Heist at the Louvre Episode 3: The Suspects

Hi, this is James Longman back with. another episode of the latest true crime. series from ABC Audio and 20/20 Heist at. the Louvre. Remember, you can listen to. the entire series ad-free and access so. much more from 20/20 on Apple Podcasts. when you subscribe to 20/20 True Crime. Plus. Just click the link in the. description to start your free trial. today. Terms apply. And now, here's the. episode. When you think of Paris for a vacation. spot, I bet you're thinking croissants,

cute cafes, and walks by the Seine. Maybe with an accordion playing. If you've been, you might have stayed in. a charming little hotel in the Latin. Quarter or [music] a rental apartment in. Montmartre high in an attic overlooking. cobbled streets. These pretty areas of Paris, the. arrondissements, are circled by a kind. of beltway. And these arrondissements. are increasingly kind of just for. tourists. >> [music]. >> It's outside of that beltway where most.

regular Parisian live. And there's a. name for these areas, the banlieue. The word translates to suburbs, but over. time it's come to mean something else. 100 years ago, factories were built on. the edge of Paris. Communities grew. around them. Then in the 1960s, some of. the suburbs saw low-income housing. spring up, high-rises and estates. These. areas were more accessible for new. immigrants arriving from France's former.

colonies, countries like Algeria, Tunisia, or Morocco. But then, factories closed, unemployment. crept in, poverty rose. These areas now. have a high crime rate, and they've. become a political talking point. One of. these banlieue, the 93rd district, is. perhaps the most [music] infamous. It. had its share of bad press when riots. broke out there in 2017. And after the. Louvre heist, >> [music]. >> he had a little more.

10 days after the heist, the lead. prosecutor in charge of the case held a. press conference. She said investigators. had arrested two men for their suspected. involvement in the Louvre heist, and. both of them were from that infamous. 93rd District. "As I speak," the lead. prosecutor told the press, "the jewels. are not yet in our possession." And she.

had a warning for anyone who might know. where they were. "Anyone who buys these jewels," she. said, "will be guilty of a crime, receiving stolen goods.". And then she looked right into the. camera, like she was addressing someone. directly, and said, "There is still time to return them.". >> [music]. >> Four men had been seen robbing the. Louvre. The prosecutor said she had two.

of them in custody. And then, just a few. hours after this press conference, another man was arrested, too. From statements by the prosecutor, I. learned that all three of the men had. some link to Aubervilliers, a town in that 93rd District. So, that. is where I went. We're a long way from the golden halls. of the Louvre, but this theft has. reached every corner of France. It was a week after the prosecutor's.

press conference, and while the three. arrested suspects were in custody, no. further details of the investigation. would be made public. But I wanted. [music] to find out who these suspects. were, what they were like, and of. course, if they did it. So, I went. looking for the people who knew them. >> [music]. >> And. I found them. I've come to this part to speak to a. family member of one of the suspects. I'm very, very nervous to speak to. anyone. >> From ABC Audio, I'm James Longman. This.

is Heist at the Louvre. >> [music]. >> Episode 3, the suspects. In her press conference, the prosecutor. gave some details about the first two. men arrested. The first, she said, was. 34, an Algerian national who'd been. living in Aubervilliers for over a. decade. He was arrested at Charles de. Gaulle Airport, allegedly with a one-way. ticket booked to Algeria. The prosecutor said his DNA had been.

found on a scooter believed to have been. used by the thieves to escape. The. second man arrested was 39 with, the. prosecutor said, previous convictions. for aggravated theft. And she said his. DNA was found on the smashed display. cases. So, these two men, the prosecutor. alleged, are the ones seen on the CCTV. footage from inside the Apollo Gallery. The ones who grabbed the jewels out of. the cases. The third suspect arrested was also in.

his 30s and also from Aubervilliers. A. suspected fourth man was still at large. French prosecutors hadn't released. details about the arrested men's. identities, but news had quickly spread. of who they were, which is how I ended. up in an outdoor gym in Aubervilliers on. a chilly evening in early November. >> Okay. >> Yeah, yeah, yeah. Imagine Venice Beach, but much colder. The gym was lit by. bright LED streetlights, and it was.

