Why Israeli troops in Lebanon are not withdrawing | Global News Podcast

Welcome to the Global News podcast from. the BBC. I'm Valerie Sanderson and I'm. joined by Carine Torbey from BBC Arabic. who's in Beirut in Lebanon. And these. are the final day of talks, aren't they, Carine, between Lebanon and Israel? What's the aim of these discussions? >> Well, today was the third and final day. of these talks. It's the seventh round. of talks between Lebanon and Israel. The. aim is to solve the conflict between the.

two countries. Lebanon hopes that by the. end of these talks, it will be seeing. Israeli troops withdrawing from Lebanon. What Lebanon wants is the end of the. hostilities, uh Israel abiding by the ceasefire. because there have been lots of. violations uh of the ceasefire from. Israel from Lebanon's point of view, and. Israel withdrawing from the areas it. occupies in Lebanon. Now, Israel in. return says that it wants to guarantee. uh the security of the north of Israel.

and making sure that there is nothing in. South Lebanon that could uh present any. threat to the security of Israel. Therefore, what it is asking for is the. dismantlement of any Hezbollah. infrastructure and for the Lebanese army. to make sure that there isn't any. Hezbollah's presence. But basically, there is absolutely no breakthrough on. the ground. On the contrary, what we saw. in the last of past 2 days is basically. um. a fears of a renewed escalation. Israel.

has been intensifying its strikes on. Lebanon. And um. as we are speaking now, there are. reports of more strikes happening, Israeli strikes on southern Lebanon. >> And there'd been this proposal for. withdrawal from pilot zones. What would. that entail? >> Well, the idea of pilot zones was uh. suggested as kind of a gradual process.

towards uh some sort of withdrawal from. Lebanon. Lebanon was hoping that Israel. would start a gradual withdrawal from. areas it occupies in southern Lebanon. The Lebanese army will take over control. these areas, and once there is kind of. consensus that these areas have become. safe in terms of that there isn't any. presence of any military groups on those. areas other than the Lebanese army, then.

we would move to another town. And town. after town, uh Lebanon will uh see all. the Israeli troops leaving. But what has. been happening here for in the first. kind of implementation of these pilot. zone have been very disappointing for. the Lebanese. First, two of the three. pilot zones that were agreed upon. uh were not occupied to start with. These were towns where Lebanese army is. there, where uh Lebanese residents have.

gone back to. So there wasn't any. Israeli withdrawal from them. The third. one is a small town where Israeli troops. were actually on the outskirts of it, and uh we've seen 2 weeks ago the. Lebanese army entering this town for the. first time. But but this isn't really a. major breakthrough, and if this is to be. implemented on that scale, then it would. take years and years to see. uh um the Israeli troops lea- leaving. the the the territory they occupy in.

Lebanon. So there is a sort of. disappointment in Lebanon so far uh. about the um. imp- implementation of this pilot zone. process, and whether it will actually. lead to any kind of Israeli withdrawal. from the um areas it occupies in. Lebanon. >> And some of these places, I'm thinking. of Ali Taher Hill. What is the specific. problem with those? Because as I. understand it, Israel says, "Well, that's where Hezbollah are.".

>> Yes, basically this is one of the main. areas that Israel claims has Hezbollah's. infrastructure, tunnels, network of. corridors underground. And that is one. of the areas from where Hezbollah. fighters were launching attacks. on northern Israel from from. And at the. moment, it is an area that. is surrounded by Israeli troops under. Israeli. control armed control. And and it is one.

of the sticking points because Israel. might conduct some. big operation there. And it has been. conducting lots of demolitions of. structures in several towns across South. Lebanon, especially in the areas it. controls and it occupies in South. Lebanon. And this has become a main. concern for the Lebanese authorities and. also for the people here who think that. lots of of towns in South Lebanon have. been completely wiped out by by the by.

the Israeli forces. And even the finance. the Israeli finance minister has said. that Israel has completely and totally. destroyed more than 20 villages in South. Lebanon. All of this create a feeling. that there is a a change of of. everything in these areas and that there. are conditions that might make it. impossible for people to return to these. areas when these towns see any kind of.

Israeli withdrawal from them. >> What about this idea of verification by. a third party to oversee Israel's. withdrawal and indeed oversee Lebanon as. well? >> The idea of the third party verification. is uh is linked directly to the idea of. the pilot zones. Now, uh basically, it. is a third party, that's not Lebanon, neither Israel, that should come and.

verify and assess whether the Lebanese. armed forces were able to control any. area there from where the Israeli forces. withdraw, and make sure that this is a. good start for um. a next area to see the implementation of. the same process. At the moment, we have. no agreement between Lebanon and Israel. about who is the third party. And all of. this is part of the details that are. still being worked out and that are.

still kind of uh there are lots of. differences about it about them between. Lebanon and Israel, and are actually. creating more and more obstacles into. the implementation of this idea of pilot. zones, and therefore delaying further. any kind of withdrawal, Israeli. withdrawal, from these towns. >> Carine, you say there's lots of. differences. They seem very split on how. to deal with Hezbollah, who of course. are not at these talks, are they? >> Hezbollah is absolutely against these.

talks. It considers that Lebanese uh. authorities are actually doing these. talks in the interest of Israel rather. than in the interest of Lebanon. And. they are not party to the to the talks, obviously, and they say that they refuse. any outcomes of these talks. Now, also, I mean, uh the Lebanese Lebanese state. says that Hezbollah is the one that got. Lebanon into this position, and that. whatever it is agreeing on and this. diplomatic path it has chosen to uh to.

go into has been the result of actions. by Hezbollah that have led to. uh to the situation Lebanon is in at the. moment. But uh but also, um people are. now wondering more and more whether. there will be any breakthrough from this. diplomatic path because, as I said. before, this is the seventh round, and. no one is seeing any uh kind of progress. towards solving these issues.

>> And you're in Lebanon. What's the effect. of these talks there because they're not. popular, are they? >> Well, there are deep divisions about the. talks. Some people consider that, I. mean, a large proportion of of Lebanese. consider that uh these are the only. available option for Lebanon. Lebanon uh. can't afford to get anything solved. except through diplomatic talks and. probably diplomatic pressure later on. And um um another another uh.

large number of Lebanese considers that. what is Lebanon is doing is definitely. not for the benefit of Lebanon. doesn't. want to engage with Israel in any way or. sort, and considers that uh Lebanon has. been uh giving Israel lots of. um compromises or sacrifices, and that, in return, it's not getting anything. that is in the interest of the country. >> Thanks, Carine. That was Carine Torbey.

there in Beirut in Lebanon. If you'd. like to hear more about this story, just. listen to the Global News Podcast. Click. on the link below. But, that's it from. this edition of the Global News Podcast. here on YouTube. Thanks for listening. Thanks for watching. Join us again next. time.