Can Hyrox survive its latest controversy? - Asia Specific podcast, BBC World Service

Okay, so it's been the talk of the town in the fitness community. An athlete competing and winning a Hyrox race in Beijing. Despite soiling herself halfway, other participants complained about hygiene. and the organiser had to apologise for allowing her to continue. Now, while that got everyone talking, the bigger question is. why has this fitness trend boomed so much. in Asia recently, and will it be another fitness fad? I'm Mariko in Singapore and this is Asia Specific from the BBC World Service.

Twice a week we bring you Asia Pacific stories unpacked by those who know them best. I have Rebecca Orme in the studio, a keen participant of Hyrox. Welcome to Asia Specific. Thank you. Thanks for having me. And we also have Gabe Heck, I'm told his nickname is the Beast. of Bangkok because he's based in Bangkok and he's one. of the fastest rising athletes in the Hyrox world, is that right?

Some would say, yeah. Thanks so much for having me on. No, thank you so much for coming on the pod. And before we dive into this latest incident, I'm just going to get you, Rebecca, to explain what Hyrox is to our audience. who might not be familiar and how, how you started getting involved in it. Sure. So Hyrox is a hybrid fitness event where you run eight kilometers. and one kilometer at a time. And in between each of the kilometers, you have to do a station.

So it starts with a run, then a skierg, then another one kilometer run, then a sled push, then a run, then a sled pull, then a run. I'm feeling tired just listening to it. Yeah, and then burpees next. Right? Gabe. Then the run. Then the row then carries. So farmers carries. Okay. Then a run, then lunges, then a run. And you finish on 100 wall balls. So for the everyday athlete like me, it would take you around an hour,

ten to an hour 30. That's in doubles. Sorry. Singles might be a bit slower than that. And I got into it really as a hobby with my husband, who we both have done a lot of sports in our time marathons, triathlons, all sorts, and we just decided to give it a go. So we did it twice together as mixed doubles and had a lot of fun doing it. And then I started to do it with a girlfriend, and we've now done it four times together.

I mean, you walked into our set, saw Gabe and said. that he's kind of like a celebrity of the sport. So Gabe, if you can just introduce yourself without being too humble. and tell us how you got into it as well. Yeah. So Hyrox first came to Asia about four years ago, I think the first race was Hong Kong end of 2022, and I had some friends who participated. They knew my background, and at that time. I was doing a sport called Spartan Race obstacle course racing,

and they just kind of scouted me out and said, hey, you know, I think you'd be good at this. And so yeah, just learned about it that way. Started to train for it. Did my first race, I did really, really well. And then just decided, you know, over the course of the next year. to really go all in and see what my potential was in the sport. And it's kind of transformed, you know, both my athletic journey. and then also my business, my coaching, a lot of things as well.

And I understand you were in Beijing. because everyone is talking about what happened there last weekend. where an Australian athlete completed the race. But halfway through, she soiled herself. And you were there, Gabe. So can you just tell us what you saw, what was your reaction, and so on? It's obviously a very unfortunate situation, kind of unprecedented. that something like this has happened in Hyrox, at least so far. I just completed my race. So we had the men's pro division go first.

Finished the race, went really well. Did a little cool down, came back. to watch the ladies race and some people in the crowd were already, there were some murmurs in the crowd that something had happened. I didn't quite know what was going on, and I went over to speak. with two of my friends who had told me what happened to Joanna. And then, you know, we were all just kind of dumbfounded watching the rest of the race unfold. And I think, you know, at that time, a lot of us were expecting her maybe to. step off the course or drop out, which I'm sure we'll talk about.

But she continued, the entire race finished. And yeah, at the time, it was definitely. awkward, very awkward to watch. Yeah. So you mentioned Joanna, Joanna Wietrzyk. She wasn't just a participant, though, was she? She's the fastest woman in Hyrox history. She's a top elite athlete in this sport. She initially released an Instagram post after the initial incident, saying "A win is a win",

and this attitude seems to have rubbed a lot of people. up the wrong way because they felt it was a bit tone deaf. Then, after a few days of intense scrutiny, she released another post. on Instagram offering her sincere apology to the people of China. Because that's where the race took place. She says though looking back, I regret the decision. to not have stepped off the track, and she retroactively withdrew from the Beijing event. and forfeited the points that she earned. Rebecca?

I'm not an elite athlete, and so I can't put myself in her shoes. And I think elite athletes have another level of being able to push themselves. and punish themselves more than a regular athlete. I do think that the human side in her may have stepped up, and when it didn't, Hyrox should have. The race directors who were there should have then stepped in. But my initial thought is, you've got to think about the health and safety.

of yourself, of others and the facilities and the equipment. You know, this is not the Olympics. This is not. a sport that rolls around once every four years and you can't do it again. You know, she'll have many races on her calendar. This is not her last chance to participate. And it would have been the right thing to pull off. Yeah. I guess, as you say, much of the criticisms was towards the organisers. for not stepping in and allowing her to continue, especially given she actually,

I think, had a judge following her during the race. And since then, Hyrox co-founder Moritz Fürste has apologised. to all those affected, directly or indirectly by this incident. He also said that the brand is working to make immediate rule changes, but Hyrox also earlier said anyone sending abuse or threats of violence. towards the athlete would be banned from any future events.

Because her identity obviously was shared online. Gabe, what you said earlier, you thought she might stop, but obviously she didn't. I mean, why do you think that is and what would you have done? It's a very tough situation because obviously, it's easy. to reflect back on and think that the logical thing would be. to immediately, you know, find a restroom and go there. What I imagine was going on in her mind was potentially,

it didn't look as bad as it actually was. I think we've all seen the media and photos and saw really, truly how bad it was, but maybe in her mind she didn't think. that, you know, there's also sponsor obligations. So how does it work? So an athlete, an elite athlete in Hyrox gets sponsorship. and they get penalised if they stop halfway? No no no. So there wouldn't be any penalty. It would be more on the end of,

if there's a potential podium bonus attached to her contract, then obviously that would impact, you know, the ability to receive those funds. And you know, for her, she's living in Australia. It's a very far trip, I'd imagine. You know, it's costly to get to China and spend time there. And again, this is not to defend her say that gives her a reason to continue. It's just what I imagine might have been going on in the back of her mind. is thinking about the ramifications of stopping early and,

you know, quote unquote, being a failure, right? To her, her team or her sponsors. I also noticed there was quite a lot of anger towards the organisers, whose I think initial statement was. about trying to protect her, you know, asking people to stop the abuse, but not exactly taking responsibility for what happened. What was your reaction to not just exactly what happened in Beijing, but all the handling, if you like, afterwards? Yeah. And the irony is that post has been taken down as well and replaced.

with Mo's subsequent statement, which is a much better statement, although arguably it's probably too late because people have seen the initial post. And I think, again, the everyday athlete is disappointed. and surprised that that was the stance because it protected the athlete and. didn't offer any apology to the others who had to go behind or beside her. And I think there needs to be some deep consideration within the organisation.

as to what could be done better next time, and maybe not being reactive to these sorts of things and being proactive, thinking what else could go wrong at these events and plan for it? But I do think that there needs to be some reflection on remembering. that this sport was founded for the everyday athlete. It was the reason why Mo and the other founders started it. It was because they thought that every other athlete gets to compete.

You know, marathoners, runners have a sport, triathletes have a sport, and those that just worked out in a gym never had a sport. And this came about to be this incredible sport for people to do and. people in gyms to work on together. And that's why it got so big and so amazing. And we're also the athletes that pay the money to make this happen. And so to forget us and only focus on her was a bit of a misstep.

But I do also want to say there's a really important mental health element. to this. This incredible person, And I think, I forgot his name, Gabe, you may have seen the post. It's the best post out there on this subject today. He said something along the lines of criticise the decision. Do not dehumanise the person, and she is like the rest of us. And she would be feeling extremely vulnerable. and in a very challenging situation right now.

And so I think it's important for all of us in the fitness community. to remember that she is a human, and I'm sure she's ruminating on everything that she has done. The Hyrox has been booming in the region, hasn't it? And Rebecca, can you just tell us why you think? I mean, you told us how fun it was when you started doing it with your husband, but you know why this has become such a huge popular trend at the moment. I think because of the inclusivity of it and the fact that everybody can do it,

if you train, the sleds are probably the hardest thing to do. And if you can work on those, then you can get around the course. And there's so many options available. There's solo, there's doubles, you can do it as a relay. You know, I've got friends who are like, oh my gosh, I could never do this. And they end up doing a relay. So they only do two runs and two stations. And then, you know, fast forward a year, they're now doing it on their own. And that's incredible that people see this. as a goal to go beyond just something small.

to something, you know, bigger for themselves. Gabe, is Hyrox particularly bigger in Asia or is it just big everywhere? I think Asia was actually sort of the last part of the world to really catch the wave. It was booming in Europe and in America before. And now we see the World Championships coming to Asia next year. in Hong Kong, which is extremely exciting for everyone. And yeah, every race, the numbers are just, they've been growing like crazy. So I know when I started, you know, it was maybe 1000,

2000 people, which is already a lot at these events, but now it's tenfold just competing in Bangkok. last month, I think there were 20 thousand plus people. If we look over in in the United States, I think New York has races that are 80 to 100,000 people spanning. over the course of ten or 11 days. So it's really become this like, yeah, fitness cultural phenomenon. Like it's fundamentally changed the way that people think about, about themselves and created a new identity for,

for the everyday gym goer. You were saying, Rebecca, you do marathon as well, right? So in terms of like $200 that you have to pay to participate in Hyrox, how does it compare to like other sports that you've done? So I've done a half Ironman as well. And I would say that's still more expensive, but it also goes for a longer period of time. So you're out there, they've got a martial offer, you know, a swim, a bike. Obviously a road needs to be marshaled off and a run. So there's a lot more involved in an Ironman.

But similarly for Hyrox, you're renting out a massive facility. that's going to cost you a lot of money to rent as well. So there's obviously overheads that go towards it. Marathon, similarly, they have to block roads and get marshals and all the rest of it. So I think all of these sports that we sign up to do, I'm not sure anyone does it thinking. I'm going to make money from this unless I'm really elite. And it is a funny concept to pay to punish yourself, but it's also satisfying.

And it's not like just training for it, because once you're in this environment and everyone has the goal to finish. and push themselves, you will always go faster. in a race environment than you would in a training environment. And you've got the like minded athletes there with you. And in the case of a marathon, you usually make a few friends along the way. You usually run with somebody for a few days at a time. Rebecca, you were saying earlier how you were disappointed. about how the organisers handled this incident. Would you still continue participating.

Hyrox? Could it be another fitness fad and you can move on to something else, or would you stick with it? I think I'd still stick with it. I'd want to make sure that everybody's health. and welfare was considered ahead of any other event. I think there's definitely some apprehension around, you know, are they because you use the same mats for every single race? And so even amongst the community or a bit like, have they really thrown those mats away? Because. the statement that came out was that they've been disinfected and treated.

But for any of us that have competed, those mats are not really reusable after something like that. They're quite thick and grainy is probably the best way to describe it. So all of the equipment from there would probably need to be thrown away. And so I'd want to make sure that there was safety. and health front of mind for all of the future events. With respect to it being a fad, I think it's still got life left in it. And again, the accessibility of it to people.

It's probably not going to have the same hype forever. I think sports tend to die off a bit. If you think about CrossFit, if you think about Spartan, Tough Mudder, all these other events that have come up over the years, you know, they have a really hot phase and then they kind of peter off a bit. You know possibly that will happen here. And you even see already there's different iterations of Hyrox. You see turf games coming up. There's pure games. So I think this hybrid fitness world will morph into other different competitions,

particularly as it gets harder and harder to get a slot for Hyrox. I think even when you're based in Singapore, it was, I didn't get a ticket for November. And so it was really hard even when you lived here to get a ticket. It's really hot to get a ticket now. So I think the other sports opening up will make it accessible for others to join that too. If they can't get a ticket. It's certainly very hyped up now. and it's sort of the leading player in the market. But I think as we have seen maybe in the future,

some of these other events which are really exciting. and do offer different challenges for people will continue to rise. And I think it's just going to be a big macro trend in sort of the fitness industry in general, where as more people want to train not just to look good, but to, you know, for performance and pushing themselves. in a different way that yeah, we'll see different, different types. of competitions emerge and maybe it'll become a little bit more, yeah, more options for people because. yeah, right now it's crazy how hard it is to get tickets.

So I guess you don't neither of you expects this incident to dent. its popularity and possibly make those tickets more readily available. The Chinese social media that I've seen is a lot of people are extremely upset. I feel very kind of done wrong by Hyrox. And, you know, I think the right move Hyrox is doing now. is refunding everyone who did race after the incident. And that's a great first step. And again, hopefully more will be done to,

to help people feel like, yeah, their safety is a priority. They feel like, this really is a one off. This should absolutely never happen again. So again, I still remain optimistic. And, and I'm sort of of the belief that yeah, mistakes can happen. It just has to be fully dealt with. And we can move on from it at that point. I actually, because I haven't been able to get into Singapore, I posted on Carousell wanting to buy a ticket for November. And after the event over the weekend, somebody messaged me and said,

oh, I'm not going to race anymore. And so we had some back and forth. And then she said, you know about the scandal, right? And I thought she meant a scam, like an online scam. And I said, oh, I'm aware of scams because I've been victim to one before. when I tried to get a ticket for Jakarta. So I said, I'm aware of scams, so I'll only do it through the official channels so you can change. If you buy the flexi ticket, you can change the name of the athlete. So if it's two women then you can change to two women. And she said no, I mean scandal from the weekend. And I said, oh yeah, I'm aware of that.

And she said, well, so we're not racing now because of it. I said, oh, that's taking a big stance. And so I do think some people that have not done this before may be a bit hesitant. I don't want this to be my first time now that this has happened. So there might be some people that may no longer want to do it, but if she sold me that ticket, I'd still take it. Well, thank you so much for joining me, Gabe and Rebecca. Thank you for having me. Thanks for having us. Thank you.

You've been watching Asia Specific from the BBC World Service. with me, Mariko Oi in Singapore. If you have any questions or thoughts on what we covered in this episode. or any other stories from the region, please leave us a comment below. You can also get in touch with us on email asiaspecific@bbc.co.uk. and click like and subscribe so you never miss an episode. See you next time.