packed with big, muscle-bound men. Rap. and hip-hop was blaring, and then in the. middle of all of this was Mehdi. >> Salut. >> James. >> Mehdi. >> Mehdi. Salut, Mehdi. Now, I said that I was meeting a family. member of one of the suspects there, but. it's a little bit more complicated than. that. Mehdi and the suspect have very. similar backgrounds. Both of their. families come from West Africa. They're not blood relatives per se, but. they're close, very close. And Mehdi.

says that they consider each other. family. In the gym, Mehdi just looked cool. He. was dressed all in black with this low. cap which was covering his eyes, and he. had a big smile on his face. I told him I wanted to know more about. his friend. Now, we're not going to use. his real name since his identity hasn't. been made public by French authorities.

Mehdi told me that his friend was like a. big brother to him growing up in the. 93rd, and that he was a dirt bike. enthusiast. He used to pull wheelies in. Paris streets. And that's why we're. going to call this suspect. Motorbike. Mehdi describes this guy as someone who. loves speed, thrills, and adrenaline. But he also says he's respectful, humble. He calls him a family man.

Mehdi told me that Motorbike had kids. and that he would bring them to this. park right where we were standing. He. also described him as someone without a. steady income, someone who did petit. boulot, odd jobs, to try and make ends. meet. Mehdi was painting a picture of a person. who seemed really quite like the. neighborhood we were standing in, vibrant and engaging, but also a little. down on his luck. I asked Mehdi why he thought Motorbike. had been arrested.

He said, "That's a good question.". Mehdi told me that we shouldn't be. making judgments before a trial has. happened, and that Motorbike should be. presumed innocent until proven guilty. He'd heard that investigators had found. Motorbike's DNA, but he also seemed. skeptical about it. "I read the news. just like you," he said. >> [music]. >> The feeling I got from Mehdi was that he. wanted me to know two things. The first.

was that the theft had kind of annoyed. him. He said the whole thing had hurt. him as an art lover and as a Frenchman. "It's bad for my French heritage," he. told me. "It's the history of Napoleon.". The second thing was that he clearly had. a high opinion of Motorbike. He. described him as a hero of his, someone. he looked up to, and that he seemed. protective of.

I wanted to know what he made of the. charges his friend faced. But when I asked him about Motorbike's. DNA being found at the crime scene, he. quickly redirected me. He said, "The. real question should be about the lack. of security at the Louvre itself." He'd. also noticed that the Apollo Gallery, where so many priceless jewels were. displayed, only had a few security. cameras. But out here in Aubervilliers, it's the opposite. He's making a very good point that they.

are very heavily watched everywhere. There are cameras all around us here. But they don't seem to be the right. cameras in the right places in the. Louvre. I mean, he's not wrong. There is an. irony to how many cameras were watching. the housing estates and how few were. watching the jewels. In fact, it is. clear to me that this heist has. reignited a lot of old arguments in the. press about the suburbs and the people. who live there. As details of the Louvre heist trickled. out, it became apparent all the suspects.

had ties to immigrant communities. Some right-wing commentators claimed. that the heist happened because of. immigration. A right-wing politician, Eric Zemmour, posted on X the day after. the first arrests, "Immigration is. stealing our crown jewels," he said, "in. short, our civilization.". The whole thing had become a political. scandal with many public figures calling. for more protection of historic. artifacts. Standing in front of Medhi at that.

outdoor gym in Aubervilliers, I wondered. if Medhi may have had feelings about the. heist and motorbike that were caught up. in a much bigger conflict about who. owned French heritage and who had a. right to feel upset about the theft. I'm saying to him, "I'm getting a huge. conflicting feelings from being around. these guys.". They're saying on the one hand. they feel this theft, these jewels belong to them as much as. they do to anyone living in the nice. parts of Paris. But at the same time I.

say to him, he's smiling a little bit. Medhi clarified. He was smiling not. because he didn't think the theft was. serious, it was from mistrust about how. it was being reported. "I smile because. I'm not being told everything," he said. He just didn't believe he was getting. the full picture from what had been. reported and he felt motorbike had been. demonized in the press. As I got ready to leave, Medhi asked me. to come back again soon. Okay, let's see the guy.

Back then, in early November 2025, authorities had arrested three men who. they said were at the Louvre on the day. of the robbery. But what about the alleged fourth member. of this group? It would take. investigators a little while longer to. arrest him. But in late November of 2025, that's exactly what they did. >> [music].

>> A few months after meeting Medhi in the. park in the spring of 2026, I went back. to Paris and I still had questions. I wanted to know what the suspects. themselves had to say about the charges. they faced and obviously that wasn't. going to be easy with all four of them. behind bars. But I knew there was someone they were. still speaking to. Their lawyers. So that is who I reached out to next. First, I talked to the lawyer of the man. who allegedly tried to flee to Algeria.

and we'll call this man Airport. Interestingly, this lawyer told me that. Airport had admitted to the crime. He. confirmed being inside the Apollo. Gallery, smashing the cases and grabbing. the jewels. She said he actually. apologized to, quote, all of France for. what he'd done. But as for further details about the. investigation, she couldn't say much. more. >> And if we can lean forward just so that. you're. because the room is yeah.

>> Do you want to close the door? >> Yes, please. This is the second lawyer I spoke to. She represents a different suspect and. she had a lot more to say. I met her on a pretty little street near. the Champs-Élysées in an office a few. stories up. >> I'm Minya Arab-Tigrine, a lawyer in. Paris. Uh. I practice criminal law. and I am the defenser of her. in the Louvre case. >> Minya's client was the last man.

arrested. So, let's just go through the. four men and what we're calling them. There's Motorbike and Airport. These are. the first men in custody. Then there's a. third man who we don't know too much. about, so we're just going to call him. Mr. Unknown. And then there's Minya's. client and we're going to call him. Gasman since at the time of his arrest, she says he was working as a gas. technician on construction sites. I asked Minya if she remembered hearing. the heist back in October 2025.

>> What was your first reaction, your first. emotional response? >> How can it be possible? I'm pretty sure that all the citizen in. France was just shocked by the situation. and the vulnerability of the Louvre. >> She said the French citizen in her was. stunned, but the lawyer in her? >> Surprised. >> [laughter]. >> Interested and I really wanted to know. who. >> Yeah. >> uh was uh about to do it in term of um.

in front we say culot. >> Um yeah, who had the guts. >> The guts. Who had the guts. >> And did you think, I wonder who did it. and I wonder if that person might need a. lawyer? >> Yes, of course. All the lawyer friends. for sure. >> [laughter]. >> When the arrests were made of the first. three Louvre suspects, Menya didn't hear. anything. But then, about a month later, she got a call. It woke her up at 6:00. a.m. >> [music].

>> The the policeman told me, can you come? And I was like, yeah, but later in. [clears throat] the day, let me just. wake up. And he was like, it's the. Louvre. So, I said, I'm coming right now. >> Wow. [laughter]. It was November 25th, five weeks after. the heist. And according to Menya, Gassmann had just been arrested in a. small town 200 miles from Paris called. Laval. And Menya got the call saying he. wanted her to be his lawyer. She said they'd worked together before. She'd defended him in a different case.

>> Can you tell me what that case was for? >> Um [snorts]. >> [clears throat]. >> do you know what is a. proxenetism? >> Proxenetism, making money from. prostitution. According to the. prosecutor's office, he also had. previous charges for receiving stolen. goods and for driving without a license. Now, Menya's used to defending people at. the center of big public stories. One of. her previous clients was a man convicted. of terrorist murder for his role in a. Belgian mass killing in 2016.

Persona non grata? Not a problem for. Menia. And in fact, that is what seems to. motivate her. A belief in pure justice. where everyone gets a fair hearing. And. what worries her about this case is that. all this attention might make it harder. for her client to get that. >> So, can you tell us about him? >> He was born. um. in the suburb of Paris. And uh. >> Menia's client, just like the other. suspects, also had links to the 93rd.

district. And according to Menia, Gassmann was implicated in the Louvre. case because of his presence at a. parking garage in Aubervilliers. Now, just being in a garage is hardly a. crime, but when he was there and who he. was with, well, that might have stood. out to investigators. >> [music]. >> On the day of the heist, according to. reports in the French press, about an. hour after the theft, two motorbikes. were seen on CCTV pulling in to the.

Aubervilliers garage. Investigators. reportedly believed that they'd been. driven there by Louvre suspects. Menia. told me that Gassmann had also been. there because he had keys to open up the. garage, and these men, who he knew, wanted to store their bikes there. Six days after the meeting at the. garage, airport and motorbike were. arrested. Three days after that, on. October 29th, the third suspect, who. we're calling Mr. Unknown, was also. arrested. And then, Gassmann left for a.

business trip to western France. Menia. says he had a job on a construction site. there. The police followed, and he was. arrested on November 25th, 2025. Menia says Gassmann had been at the. garage, but that didn't mean he'd been. anywhere near the Apollo Gallery. >> My client contests the fact to. have been at the Louvre this day. >> Uh he says he wasn't even there. >> No. Not at the Louvre.

>> And as for the rendezvous at the garage, he was called by a friend to open up his. garage to put two motorbikes in. >> Yeah. >> And he didn't have any idea that it. might be linked to the Louvre. >> No. >> Menya says he had no idea that the heist. had even happened. She says he had been asleep. >> But he could then later that day, the. next day, the next week, he could have. gone to police to say, >> Uh. >> "I think these guys maybe were involved. They asked me to hide some motorbikes.

It looks like the ones on CCTV. They. released this footage on the news.". He could have done these things, but he. didn't. >> Would you do it to your friends? I'm not sure what they would do. >> [music]. >> He's not the the fourth. >> He's not the fourth man. >> Yes. >> Prosecutors seem to disagree. According to a police statement, they.

charged Gasman with the same crimes as. the other three suspected Louvre. thieves, organized robbery and criminal. conspiracy to commit a crime. >> Is there anything you think your client, if he was here now, what would he like us to know? What. would be the one thing, apart from that. he wasn't there on the day? What would he want to tell us, do you. think? >> My client? >> Mhm. >> [music]. >> Believe me. I guess.

>> I really didn't know what to believe. According to Menya, Gasman was innocent. Airport, by his lawyer, had admitted he. was guilty. Motorbike, according to the prosecutor, had claimed partial responsibility, though I didn't know exactly what that. meant. And there was this other suspect. arrested, Mr. Unknown, we're calling. him. I hadn't been able to reach him at. all. I had no idea what he was thinking. And I'll be honest, I had hoped that.

someone might know something about the. location of the jewels. If they did, obviously no one wanted to tell me. As I left Menia's office that day, something struck me that I hadn't really. thought about before. I stopped to talk. about it with my producer, crammed in a. tiny stairwell outside Menia's office. Yeah, we just we've walked out. downstairs from the office building. I'm standing next to the smallest lift. in the world. I just thought that was fascinating. You.

know, she sees that she's defending a. man she genuinely believes is innocent. I Yeah, I mean, my biggest takeaway is. that I I thought of these four men as. four of the same kind of person, and I'm. quickly realizing that each of them is. completely different. And that's what makes this so. fascinating and and what makes it. so much more interesting going forward, because it could go in so many different. directions. That's the tiny lift moving behind me, and I think she's coming down from her. office to go to dinner.

>> I hope you are not speaking about me. >> [laughter]. >> Bonne nuit. Bonne nuit. Bonne nuit. Merci. >> [music]. >> Now, the trials for these men are a long. way off. Menia told me it might take. years for these cases to go to court. When they get there, according to a. statement from prosecutors, the charges. could bring jail time of 10 years per. person. Remember, the investigation into the. Louvre heist is top secret. So, what. will be presented by the prosecution at. trial could cast this whole case in a.

completely different light. It looked like the only thing I was. going to be able to do was wait. I. thought that for now at least that was. all I'd find out about our Louvre. suspects. Turns out we hadn't heard the half of. it. After my interviews in Paris in the. spring time, I went back to London and I. soon got wrapped up in other stories. There was a water cover, then an.

earthquake. I kept one eye on any. mention of the Louvre heist, but didn't. expect much more news to come out of the. sealed investigation. >> Hello, Aisha Tilla? >> That was until late August, and that's. when I called Aisha. Aisha is an ABC producer and we go way. back. >> So, we've known each other for. more than 9 years? >> Yeah, for sure. >> She speaks at least four languages and. she and I have covered stories together.

all over the world. Belgium, Thailand, Uganda. >> And I remember Thailand very clearly. because you were in the middle of that. rainforest with your phone. She's always. on the phone to someone making a. connection. And then she's always on the phone to. someone, but wearing either one of two. shoes, either flip-flops or wedges. >> Yeah, yeah, it's true. Flip-flops, Brazilian flip-flops or high heels, one. or the other. >> Yeah.

>> I wanted to talk to Aisha because we've. been working on this story together from. the beginning. And at the end of summer. 2026, new details had emerged about the. Louvre suspects. We'd seen it reported. in French media. Two of the men had been. interviewed by investigators. It was. Mehdi's friend motorbike and the man. who'd allegedly been arrested at Charles. de Gaulle, the man we're calling. airport. Parts of the interviews had made their. way into the press and with it new. information about the heist. >> They're both basically saying the same.

thing, >> [music]. >> which is that they admit to taking part. in the theft. These are the two men who. were alleged to have been inside the. Apollo Gallery, who broke in through the. window, and who broke through those. glass cases. >> In these interviews, according to. reports, both men say they were. approached just a few days before the. heist by a mystery person and asked if. they wanted to take part in a robbery. [music].

>> He came to see him and he say, "Hey, do. you want to be part of it? I mean, are. you ready to?" And he say, "Oh, yeah, yeah, let's let's just go for it." I. mean, he was like, "Okay, I need, you. know, some cash. Let's just do it.". >> According to these reports, the motive. for these men seems to have been. financial. Airport claims to have been. told he'd be [music] robbing a jewelry. store and that he was offered 20 to. 25,000 euros in payment. Motorbike. reportedly told investigators that he. was broke and that he was offered a.

similar amount to take part. The person who'd reportedly offered this. payment, well, that was perhaps the most. interesting part of this new information. for me. This mastermind figure. >> [music]. >> I just feel this big looming presence, the shadow of the mastermind, whoever. that person is. >> One of the suspects reportedly says he. doesn't know exactly where the. mastermind comes from, but he does. describe him as Balkan. And there is an.

infamous Balkan crime syndicate and they. operate all over Europe. And I want you. to remember that because we're going to. come back to this a bit later. But this is where it gets really. interesting. According to the reports. we've seen, both of the men allegedly. say that the person who'd planned the. heist was there with them at the Louvre. that day. As for his identity, well, according to. the reports, neither man would name him. Motorbike said he feared repercussions. >> I mean they were all coming from the.

same neighborhood, you know? I mean in. in in this in this type of neighborhood, there is like a a code like um the the. law of the silence. You don't say. Yeah, code of silence. Even if you you see, you don't you don't say. >> Now, the existence of a mastermind could. be a story that both men agreed to stick. to, perhaps to give them some plausible. deniability about their role in planning. the heist. But in these reports, they do give. further details about the day of the. theft.

Motorbike reportedly says it was him who. dropped that crown, the one that. Frederick, the security guard, picked up. from the street. And the other thing that's interesting. in these reports is who they say wasn't. at the Louvre that day. They reportedly say that the other two. men in custody, the third suspect we'll. call Mr. