I Confronted The Governor Of Michigan | Financial Audit

Ladies and gentlemen, special episode. today with the governor of Michigan. I'm. going to be auditing the state's. finances. But quick little introduction. to say, hey, this is the day before. election day across the country. Make. sure you take advantage of your right to. vote. Get out there, vote. Lots of state. and local elections and I think one. federal election for a special. congressional run here in Texas. Just. make sure you get out there and vote. Enjoy the episode. >> You got to use tariffs like a scalpel, not a sledgehammer to everything. >> That's a political talking point. I've. never heard one of those in person. [laughter] That's wild.

>> Food stamps, let's just say, or food. assistants. Have we set up our systems. in a way we're also just discouraging. people from going out there and being. contributors? Uh, you know, this is the. part of the show where I usually go. through the spending and it's like we. got some bull spending in there. We got. some [ __ ] taquitos. Some bull. Yeah, you're stopping in the gas station, get. yourself some [ __ ] off. >> political extremism. It's scary. What do. you think is going on with political. extremism right now? And how would you. solve it? >> Your blood got thin moving down south, didn't it? Sign up for the new and improved. Dollarise budgeting app. Take the free.

trial and if you like it, sign up for. the annual version to save a ton of. money and get my budget friendly. cookbook signed by me and mailed. directly to you. And for a limited time. only, if you want to bundle all of my. educational programs together with the. budget app, join dollar wise central and. save 80%. Take the trial and learn more. at dollarwise.com. >> Hi, I'm Gretchian Whitmer. I'm the. governor of Michigan and this is. Financial Audit. This is crazy. >> What? [laughter]. >> This is just so weird. The governor of.

my home state and we're doing an audit. on the home state and talking some more. things. This is crazy. >> I know. I'm so glad to be with you. I. appreciate all the all the things you. do. >> Really? >> I mean, right now, we'll see how I feel. in 60. >> You know, people people on the left call. me a fascist. So you saying that as a. Democratic governor who's going to be. the Democratic nominee for president at. some point. Definitely definitely not. running though. >> anyway. >> is really good to hear that um I'm not a.

fascist anymore. >> Listen, you know what? Everyone's got. opinions right now. I'm not going to pay. attention to any of that. >> No money for what you do. I think what. you do is important. >> Yeah. Thank Well, thank you. I really do. appreciate that. And you know, and when. it comes to actually like extremism and. divis, I would love to hear your opinion. on that, you know, towards the end. Um, but you know, I'd love to start with. kind of Michigan finances in general, just kind of what the state looks like, then do some Michigan policies and then. some national ones. Uh, cuz you know, at.

some point national might be involved in. this conversation with you, but we'll. see. [laughter] I want to start though. So, Michigan 10th most populous state, pretty big economy. You know, it is a. major state. It's an important state in. the world of politics. You know, it's. gone Trump twice, it went anti-Trump. once, right? Yep. >> For it went Biden. So, you know, it's. it's very important. Uh we were. discussing beforehand, you don't like. the term rust belt cuz it feels like. it's done. But, you know, that's a very. important like mega region in United. States. You know, the Midwest, it's the.

most populous megalopouloolis. Um, so. it's it's very important and kind of how. states are doing there. >> and how they're running their economies, how their economies are doing, how the. state governments are overall working, I. think kind of sets a precedent for how. many other states around the country do. >> Yeah. So, I want to know first, we'll. get into some of the numbers, but when. you look at the state budget, when you. sign a budget into law, when you. advocate for certain things, what are. some of the primary things you're.

thinking of when it comes to revenue. collection, when it comes to where we're. distributing revenue, what are key. priorities for you? What are we. hyperfocused on? >> So, when we think about making sure that. anyone can come to Michigan and build. the life they want, that's really the. north star. That is who we are. You. know, people came to Michigan from. around the world for a job in the auto. industry. >> Well, I left. >> decades ago. I know. Well, it's time for. you to come home. >> Well, it's a little cold, >> but [laughter]. Oh, you you got weak, huh? >> Anyway, [laughter].

>> sorry. Good. >> You know, people came from around the. world to Michigan to get into the middle. class. You could get a job on. [clears throat] the line. You didn't. even have to go to any schooling beyond. high school and you could get in the. middle class, afford a second home up. north on the lake. I mean, it was a. great quality life. That's why we've got. such rich diversity. It's why we've been. the center of manufacturing for a long. time and that's a great strength. But we. know manufacturing is changing, right? The whole world is changing rapidly. And. so as we think about making sure that. Michigan stays competitive so that we've.

got the the resources to invest in our. people, making sure that we've got the. skill sets that are necessary for. advanced manufacturing jobs, jobs of the. future, making sure that we're investing. in places so that there are cool places. for people to live and that we're. landing projects. You know, it's a. competitive world. We have to out. compete other states. We have to out. compete other countries to get big. investment uh that leads to good paying. jobs. And right now I, you know, I think. we've done a lot of good things in. Michigan. It's it's tenuous with the.

tariff chaos that we're all navigating. >> This week ushers in another new era of. Trump tariffs. And. >> world leaders are trying to figure out. how to respond to President Trump's. attempt to reshape the global economy. >> Columbus, Michigan, a four farmers. feeding the state. But this year, there's a new stressor. >> Tariff, tariff, >> tariffs. >> These tariffs are starting to take a. bite. China slapped new tariffs on many. items. >> Toys, furniture, smartphones, just about. everything you can think of that comes. from another country. You're going to. end up paying more for it. >> We feel it hard more hard, you know,

more difficult in Michigan because of. agriculture and advanced manufacturing, specifically autos. We're more sensitive. to the tariff nonsense. And so, I think. that's a a major concern on my mind. right now. >> And I do have a question about the. tariff. I mean, we we can uh well, actually, I'll jump into that. That kind. of goes into the Michigan politics, you. know, side of things. When it came to. NAFTA, it projected we lost. manufacturing jobs in Michigan of about. 44,000 by 2010, 112,000 by 2018, uh with.

uh with even expanding into more Chinese. trade. And Michigan lost, you know, potentially upwards of 231,000. jobs since NAFTA was enacted. Uh. manufacturing jobs losing about 21.3%. Now, Trump's uh trade wars or deals that. he's trying to do, you know, they tend. to be more nationalistic. They tend to. be more protective. If Michigan. specifically has lost 21%, you know, I. do tend to uh like a good mixture of.

globalism and then some, you know, patriotism, nationalistic. You know, I. think there's a good hybrid to be done. But in general, the political left does. tend to be more globalistic right now, stereotypically, right? Oversimplifying. And the right tends to be more. nationalistic. Wouldn't you of the rust. belt, sorry, state of Michigan that lost. 21% in those sectors be more in favor of. something that's a bit more. protectionist. >> Well, yes and no. You got to be really. smart, right? You got to use tariffs. like a scalpel, not a sledgehammer. It's.

not the answer to everything. >> That's what political talking point. I've never heard one of those in person. That's wild. That's wild. >> That's true. I mean, you got to be. really thoughtful about it. Tariffs have. their place for sure. We've always. tariff. on a level playing field. Yes, we can for price. >> Our price of labor is substantially more. expensive in the United States. >> When you look at quality and when you. look at uh efficiency, yes, we can. But.

we got to have a level playing field. And because of so many decisions that. have made over many decades, we know. that our North American auto industry. relies on parts that are going back and. forth over the Ambassador Bridge in. Detroit to Windsor, Canada, >> seven, eight times a day for for parts. I mean, this trade is really important. We've built it in. Trump negotiated the. USMCA um or whatever you want to call it. depending on which country you're and. they all call it something different.

because they want their own country to. start first. >> I totally wholeheartedly want us to. onshore and bring as much manufacturing. to the shores of the United States. By. the same token, I'm very sober about who. our allies are and who's really been a. part of our our growth and what we've. required manufacturing to rely on. You. can't set up a plant overnight. It. [clears throat] takes years. These. companies make decades in investments. decades on the front end. And so it's. manufacturing is just different than. almost any other type of commerce that.

we have. And that's why it it needs to. be used as a scalpel, not a not a. sledgehammer. >> You know, that that certainly makes. sense from the perspective of, you know, whatever political party we're leaning. from and everything like that. I will. say I just want to start out of the gate. for my audience, even though people on. like the far left call me a fascist and. stuff. I we were even talking about this. before like I took out of just pure. curiosity when people were putting me in. political camps uh political uh tests. like a week ago and I'm aggressively.

boringly but obnoxiously centrist like. that fence that fence is going right. through my out my mouth. It is brutal. I. apologize governor. >> That's a visual. Thank you. >> It is but I'm I'm an obnoxious fence. sitter. you know, one of the more. controversial, not controversial things, but cuz you talked about it, you know, it a plant doesn't get set up overnight, right? >> Yep. You've done a lot of research. You. got a lot there. >> Well, you know, this is exciting. Um, you know, a part of the spending that. kind of comes out of the state could be.

more incentive type spending, but we're. talking like the Blue Oval Battery Park, that incentive package was cut from 1.03. billion to $49. million. you know, and if we're thinking. about plants being set up overnight, you. know, this is one of the more. controversial things that was done from. the state government perspective, and. that was projected jobs from 2500 down. to 1,700. Um, and then the state pulled. a separate $100 million grant tied to. lighting reductions there. And then.

there was the make it in Michigan, um, you know, billion dollars on, uh, five. EV battery related projects pledged. there. um you know where we're choosing. to put the money that obviously other. people are making and whatnot. Um and. then we're kind of reducing some of the. incentive packages we're doing to. certain plans and like you said it it's. not an overnight thing when they get in. there. You know what what is your. thoughts on that in terms of where we're. putting the money to help businesses.

actually relocate to other states. especially when we're kind of slashing. and then saying no it's going to go into. five EV battery plans. You know I'd love. to hear your perspective. I think when. you talk about autos, you know, there's. no question that the technology is. changing and evolving and we're getting. smarter, we're getting cleaner. That's a. good thing, right? And under the Biden. administration, they had a lot of. incentives and they we saw a huge amount. of investment that was being. contemplated or begun in this country. during the Biden administration. Now,

with the Trump administration, a lot of. things are getting pulled back and. business is nervous, right? you know as. well as I know when there is an. uncertain you know u strategy when the. rules keep changing what happens in. uncertainty it's paralysis right you. stop spending you pull back you wait to. see is the dust going to settle and. we're going to make these billions of. dollars of investments and so one of the. things we know though as as more. electric vehicles come online as we. build up the grid and support people. being able to travel with an electric.

vehicle um where the batteries are built. is going to be the center of gravity. They're because they're going to be the. heaviest component in the car. And so. battery plants are really important to. Michigan as we think about the the. long-term um dominance in in mobility. Uh we are currently the home of R&D for. almost every auto company on the planet. >> Michigan loves them cars. >> Yeah. And but we've got to also be able.

to be the place where they can build. batteries. they got the expertise and. the the concentration of of assets in. Michigan and that's why you know really. getting aggressive around that space has. been important for us. >> which I mean I can certainly vibe with. but you know as like the CEO of the. state right and we're thinking about. what CEOs are doing right now 87% of. CEOs in Michigan expect a weaker overall. state economy looking over the next. decade. >> yeah well I there's no question that. when you look at right now what's. happening there are a lot of very you. know troubling troubling ing signs about.

what's happening in the economy and I. think a lot of it stems from the. unpredictability of the CARIS uh the. tariff network and and policies right. now coming out of DC. I just it's. challenging and I've been I have been. advocating with the president with his. cabinet with folks in Washington DC. I. mean, I go no matter who's in office. because my job deliver Well, I wasn't. there for that particular press. conference. But. >> that was very funny. [laughter] That was.

very funny, wasn't it? I mean, come on. That was great. >> I can laugh at it now. >> Yes. Yes. Yes. [laughter]. >> But, you know, my job is I'm the. governor of Michigan. I got to show up. and fight for the people of Michigan and. the Michigan economy. And that's really. what what I'm doing when I'm trying to. set the table, when I'm trying to make. sure that our people have skills and. that you understand, you know, how to. have personal finance, you know, passing. a law so that we're we are arming our. people with information so they can make. good choices and make the build the.

lives that they want. All of these. things are related. >> and I am very excited to talk about that. one cuz that is something I've advocated. um for for these past three years. Um, but I do want to talk about again the. state of Michigan first. Sorry, I get. distracted into rabbit holes way too. easily. Uh, so outstanding debt for the. state of Michigan, $6.92. billion by the end of last year. Now, we're looking at 2024's financials. Uh, because I believe 2024 to 2025. financials for the state of Michigan. just closed out this month or last.

month, if I'm not mistaken. Um, however, good news, that debt went down $300. million or 4.2% 2% year-over-year. Uh. geo bonded debt $691.2. million, but then you know the vast. majority of that 6.9 is revenue. dedicated from transportation and state. building authority. And then the. government itself does have lease. commitments of uh $729.4. million in general. Then there is MD. capital commitments year end 3.3.

billion. How do you feel about the debt. of the state of Michigan? I mean three. 4.2% 2% paid off year-over-year. You. know, if you were a guest on the show, you know, I wouldn't be screaming too. much at that. That's that's pretty okay. You know, that's pretty chill. That's. progress. >> We've paid off a lot of debt and and I'm. proud of that. I think that that's. really important. Um, one of the things. that states can't do like the federal. government does is run deficits, right? Borrow money. Like, we we can't do that. We've got to have a balanced budget. I. have had a balanced bipartisan budget.

every year that I've been governor. I've. been to Wall Street to meet with rating. agencies. We secured an upgrade in our. our bond rating. These are right. These. are double A, I think, right now. But, you know, that that was an upgrade from. where we were. And so, I think it's. important to have our fiscal house in. order. It it impacts everything that. we're trying to do. So, we we take that. very seriously. It's not sexy to most, but I'm glad that you find it exciting. [laughter]. >> Oh, it's Yeah. No, I'm gooning over. here. It's good. Do you know what. gooning is? >> You know what? I actually um was just.

hearing about Gooning. >> Really? From who? >> Where? >> The lieutenant governor. >> Whoa. Um. >> I don't know. Is that a controversial. thing? >> Where was it? I was I don't know. I had. something on television. >> They're talking about Going on TV. That. sounds This is a guy who was spending. his money on spicy media. >> But you withdrew. What is this adding up. to? About 700, would you say? $700 in. cash. That's a lot.

>> I can't think of anything. >> Not strippers. >> No. >> No. He doesn't do that anymore. >> No, I just stay at home all day. Really? >> He really doesn't go anywhere. >> It's expensive Goonies. It's a smoking. gooning. >> Now, if I saw that in the government, the government's books. Some only. purchases. I'd be a little concerned. They're not there, are they? As we go. through here. >> Is that what you were talking about when. you were saying he was gooning, right? >> Probably. Yeah, he probably had that. >> Oaf. >> So, so educate your listeners who are. not as cool as you. Gooning. >> endless permanent never finishes.

>> I appreciate I apologize and press. secretary. I apologize. [laughter] I. like I keep seeing her there. I'm. judging on her facial reaction about it. Yes, it was your show. [laughter]. Thank you for educating me, Caleb. >> One thing that is a slight concern. though, um there is the uh if we look at. the overall the net position. >> Yeah. of the state of Michigan, it is. still negative $1.3 billion. Now, that's. like assets owned and then commitments.

that is required spending. So, yes, we're running a surplus. uh or or at least we're, you know, breaking even, but overall in general, we are still in a negative net position. So, negative net worth essentially for. translating from someone's household to. the government of Michigan. How do we. feel about that? Let's talk about. student loans. I know it's something we. all avoid talking about, but if your. private student loans are crushing you, Y refi might be exactly what you need. They don't rely on your credit score.

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Break free from the highinterest trap. and get your finances under control once. and for all. >> Well, it's I'm not I don't love it. I. don't love the fact that we've built a. budget based on some expectations from. the federal government that right now. with the shutdown, we don't know what is. going to happen and what's not going to. happen. We've got a lot of folks who get. um food benefits from the feds that the. money's not coming in. So, I mean, this. is I I think a really lousy position to.

be in. what we can control. We try to. make sure that we get our budgets done. on time and that they're balanced. But. there are a lot of things that we can't. control and so we've got to have enough. flexibility to make decisions along the. way in our budgets. >> And when it comes to spending, health. and human services is 35.57. billion or 44% of the spending in the. state of Michigan. If we're talking food. stamps, let's just say, or food. assistance. You know, I was I used to be. and I mean I still am. I want people to. have assistance who need assistance,

especially those that fall back. It's a. safety net now, right? Y safety. I've. had so many people on this show now and. I know we get the worst of the worst. It. is. Not you. I'm sorry. Like your. personal finances are probably okay. >> Yeah, they're in pretty good shape. >> Nice. Okay. So, um, but I've had so many. people on this show where they are. specifically choosing to not go work. more hours because then they'll be taken. off benefits. And I'm wondering, even. though I want to support people who fall. on hard times, obviously, because. they're human beings. Yeah. >> Have we set up our systems in a way,

let's say the state of Michigan, where. we're also just discouraging people from. going out there and being contributors? >> Yeah. Well, that that is an obscene and. I think rare example of where the system. is not perfect, right? That we want. people we want to incentivize work. We. want people to be gainfully employed and. and not relying on state funding. But we. recognize that there are a lot of people. who right now are struggling to just. take care of their daily needs, their. family's needs. So that's why this is.

important. I understand that you've had. people suggest that you could move to. Michigan and get some benefits that you. can't get elsewhere. That's just not. true. And I wanted to go out of my way. to address that. Okay. >> Wow. >> Cuz you know, we're all playing by the. same federal rules. >> And so every state should be the same on. those fronts. you know, we have. different interpretations, different. applications. Some of us make it easier. to apply, etc. But I think that that's. something worth um worth highlighting. >> Now, my big concern when I look through.

the finances of the state of Michigan is. the funding ratio. >> for the pension. >> Michigan's next budget is on Governor. Gretchen Whitmer's desk. >> and a primary focus of the budget, as it. always is, is public education. >> The move in the lame duck session is. aimed at bringing greater financial. stability to troubled districts. This is. much less than the last fiscal year. >> We're talking about an unfunded. liability of about $27 billion, but a. good chunk of that doesn't make it to. the classroom. >> The state ranks 44th in the nation when. it comes to starting pay. The average.

starting salary for Michigan teachers. was $41,645. That's around $4,800 less than the. national average. >> There's not a lot of economic incentive. to pursue a career in teaching. The. budgeting could result in layoffs in the. upcoming year. >> We're talking 74.83%. is adequately funded for what is needed. to fund for the entire state pension. I. I I would love to hear your perspective. on this. Now, I I will give a W. Uh. that's gone up from 60 uh 66.3% last.

year to 74% this year, but that is still. very far away from mandatory that needs. to be handed out. And honestly, the gain. has only been uh caught up uh through. market recovery. >> Yeah. Well, you know, we've got a state. treasurer, Rachel Eubanks, who I think. does a fantastic job. We've get we've. made a lot of headway on whether it's. paying down debt or increasing our our. rating, but you know, there still is. more work to do. There's no question. I.

mean, pensions have been an important. tool in getting people to go into public. service. Yes. Um, and we saw with the. Detroit bankruptcy about 10 years ago. that the all the pensioners ended up not. getting fully what they expected to when. they worked for like the city of Detroit. for as many years as they did. So these. pension systems are are can be unwieldy, but it's we have a duty to to fund them. >> Sure. I mean, the pension system being. $24.4 billion underwater is five times.

the annual K through2 school aid fund. contribution. So, it's going to take a. long time to close the uh gap. And then. also with a retirey to active ratio of. 1:3, it's a little scary. What would you. do to fix it? >> What do you you know, I'm curious. I. know you've done a a ton of research. here. Where do you how do we stack up? What what are you seeing things that. other states are doing that we should be. that we should learn from? >> You know, I'll be honest. I was just. pulling data from the state of Michigan. and hyperfocusing on state of Michigan. because even when it comes to a lot of.

the guests on the show, I try not to sit. there and endlessly compare them to. other people. I take a look at their. situation. I'm like, "Okay, here's. things that aren't good. What can we do. to fix it?" Now, fixing a pension, that. is not my expertise, but I would. absolutely love to hear, you know, kind. of what you would do if you had the. dictatorial stamp in the state of. Michigan. How would you fix this pension. underfunding ratio? Well, at at the end. of the day, right, I don't get to have a. dictatorial ability to to fix every. problem that I see. Um, and and I I.

think that's not how it should be, frankly. Um, I got to work with the. legislature to have policies that make. sense that everyone can live with. And. right now, I've got a Republican House. and a Democratic controlled Senate. Um, I think that we did a lot of good things. in this last budget that we got done. Whether it is cutting taxes on overtime. and tips like the House Republican. leadership wanted to do, it's similar to. what President Trump has done on the. national level or it is investing in. kids and newborn health. That that was a.

Senate priority. Um, we got a lot of. good stuff done, but there's still. there's always going to be additional. work to to do to shore up as we think. long term, especially as we've got so. many um public servants who are aging. >> and are going to be relying on this. So, how can I fix it overnight? I can't fix. it overnight. I recognize that it's it's. an important part of a long-term. solution that we've got to we got to. continue to strive toward. Well, what is.

what is the steps to put in for the. long-term solution though to fix the. pension? Want to know a dirty little. secret? And no, I'm not starting an. only. You're not broke because you suck. with money. You just can't see where. it's going. If your bank account is. empty at the end of every month, that is. not bad luck. That is bad tracking. And. it's exactly why I use Dollar. It shows. you exactly where [music] your money is. going every single month. Spending, subscriptions, and savings all in one. simple dashboard. everything you need.

and nothing you don't. And when you. download Dollarise today, you'll get. this to try for free, plus 3 months for. just $9.99. So, you can finally take. control and see what your money's been. doing behind your back. Click below to. get started. >> Well, and first, as you said, you know, we we're in a stronger position than we. were, and a lot of that's been driven by. the market, so we'll take it, right? Um, but how do we ensure that we're putting. more resources in? We've got our uh. Mipers, which is our our school. employees uh retirement that is going to.

be coming offline in a few years because. we're paying we're getting up to full. funding there. And so that is one. additional uh mechanism that we'll have. to put toward additional uh retirement. dollars. >> So my concern when it comes to you know. I know that's not a retirement plan for. everyone in Michigan. you know, the the. employees for the state. >> But when it comes to especially on the. federal level, entitlement programs that. are put in, I'm a big fan a lot of the. concept of a lot of them. But one thing.

that we at least find within the last. 100 years, if a big entitlement is put. in, it's impossible to get rid of. And. my fear with, you know, like a pension. plan like this, right, is it's so. attached, you know, people are going to. be very patriotic about it who are, you. know, state employees. But if it is not. a sustainable system, it's going to be. borderline impossible to tweak in a. significant enough way to change it or. even get rid of kind of like social. security. It's not going to work for my. generation. I'm going to get a. substantially less amount of money. Y.

>> um and that sucks. And it's going to be. much more on the level of a literal. Ponzi. It's not right now. Um because. right now, you know, money coming in, it's not fully dependent on money coming. in. By the time I retire, it's going to. be fully dependent on money coming in. So that that's what makes me nervous. about like the pension system. >> Well, I think to be clear, you know, no. people aren't getting pensions now, right? Like this is not a long-term. um issue that we're seeing continuous, you know, continued in terms of policy.

>> Mhm. >> Previous governors and legislators. got into the pension system. I'm not. And I've been doing this for 25 years. So, >> well, you're going to be president, so. we don't have to worry about it. >> Well, we're phasing out is what I'm. saying. And so as you think about like. how is this sustainable over the long. run, >> it's not going to be as big an issue for. us in the long run because it's not. available to people. >> That's good. Now, uh spending 44% goes. to health and human services as we said. Uh 31% to education, transportation, 6.8% and I know that was a big thing for.

you. I remember fix the damn roads when. I still live there. Yes, sir. Uh 4.3% to. the general government. Public and. safety corrections uh 3.81%. I assume. most of public safety is locally uh. funded. uh revenue sharing 1.67 billion. tax credits 1.46 four, six, and I do. have a little bit, you know, to talk. about that as we continue to go through. this. Uh, and then just some smaller. ones in general. And then, you know, when it comes and and I I would love to. actually learn more about this. Uh, when.

it comes to the revenue and we got uh. operational grants is $33 billion, general taxes 21 billion, education 16. billion, and transportation 3.7 billion. Go into operating grants. I love to kind. of learn a little bit more about that. personally. You know, as I was sitting. there thinking about how revenue is. collected from the state. >> operating grants where do I mean do you. have a specific department question or. >> Well, as we were just pulling in like. where the money is coming into the. state. >> Uh where a. >> big chunk operational grants, you know,

maybe through everything I was pulling. from the state's websites, it just. wasn't specific enough, but I was like, what is this? I'm so curious. Maybe she. could answer it for me. Yeah, I'm going to I I I don't want to I. don't want to guess off the top of my. head and be wrong, but. >> Yeah, fair enough. >> Government activity revenues. >> Totally good. >> It just it Yeah, it could be a variety. of things and it's probably. a lot of a variety of things. >> And we already talked about the net. position, but when it comes to the.

school aid fund, that is a balance, but. it is uh restricted for education of. $4.45 billion. What's interesting about. this, and I'd love to hear your. perspective, is there's controversial. things that are funding a big part of. it. They got weed, you know, which is. interesting. You know, I was much more. in favor of legalization many years ago, but so many studies have been coming out. these last few years about just kind of. overall. >> um effects on people. Less less, it's. not like, you know, shaky dependency, but uh many things you do when you smoke.

every day are no longer as enjoyable. when you stop smoking, you know. Um and. just some overall health effects. I. mean, if you're putting things in your. lungs in general, it's usually not great. for you. >> The state released its annual marijuana. tax revenue totals yesterday. >> $270 million. >> Mainly because of the marijuana dollars. We've got about a million dollars of. work planned just in road improvements. >> Outside the state capital, supporters of. the cannabis industry gathered to fight. a proposed 24% tax on marijuana. >> A 24% wholesale tax on marijuana is set.

to begin in January, part of a long-term. plan to fund road construction in the. state budget. Over the last few years, the city's been able to take a much more. aggressive approach in repairing them, filling in the potholes thanks to pot. taxes. >> The $42 million in revenue comes from. just from recreational sales and is. being split among communities that allow. these sales thanks to Michigan's. taxation of marijuana act. >> So, there is that that brings in $33.1. million. Then there's sports betting and.

I game combined gross receipts 2.86 to. $2.9 billion. But the state taxes and. fees is 466. There's a lot of dependency. issues, especially on gambling and. things like that. How do you feel that. so much of school is being funded. through blazing it up and going and. blowing all that money? >> Yeah. Well, you know what? I I don't. love that um we see, you know, a lot of. um gaming funding our schools, etc. But. at the end of the day, people are. engaging in the conduct and every state.

taxes it and you know operates. >> um budgets based on whatever taxes they. collect. You know our sales taxes also. help fund our schools. Our sales taxes. are lower than they are here in Texas. So. >> to make up what the difference is, right? Like there are legislatures and. governors past have selected different. things to include in the school aid. fund. It's not like I came into office. and said, "All right, this is how we're. going to start doing it." But, um, you.

got to recognize that sin taxes are. always easiest taxes for pe for. legislators to take votes on, and that's. generally why we see them continuing to. fund things like schools and everything. else in state government. >> Well, people would uh say and advocate. for it that it hurts the lower income. the most. >> I there's not Yeah, I I that's not. wrong. >> Yeah. And yet, um, I think that that's. one piece of of the education budget. But by and large, it's 2 cents out of. our 6centent, um, sales tax goes to our.

schools, too. >> Yeah. Okay. And then as we continue. there, the school stabilization fund is. $1.3 billion. Um, so I mean, the overall. school funding tends to look relatively. healthy, but there is a lot of kind of. restricted spending. So 1.3 is. stabilization and counter cyclical of. 477 million, but 4.46 is restricted into. education, which I think is good. At. least we're not going in and tapping it. Right. >> Right. Well, that we just created that. in the last two years, the stabilization. fund. Cuz I know it's important that.

you've got like a savings fund in case. some unforeseen thing happens. And who. God only knows, right? Like the last. seven years, if they've taught me. anything, is that there could be some. new thing around the bend that you're. not anticipating. So, we've got a rainy. day fund or budget stabilization fund. for the rest of the budget. I. [clears throat] wanted to create one for. schools because I think it's really. important that we've got additional. resources. So, >> and that's what's next. >> This is a good chart. >> What's that? >> This is a good chart. Yeah. See, >> it's only going up. Co took a little. bit. Okay. Fair enough. [laughter] It.

was hard. >> Yeah. It was a little I'll be honest. >> I was a little annoyed when I came home. for Christmas two years in a row. Yeah. Like we had to eat outside, but we were. in inside pods outside. It was a little. [laughter] weird that I came back here. and then I could just do whatever. >> Well, >> that that was a bit weird. I'll be. honest. >> Well, but remember what the what the. temperature was here? You can walk. around outside all day, right? At home. >> In Michigan, in the winter, we're all. inside breathing on each other.

>> But if I was allowed to be inside. outside, why couldn't I just be inside. inside? because you were inside outside. with just your your small group of. people. >> and the servers and busers. >> Listen, Caleb, none of us wants to go. back and relive that. We were doing the. best we could with very little or or. very bad information. >> I'll accept it. I just remember being a. little annoyed. [laughter]. >> I'm sure. >> And it was cold, too. Like, what the are. people doing? Why the It's so cold. What. are we doing? Like, >> you you your blood got thin moving down.

south, didn't it? >> Well, now I hate the summers, so it's. [laughter] fair. You know, I do I. they're they're Yeah, I'd like to get a. place up there again on Gull Lake at. some point in retirement. I love G Lake. I used to think razor burns were just. the cost of shaving like irritation and. bumps are just how it works, right? So, I kept trying to fix it with fancier. creams, cold towels, better prep. But it. turns out I wasn't solving anything. I. was just managing damage with expensive. blades that dull fast and cost way too. much. And then I tried Hensen. This.

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over 2 years worth. Let's get back to. the show. Personal tax rate, there was a. 2023 drop to 4.05%, but that was uh brought back up to. 4.25%. And the Supreme Court denied an appeal. on August 30th of last year. Were you. more of a proponent of keeping it at. 4.05 or moving it back to that 4.25? >> I was a proponent of following the law, which said it had to go back up to two. 4.25. >> Okay. If if the if you were able to pass. a law to bring it back down to four, would you? If someone could tell me how we're going.

to fund the things that we need to fund, >> would you cut back on anything in order. to fund that? >> I think we've made a lot of hard cuts. recently. So, uh, before I would agree. to take more important resources out of. our budget, I'd want to know where. people think they're coming from. Part. of the, you know, the hardship of being. in this spot is the end of the day, I. got to make sure the book's balanced, right? And so it angers some people on. my left, it angers some people on my. right when say, "No, I'm not I don't. want to look at that tax cut unless you. got a solution for me." And no, I'm not. going to look at this spending unless.

you tell me where the money is coming. from. >> I'm curious if like if this was, you. know, me and my obnoxious middle and. this was the what what was that? This. was the right. >> and this is the left. And let's say. Bernie and Mandami are right here. Where. are you? >> It depends on who you ask, but I think I. I mean I think I'm I'm closer to the. middle. >> Well, when I still live there and you're. going through the primary, there was a. dude with like I think like a fake. toupe. >> Oh, yeah. >> Kind of [laughter] guy. I think he's in. Congress now. But he was like the.

