No. No. It's classic. It's like it's.

like cross country skiing. It's on these. little matchicks. >> Okay. And um you just you kind of. they're long like cross country skates. but instead of being in the two. >> you just said skates again. So you're on. skates or skis. >> They're skate skis. >> So what they are is a very narrow long. we don't have those here. >> You do. We do not. >> You do. I have been to Colorado I don't. know how [laughter] many years in a row. skate skiing. So you do um it's a big. thing. It's incredible. >> So it's so fun. I just I love I love. being outdoors. I love nature. I would.

be outside all the time if I could. It. just gets a little too cold. you know, to be able to be for 4 hours outside in. the snow in the mountains, like finding. frozen lakes and going out on like it's. magical. And the coolest part about. where I live is I can take my dogs. >> That's awesome. >> Yeah. So doing a lot of that anyway. So. fast. Yeah. So I exhaust myself if I can. climbing hills or you know jumping in. lakes, whatever. So um and then so. usually I spend like 15 minutes before I. go to bed just lying under this light. cuz it just calms.

system down. It's red light. Yeah, red. light therapy. >> Oo. >> Yeah, infrared. You heal faster. I'm I'm. serious. >> I get one of these red lights. >> So, I do that not every night, but most. nights. Um, you know, I don't really. have much of a ritual. I I try to stop. drinking water around 5:00 so I don't. have to get up in the middle of night. and pee. >> Oh, yeah. >> So, I frontload. Yeah. >> As best of my abilities. >> Um, [laughter]. but you know, I usually go to bed around. 9. >> Oh, that's what I'm talking about. >> That's kind of it. There's 9:00 p.m. That is a winner's That's a winner.

>> Honestly, 10 is probably a little more. realistic, but I try to go to bed at. 9:00, especially in in the winter. Um, and you know, there's nothing good that. happens after 10:00. >> Not much. Not especially when you have. to get up at 6:00. >> Shut it down. Go to bed at 9:00. Wake up. at 6:00. Feel like a hero. >> Give me 8 hours of solid sleep. I am. less. >> My dream is to eat dinner at 6:30 and. then. >> walk right into the bedroom and. [laughter]. >> early bird special. I try and eat around. 55 55 55 55 55 55 55 55 55 55 55 55 5:30. >> and then just.

>> start to shut her down. >> and shut her down. Okay, rapid fire. Here we go. Who do you predict is going. to be your Spotify wrapped this year? Like who are the musicians you're. listening to the most on your like if we. were. >> Phoebe Brides. H. >> Yeah. >> The best. >> Yeah. Or Boy Genius or you know. [clears throat] competition. >> who would definitely be would be on like. a current version of Lil Affair if there. existed one. In some ways Boy Genius is. the. >> Oh, you got Yeah. Three amazing. musicians, singer, songwriters, independently unique and beautiful, all.

choosing to come together to be a. powerhouse trio. >> Best Canadian city. [gasps]. >> I'm going to get in trouble. Vancouver. [sighs]. >> What's the best thing about being. Canadian and non-American? [laughter]. >> That is so baiting. >> Sorry. Don't worry about it. Forget it. Forget it. [laughter]. >> Forget it. Um, healthare. >> Yeah. Healthcare. Surfing or paddle. boarding? >> Surfing. >> So, you surf? Yeah, I've been surfing. since I was 30. >> And then um you were on SNL and Rudy.

Giuliani was the host. >> Oh my god, I remember that. Yeah. >> So it was Sarah McLaclin and Rudy. Giuliani in in 19 back again in 1997. >> Yeah. >> What do you remember about your. experience? Was that the only time you. were on SNL? >> I I feel maybe like I was on twice, but. I'm not sure. Honestly, I remember what. I remember is an Ganga and like you know. Based in Blood doing that. That was with. I don't know if that was really. >> Were you on Were you on the show when. Anna did the um Lilith? Uh.

>> not the Lilith one. No, but Based in. Blood, which was the Thanksgiving song. [laughter]. >> I I I got to participate in that. >> Wait, you were in that? >> I was in it. >> Yeah. >> Okay. This is really interesting. Anna. used to play a character on SNL called. Cinderell who was a very earnest. >> um you know kind of like songwriter. >> progressive singer songwriter and. >> she sang a song called Based in Blood. Let's watch it. >> Anna is such a good singer. [singing].

million [singing]. words. >> Oh my god, this is so good. I remember. this. Oh my god, this is so good. Well, I'm so grateful that you came here. You. are always ahead of your time and I. can't wait to see what you do next and. congrats on all the good things that are. happening now and it means a lot that. you came by. So, thank you so much. >> Happy to be here. >> Wow. Thank you so much, Sarah.

McGlaughlin. you are so cool and. interesting and and so fun to talk to. and uh it really took me down memory. lane there and you know for this Polar. Plunge I just wanted to remind everybody. how badass Pat Benitar is. That's all. just how amazing her voice is and how. great of an artist she is and like Sarah. has just always been this, you know, woman kind of making music on her own.

terms. And um she was I think probably. Pat Benitar and New Edition were my the. first two concerts I saw when I was in. middle school. And um I saw Pep Benitar. at the Orum in Boston in. I don't know I think maybe I was a. freshman in high school and uh her. husband Neil Geraldo lead guitarist. still together. Um so anyway that's all just using this. time to say Pat if you're listening I.

love you. Please come on the show. and. everybody else listening. Um, here's to. all the great music we had growing up. and all the great music we have now and. all the great music yet to come. Music. will save us. Okay, bye. You've been listening to Good Hang. The. executive producers for this show are. Bill Simmons, Jenna [music] Weiss. Berman, and me, Amy Per. The show is. produced by The Ringer and Paperkite. For The Ringer, production by Jack. Wilson, [music] Cat Spalain, Kaia. McMullen, and Alia Xanerys. for.

Paperkite. Production by Sam Green, Joel. Levelvel, and Jenna Weiss [music]. Berman. Original music by Amy Miles. >> Was a really good Hey.