progressive, you know, far-left running. and then you were the more center. >> He and Abdul Elsad. Yes. Were both way. on the Yes. kind of irritated me at the. beginning to tell you the truth cuz I'm. I'm proud to be a very, you know, progressive former legislator. >> with a with a like the receipts, right? Like I'd been in the legislature. I took. lots of votes. I had an agenda and two. guys who never ran for anything ran and. and you know took all these positions. and tried to make me look like I wasn't. really a a good Democrat. And you know.

what? It irritated me at the beginning. but they actually probably did me a. favor. >> um because I think more people were open. to uh hearing me out and that's probably. how I won. >> But can you beat Gavin Newsome. [laughter]. >> in Michigan? Yeah, >> you can beat anyone in Michigan. >> Fair enough. Um, now one of the big. percentages that money does go to if. we're bringing taxes, you know, legally. up from 4.5 to 4.25, there is the. working families tax credit. And this is. a redistribution type system. And I. think a lot of people forget in this.

country, even compared to many Western. countries, our income tax system is. actually towards the top of the. progressive world. A lot of the funding. that comes in those Western European. systems, social democracies that we like. are usually value added taxes. That's. what kind of pays the bills, right? And. that tends to hurt everyone where we. tend to be more progressive where uh the. top 1% in this country pays I believe. it's like 30% of all income taxes. The. top 50% pays 48% of or 98% of all income. taxes. The top 50% of earners. So we.

have this where we move the taxes back. up. But the state of Michigan, you know, is handing more money out. So there's a. single worker with no kids making. $15,000 and the federal government might. get $600 to $700. There was a match of 6% of Michigan, but. now we're getting up to 30%. >> The So the earned income tax credit, that's what that is. The working. families tax credit is what we're. calling it now, but it was really the. earned income tax credit. And this has. been around for decades. A lot of states. offer the EITC. um to draw down federal dollars for.

people that are working full-time but. can't make ends meet. You know, like a. lot of people you have on your show, right? You've got people who are working. $15 an hour jobs cannot, you know, cannot make it doing that. And so this. incentivizes full-time work by giving. people some additional tax relief. And. it disproportionately it's like over 50%. supports people who are also raising. kids. So it's like got that compounding. benefit. >> Yeah. A single parent with two kids.

making $25,000 a year would roughly get. $6,800. And now, you know, you get that 30%. match from Michigan. Um, now. technically, you know, this is a form of. redistribution. It is, you know, maybe. it's with a good heart. Do you think at. the end of the day it is overall. beneficial to the economy in terms of. the way we're looking for our economic. structure to be created and managed? >> Well, I think government at the end of. the day is really about making sure that. every one of us can be safe, right? Like.

that's the most basic of of government's. job is to keep people safe, but also to. create the conditions where every person. can can thrive, right? To create an. economy that business people can have. the workforce that they need. I mean, it's all about what are our priorities. and how do we make sure that all bo all. boats rise. You know, a rising tide. lifts all boats. I mean, I think that. that's the philosophy that I've always. um looked at all of these policies with.

and and you know, I think that it's. important to have debate. I think it's. important to understand some of the. shortcomings of of past policies and. look to what others are doing and see, can we make it better? I mean, one of. the things that we've done is um really. invest in our workforce. um bringing. down the cost of higher education, bringing down the cost of getting into a. trade school. Um there was something. called the Tennessee Reconnect. We, you. know, borrowed that idea, made it our. own, and we've got the Michigan.

Reconnect, which helps people 25 and up, go back to school and earn additional. credentials. So, you know, it's um it's. in all of our interest to make sure that. those basics are are addressed. So, there's also one of the more. controversial things for EV holders like. myself. I have a Model X. Um, and I love. it and they hate me for it and it's. great. You know, we have a $160 a year. for EVs since they're not paying, you. know, gases. They're not getting gas.

tax. Is it fair, especially if you're. more on the clean energy side, that. they're punished for not having a gas. vehicle? >> So, how are you punished for not having. a gas vehicle? $160 a year for EVs and. $60 registration a year for PHEVs as. well. Yeah. >> Okay. So, that's for a registration fee. I mean, you're still using the roads, right? >> Mhm. >> So, it's a reg. here in Michigan and Texas. >> We're exploring tolls. You know, it's a. little it's a little more challenging.

because we don't have people cutting. through Michigan like we do Ohio and. Pennsylvania. So, it's a little more. challenging, but we're studying it. And. I think, you know, we're going to. explore whether or not, you know, there's a a a roadway or two or many. that that might it might make sense. >> Go to Canada, right? Cut through. Michigan to go to Canada. >> Yeah. >> I don't know if tolls are honestly good. or not, but I just, you know, that's one. of the controversial things that I kind. of want to bring up. Controversial. It's. not like people are like like raising. stakes. Yeah. [laughter]. >> Um Okay. And then we'll move on.

>> How did you get into this? Can I ask you. a question? Like Yes. Why? Why? Why is. this your your passion? Did you have a a. bad experience or did you make a bad. decision? >> As poor as Michigan, but that was my. choice, not Michigan's fault. Okay. >> And I was dumb. Started learning about. personal finance a lot. And then after. wanting to switch career fields from. product management and wanted to work. with a YouTuber, someone kind of led me. along for a couple months, didn't hire. me, so I decided to start my own. >> Is the short version. >> All right. >> Yeah.

>> What's the worst financial mistake you. ever made. >> that I ever made? I mean, I maxed out a. credit card at 18 immediately on a. piano. I wanted to get a piano because I. was going to be a music major. I have to. get a nice piano. 25 $2,500. Just There. we go. Or uh McDonald's every day. The. junior year of college. Also, max out. another $2,500 card. >> at McDonald's. >> That's why we got this. That's why we. got this, [laughter] baby. That's that. >> Damn. >> So, we already talked about, you know, some of the spending incentives cut back. from the Ford Marshall Plan. Then there.

was the uh the make it in Michigan where. we spent a billion dollars on five EV. plants. As of 2025 of this month, lawmakers killed that multi-billion. subsidy program, right? >> Well, we are we're retooling a bit. So, I'm working with the legislature to make. sure we still have some good economic. development tools, but um you know, you. got to you got to retool. You got to be. nimble. We're competing against Ohio. We're competing against Japan. You know. what I mean? like we're competing. against the world. So, we've got to have.

the tools we need. >> And then pork. Government loves pork. We. got $950 million there. So, $234 million. public infrastructure grants like $50. million for downtown Pontiac, $20. million to the city of Wyoming, $20. million. Detroit Greek Town Corridor, 5. million to Grand Rapids Children Museum, $122 million. Community enhancement. projects like 12 million statewide. YMCA's 5 million. Detroit Fisher. building 5 million Special Olympics.

5 million West Michigan Chamber. Do they. not have their own money? [laughter]. Special Olympics? >> I mean, Special Olympics. Are you. against Special Olympics? >> No. I just not the biggest fan of taxes. sometimes. >> I understand. >> Especially now that I have to write the. check instead of it getting automatic. >> I get it. I get it. But, you know, this. is not unique to Michigan. It's not. great. And we are making changes to have. more transparency in the process. Yes. >> To make sure that people who are. promoting whatever project they want to.

get done have to do it so many days in. advance so that the whole world can. scrutinize it so that they can make. their case that it's the right thing to. do. >> And trust me, I qualify for the Special. Olympics. I'm this. >> 91 million for healthc care projects, 20. million to the Henry Ford house, 30. million second on medical center, 10. million for Detroit firefighter health. support. And then dozens of smaller. options like $900,000 to a Troy cricket. field. That's lots of Indian immigration. there. 200,000 to a new Buffalo disc and.

1.6 million Grand Rapids ballet from the. States. Why can't Grand Rapids do that? >> It's a good question, Caleb. I'll have. to tell you what legisl What legislator. asked for that and you could ask them. that question. >> That's just, you know, I love my home. state. >> I know. Well, this this this doesn't. make sense when you're looking at it. from, you know, 40,000 ft. I get it. But. don't wait before we. >> I understand but the same token I got to. get a budget to my desk and legislators. come with their you know with their. special projects and.

>> um they negotiate them in and I. introduce a budget it doesn't have any. pork in it. All right. Yeah. When I. introduce the budget, so these are not. things that I ever was advocating for. Yeah. But the legislature gets their. shot at it. And this is often what you. see. >> Detroit Downtown Boxing Gym, $2 million. Detroit Zoo, 7 million. We like the. zoos. They're great. Zoos are exciting. Uh Frankenmouth Youth Sports Complex, 10. million from the state. Potter Park Zoo. in Lancing, $10 million. Uh, you know,

this is the part of the show where I. usually go through the spending, and. it's like, we got some bull to spend in. there. [laughter] We got some [ __ ]. taquitos. All right, that's what we call. them here. This is some bull. Yeah, you're stopping in the gas station. Get. yourself some [ __ ]. >> Some [laughter] Special Olympics bull. >> No, we love the Special Olympics. We. love the Special Olympics. I just didn't. know the state of Yes. >> Yeah. [laughter] Um Oh, well actually uh. and why it's kind of controversial is a. lot of it is like no bid, negotiated. late, and sponsor disclosure or after. pack.

>> Yeah, I know. It's gross. I mean, I. think that every dollar should be if. it's used in those ways, there should be. a bidding process or front-end. transparency, which is what I think. we're going to get done. >> There's also $3 million uh uh in I think. this year for state managed retirement. plan marketplace for businesses under. 100 employees. Like we get like I'm a. small business under employee. Like I. save money on taxes implementing a. retirement plan. Why why does the state. of Michigan need to come in and use. taxpayer money to set up retirement.

plans for private businesses? >> I that's a good question. I don't have a. great answer for you other than. >> um I think the the goal there is. obviously to help the Small Business. Association. help their members get get healthcare. >> And at least there I mean there are some. things in court like 2.5 million for the. Lancing lug nuts. Who goes to the lug. nuts? I don't know what a lug nut is. It's a lug nut. It's a part. It's a part. in your car. And the lug nuts are the. baseball team in Lancing.

>> Interesting. [laughter] Lots of ebike. incentives. 12250 per bike. $1,250 per. bike. >> Electric bikes, ebikes could soon become. more affordable under the new state. budget. Republicans say the program is. another example of wasteful spending. The vouchers could save buyers anywhere. from $500 to just over $1,200. What was. the public feedback about what kind of. access there should be now for bikes? >> I would say it was really [music] um. split. Some were very much in favor and. in support of what what the department.

was proposing. Some were very much. against it. >> So it's expensive, you know, just people. are paying a lot of money in taxes and. it's a small percentage overall, but it. all stacks up. Right. Right. >> Um and you know, when we're thinking of. like the pork that it goes to of almost. a billion bucks, like that kind of that. starts to hurt. That kind of starts to. hurt. This one was kind of This is a. pilot program put into law this year, $2.5 million going to grant program. aimed at short-term lenders, payday. loans, essentially government funded. payday loans. Now, I know you didn't.

advocate for this. I'm not saying that. >> You're right. I just signed a budget. that doesn't have any of those things in. it like the budget that I introduced in. February. >> Um, and the state of Michigan outlook is. actually pretty uh in general pretty. good. two 3.9% growth uh income per. capita this year projected uh going. forward about 3.2%. And we do expect. slower growth overall economists are. saying but still growth in Michigan. which is good. You got up to the double. A+ that's exciting credit rating and. Detroit's kind of you know getting a. nice little rebound. You know that.

little core area we like that if I would. live anywhere it would be Grand Rapids. personally if I moved back but um 50% of. the year being overcast just can't do. that. Uh there is you know potential. tariff risks right now. Manufacturing is. flat to down and uncertainty is. definitely high. It is the state is 49th. in population growth. That is a. long-term risk. You know growing. populations required for a thriv. thriving economy. Um and co sentiment is. negative and um you know so those are.

kind of the concerns of the state of. Michigan. Do you have any thoughts on. those before we kind of go on into some. of the other videos? >> Of course I do. I got thoughts on all of. it, but you know, I'll I'll keep it. succinct. I think, >> you know, there are a lot of good things. happening. I think overwhelmingly, we. just saw a a new poll come out about. kind of sentiment in Detroit. Some crazy. number like 78% of the people feel like. we're on the right track. I don't know. how long it's been since you've been to. Detroit, but we hosted. >> Try to avoid it. >> Well, we hosted the draft last year. It. was spectacular. I mean, there's so much.

good stuff going on. Detroit, Grand. Rapids, >> Michigan's a a a great place and yes, we've got some challenges. Um but I feel. like we're making real headway and um. it's an exciting time to be to be in. Michigan. >> for at least half the year. >> Oh, all year round. >> Caleb, people are going to need places. like Michigan. 20% of the world's fresh. surface water. That is, >> you know, we don't have nearly the. climate stuff that you guys have down. here, for instance. Yeah, we got them.

droughts, droughts and flood. >> or on the east coast, you know. I mean. it when we have a ice storm, you know, we got the equipment to take care of it. >> That is true. The only reason I'd move. back to Michigan is if the world is. collapsing. That would be the one thing. I'm I'm with you. I'm with you. My. family's there. I love Michigan. It's I. you know I got I got my Michigan stuff. here, too. >> Yeah. Oh, thank you. Yes. Hi. Listen. here. Financial audit. I've curated the. exact resources and tools I personally. use or would use if I was in certain.

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most importantly, go get your free. Hammer financial score and see where you. stand in the world of finances. Take the. assessment at caleophammer.com. You. [clears throat] will not regret any of. these. Change your life today. >> Yes, let's do that. And uh while I do. this, I mean, this is exciting. So, the. personal finance being taught in school. I'd love to learn more about that. >> Yeah. Well, you know what it is? There's. no question in my mind that we're. missing an important head shark. >> A shark. Yes. The hammer. You're the. hammer. There are not sharks in Lake. Michigan. >> But I love Shark Week.

>> You love Sharkquake? >> Oh god. You've got a You've Yes. There's. a whole story there. >> Okay. >> Do you want to hear it? >> Uh, no. [clears throat]. >> Okay. Google Gretchen Whitmer and Shark Week. >> It's not just Shark Week. It's Shark. Week. >> But anyway, yes, hammerhead shark. because I love sharks. What else? >> That'll push you over the edge in 2028. >> Shark week. [laughter] That's what we. I'm sorry. I'm just being a dick for no. reason. Let's see. Oh, some coasters.

I think I'm feeling coasters. Look at that. The state of Michigan. coaster. We love it. Is the great lake. state. And it is the mitten state. Wisconsin. [ __ ] off. Like, what are they. doing? >> Wisconsin. Give me a break. >> Yeah. Yeah. Tell them to off. >> Fork off. >> Okay. [laughter]. Well, I really appreciate it. I I would. love to learn more about personal. finances being taught. >> something more. Oh, wait. Here's the. >> Ah.

>> Oh, yeah. Natty, this is exciting. And I. want to close the conversation on a. happy note with that. But yes, we'll. save it. Western Michigan the national. championship in college hockey last. year. Thank you. >> Hockey puck. Yes, they beat my alma. mater Michigan State on the way. So, >> you're damn right. We split with. Michigan this weekend. >> Yes. >> But personal finance being taught in. school. So, you know, there's no. question that everyone needs to know. personal finance. You know, I remember. talking to my daughter when she was. taking algebra and she's like, "Why do I.

need to know quadratics? I need to know. how to pay my taxes and buy a house.". >> And, you know, I that sentiment, I. think, is is real, right? We've got to. give people the tools they need to take. care of themselves. And we had to do it. before they head off to college and get. that credit card when they're 18 years. old and buy a stupid piano. >> I still have it. Thank you. >> Okay. Pianos aren't stupid, but to buy a. piano was it was horrible. It was. stupid. >> So, you know, we want to giving people. budgeting having a rudimentary.

understanding of of markets and how to. save. You know, I'm always talking to my. kids about maximize what you can. If. your employer has some sort of a match, do the maximum. Like that's what my. parents always taught me, right? >> And and I did it my whole time. And I've. been a public service, you know, my. whole life. M I', you know, I'm I'm not. complaining about what I make, but I'm I. don't make a fortune. It's public. service. That's part of it. As governor, it's $159,000 a year, >> you know, and certainly that's the. highest I've ever been paid. So,

>> a new book, right? >> I'm donating that money to charity. I. can't make additional money while I'm. governor. >> So, anyway, well, >> but the point is like you max it out. You max it out. And we want people to. understand that, you know, I think a lot. of a lot of people get into trouble very. quickly because they just don't have. that memory. Even my husband who was a. dentist, he went to school, you know, K. through 12, went to college four years, went to dental school four years, and. then. >> you have really nice teeth. >> Thank you. Yeah, I paid a lot of money. I knocked these suckers out when I was. in eighth grade. But anyway,

>> um the point is he graduated after all. this schooling. >> Mhm. >> Didn't have any idea how to run a. business. >> No one taught him that. Killed. themselves. >> Yeah. He Oh god, that's. >> It's true. >> It got dark fast. >> No, it's true though. High suicide rate. but had to, you know, had to figure that. out on the fly. Didn't get that. rudimentary knowledge. So that's what we. were trying to do. Give people arm. people with information. >> And this was required for graduation. >> Yes. >> Very good. Is there any way out of that? Cuz I know sometimes you can take like.

this is a slightly different class, but. it's kind of adjacent, so you don't have. to take that class. >> I don't believe so. I think that this is. and and anyone who's in 10th grade now. will have to have had it in order to. graduate. >> Well, W for that, right? I mean, that's. good. That's great. It's important. >> That's very important. Can you change. one thing for me, though? What? This is. so moronic. I don't understand because. Texas does it, too. I think it's just. Michigan and Texas, if I'm not mistaken. Tesla cannot be a license as a dealer in.

the normal sense with the Michigan. Vehicle Franchise Act in Michigan. I. know we want to protect the auto. industry, but we got new type of auto. industry coming. I don't know if they. build in Michigan, but like we still. like let people just buy a car and um. they have to be avoid being instate new. direct sales under dealership law. So. the sale is orchestrated out of state. and then the vehicle titled in Michigan. afterwards and Tesla cannot directly own. a service or repair uh faculty in. Michigan under the same corporate. structure.

>> So stupid. >> It's really stupid. >> It would take an act of the legislature. to get it done. So, I can't do it. unilaterally. I will say this though, there's no shortage of Teslas driving on. Michigan roads. >> Yeah, but they have to get it has to be. an order out of state. We have to do. this in like if I buy the Cybertruck. that which. >> who would do that? >> Well, I love my ex. Like, I'm just. saying I love my ex. Cybertruck, not for. me. But if I were to buy them, they're. made in Austin. It gets like shipped out. of state then move then back in. It's. really silly.

>> That's weird. It's just like why is the. government like picking well I guess. it's going like full old school like um. Obama era uh winners and losers kind of. are you're picking like the lines that. is weird. >> I don't know but in Michigan too. >> yeah well. >> supporting the big three. >> I think I think we can understand the. history that why that's the reality. currently in Michigan but the Texas. one's weird you know get a little sucky. sucky Elon and you know try to get him. to build some stuff in Michigan. Hey. man, Elon Musk wants to have a.

conversation about billing in Michigan. I'm all I'm all ears. Yes. >> Come on in. >> Why would you go anywhere else? >> 50% overcast of the year. Depression. I. can't do it. I cannot do it. Now, student loans in the country. You know, you'll probably be somewhere nearing the. White House at some point. And right. now, we got $1.63 trillion. is student loans. That's crazy. In. federal student loans alone, not not to.

mention private and we got $40,000 for. the average borrower and 40% drop out. By the way, I'm among that 40%. That is. 45 million people have federal student. debt and delinquency rates are rising at. 7.73%. Now, my big question is, you know, the. Trump administration through the BBB did. enact some changes and that kind of. included the wrap plan. President. Trump's new tax and spending law brings. sweeping changes to the federal student. loan system. Effect.

>> total student debt in America is at $1.8. trillion. It's roughly tripled in the. last 17 years. >> A surge in past due student loans is. sparking new concerns about the health. of the US economy. >> Currently have 22, >> 56, >> 90, 134, >> 108,13748. in student loans. In one survey, 60% of. younger borrowers said they'd be in. their 40s before their student loans are. paid off. >> My daughter's going to a school. She.

can't afford $240,000 in debt. She's. going to be a well financed barista when. this is over. >> And uh simplifying a lot of the. complicated repayment processes and that. means payments are set at 1 to 10%. But. I've seen all over Tik Tok a lot of. people mostly on well the Tik Tok. generation like kind of far left, they're like I'm not going to pay. Then. they get their wages garnered. They're. like I can't afford to pay and it's like. 1% of their income. What is your. thoughts on this? Cuz I know you have a. different political philosophy than the. president of the United States, but that. doesn't seem like a bad thing, but. everyone on the left side of the.

political aisle was like, "This is. evil.". >> So every I where we're sitting right. now, there's every once in a while I. smell toast. Do you smell the toast? >> Yeah, it's a [laughter] bakery. You're. not having a. >> make sure I wasn't having like something. going on. Okay. >> I'm sorry. I always forget to tell. people. [laughter]. Um the uh you know when I went to. college way back in my day uh when I. went to college the state picked up. about 75% of my tuition and my family. and I had to come up with the other 25%. Right? And nowadays it's the exact.

opposite. So we have shifted we've as a. society have said it's not in all of our. interests that we have an educated. population. It's on you if you're going. to pursue that. And so state picks up. 25%, the individual picks up 75% and. they're putting more and more on credit. cards, more and more taking out debt, right? And so this is a part of the. equation that's gotten us here. Now, what is the solution? I think there's a. lot of debate and I don't think that. there's any uh solution on the horizon. right now. But I guess what I would.

challenge you and ask you is what do you. think? I mean, you're you're someone. that this, you know, you're you're. closer to the generation we're talking. about that's carrying all this debt. add. your amount of debt that you acquired. What do what do you think the solution. is? Because. >> well, I think this potentially might. have a part of the solution. One one. thing that many on, you know, the left. are kind of angry about this. And trust. me, bring a right-wing governor on and. I'll critique their things, too. You. know, you know, you're just on the left. wing, so obviously we're going to talk. about things that are interesting. But,

uh, they got upset that there are. graduate borrowing limits, undergraduate. borrowing limits. You talked about how. 75% used to be paid for by the state. Now it's 25% and it's on the individual. Well, a lot of the times on the left. we've seen borrow an infinite amount of. money to go to college, no caps. Why. wouldn't the colleges just continue to. raise how much it costs to go there if. you can borrow whatever? If if one goes. up, the other is going to go up. So. setting these caps should hopefully at. least discourage like they have to have.

people in, you know, butts in. classrooms, right? Y. >> they have to. And if people can't borrow. a certain amount to go there, they won't. be able to go. My hope is that would. hopefully, you know, restrict the. endless increase of administrators and. everything and just bull spending that. colleges do. Now, unfortunately, foreign. students, >> they pay cash and that's an easy. replacement. And another fear is people. will just go borrow from the private. student loans now. >> So, but I think what was kind of. confusing to me is like. >> the solution I haven't heard a solution.

on the left other than just keep raising. what people can borrow forever. And of. course, the schools are always going to. just say, "Well, can I have more money. then because you can borrow more?". >> Did you when when Biden supported, you. know, had his writing off debt. >> uh plan, did you how did that hit you? >> Um I wouldn't have qualified at that. time. Um actually, I think I may have. due to my previous year tax return. I. would have qualified for like a smaller. forgiveness. And I I'll take free money, you know, I'll take free money, but it.

wasn't a solution. >> It was nothing long term. It helps a. select group of people that have already. gone to school, but it doesn't help. anyone in the future because it didn't. address the actual issue. >> Right. It was interesting to me, you. know, as I talked to people in Michigan, um, you know, people who did take out. debt, but had paid it off, >> who were so like, you know, salty about. the fact that someone else who hadn't. paid off their debt could get it written. off. >> Yeah. You know, and it was kind of. interesting. And I just I it's a it's a. hard it's a hard challenge to figure out.

what the equitable solution is cuz we. don't want people carrying debt for. their whole lives. >> No, but letting people borrow infinite. amount for in my you know I went to high. school in Michigan. I went to a good. high school. Um. >> but still every administrator and. everything was borrow any amount to go. to whatever school you want for whatever. degree you want. We got people getting. both degrees that are not going to. translate in the market and they're. borrowing whatever it takes to go to the. school that has the sports team they. care about. I mean, this is not working. >> Yeah. Well, we should we could have a.

whole conversation about sports and and. college. >> If you were president in a hypothetical. world, you know, of course, you will. never run, but would you want the. wealthy to pay more taxes? What I I mean just for the purpose of. paying taxes or for the purpose of of. strengthening our you know and our. paying off our national debt for purpose. of our homeland security and making sure. that we've got defense. You know I think. we've got a lot of a lot of important.

things that we have not been doing. But. do you advocate for tax increases among. >> I'm not here I'm not here as a candidate. for a higher office and I'm not here to. advocate for any. >> Michigan would you raise taxes. >> in in Michigan I mean we did just raise. taxes for on on sales of cannabis. >> you know. >> but income taxes on individuals or I. know there's no capital gains taxes but. >> I have not introduced an income tax in. Michigan now. >> and you wouldn't support it if it came. across your desk. >> there's it ain't coming.

>> okay. >> I mean I'm just telling you I I know you. I know you want to play the. conversation. You want to play all the. hypotheticals, but. >> I'm crowded in reality. It ain't coming. >> Okay. >> Take a position on something that's. never going to happen. >> Okay. Um. >> when you're president, would you propose. higher taxes, income taxes? >> All that concerns me is, you know, California, um you know, they've lost. 1.6% of personal tax income cuz people. can move anywhere. Now the UK itself,

you know, they've lost six 16,500. um millionaires going all across the. world, they're losing tax revenue. substantially. 10% lost in taxes and. capital gains taxes because they decided. to close close some loopholes and. they're like, let's get people to pay. the fair share and now they're losing. more tax revenue. So that's why I wanted. to kind of hear your philosophy on this. Now we are uh wrapping up here. Um, can. I ask a couple uh quickfires, Miss Press.

Secretary? Sorry. Couple quickfires. Very cool. Quickfires. Very good. Um, Michigan is a declining population state. where southern states um, you know, Texas gain 4.3, Florida 4.7 where states. like New York, Michigan, California are. leaving. Why do you think that's. happening? Why is that transition. happening in this country? >> I [clears throat] wouldn't say we're. declining. We're not growing as fast. Yeah, >> I think that's an important distinction. the year of that this metric was taken. which was 2020 to 2023 that had a.3%.

loss. >> in our last census we were up a. percentage point so whatever I mean it's. not worth quibbling it's just the point. that. >> you know uh we do have an older. population in Michigan and I think. that's part of why our strategy around. investing in people places and. opportunities you know that bring good. paying jobs is going to continue to be. really important but. >> I do have a had a chief growth officer. first state in the country to do that. We want to stay focused on how do we. grow our population. It's important. >> And now in the state of Michigan, uh we.

are seeing Michigan court rule 6.106. provides that the default presumption is. released on personal uh recognitions. which is no money bond or on unsecure. bond rather than cash bail. We are. starting to see even a shooting that. happened in Austin over the weekend was. someone that has already had multiple. violent offenses. We know that people. individuals with three to 10 violent uh. crime convictions represent only.9% of. the total population but account for. almost 50% of violent crime. And those. who have been released from prison. account for 70% were rearrested within 3.

years. Is these no cash uh bail systems. that you know we're tending to see. places like New York, New Jersey, Illinois, DC and we talked about. Michigan. Is that actually benefiting. people or is it just are we not keeping. people safe like we want to? I think, you know, I'm I'm proud of a lot of the. the trajectories that we're on in. Michigan. I think that when it comes to. the no cash bail, what we see is a. situation where people without resources. pay a much bigger penalty than those. that do. Just one more example of it is.

in in the criminal justice um realm. Our. recidivism rate is really low in. Michigan. We're proud of that. But. certainly, you know, there are always. going to be examples of of where someone. is um you know, not a part of the the. general rule and and is a egregious. example. And I think you've just raised. a couple. >> And then two final rapid fires. Uh first. one a little more sad, second one very. happy. Political extremism. It's scary. >> I think we're in for a violent couple of.

years. >> It's an ungovernable city. People are. exercising a lot of their rights to take. it to the streets and get their voices. heard. Uh. >> political extremism was the number one. issue in America. >> An alarming rise in political violence. across the US, [music] targeting both. Democrats and Republicans. Nearly a. third of Americans now believe political. violence may be necessary to get the. country back on [music] track. >> A man broke into the Pennsylvania. governor's mansion in April and set the.

dining room al light in an attempt to. kill Governor Josh Shapiro and his. family. President Donald Trump is. announcing on True Social, Charlie Kirk. is dead. >> The horror unfolded around 9 last night. A group of people leaving a young. diplomat's reception at the Capital. Jewish Museum in Washington [music] when. a gunman opened fire. Both diplomatic. staff at the Israeli embassy were. killed. Tonight, it's being investigated. as a targeted terror attack. >> Right now at 6:04, Happening today, Motans will begin saying goodbye [music]. to a powerful political leader who was.

tragically assassinated in her own home. Stop those. >> Let's get that gun. >> I know people on Martha's Vineyard on. Martha's Vineyard who if they had the. opportunity to kill Donald Trump. probably would. They think he's Hitler. We just saw Charlie Kirk get shot. Me, you know, people are going to view me as. more right-wing from this conversation. cuz I push back on some leftwing. policies. And if Governor Abbott from. Texas was here, I'd push back on some. right-wing policies. That's what. happens. But people are going to see. that and they've already called me.

fascist and Nazi online just because I. say personal responsibility is okay with. money. Scary. But people are labeling that and. then killing them because they're. fascist. Kill all fascists. Okay, maybe. that makes sense. But if you label a. normal person a fascist, you kill them. What do you think is going on with. political extremism right now? And how. would you solve it? >> I think it's really dangerous when we. have uh leaders who want to fan the. flames of of anger and violence. I think. it we'll continue to see it grow, which. is why I take it so seriously, which is.

why whether the I'm the target of it or. one of my colleagues on either side of. the aisle is or the president of the. United States is, I speak out against it. every single time. I don't make excuse. for it. I do not accept it no matter. where it's coming from. It's not okay. And I think it's be refreshing if. everyone with a platform did that. >> And then final, hey, the poll came out. today. NCAA hockey. The top three teams, Michigan State, Michigan, Western. Michigan. We are the hockey state.

>> That's right. >> We And we own this place. National. champions last year, Western Michigan. I. don't know. You're probably rooting for. Michigan State, but I just I just I just. want to share a little bit of hockey. love here. >> I love it. Let's keep going, man. >> Yeah. [laughter] Awesome. All right. Future President of the United States, Governor Whitmer here. Thanks for. joining us for this financial audit. I'd. say, you know, hammer financial score. for the state of Michigan. honestly. looks halfway decent. Couple pension. concerns, couple of that overall net. worth concern, but uh looking at about a. six or a seven out of 10. So, Calebmer.com for that. Thank you,

Governor. >> Thank you. >> And don't forget to join us for the. financial auto post show where we do an. extra 20 minutes of this conversation. with me and the team and the producers. and we break down this conversation go. into more tea. I'll see you there. Click. that join button. Bye. >> Caleb, what's the one question you. really wanted to ask but you knew that. you maybe couldn't ask? Oh, we didn't. talk about hearing you say in front of. the governor. [laughter]. >> We're gooning out of the gate. >> That was my favorite moment. >> Hammer Elite is the best YouTube.

membership on the platform and I just. upgraded it. Three exclusive dedicated. shows every single day, Monday through. Friday. Join with the link in the pin. comment or description below. This is. the best membership you'll ever join. [music] That's a promise.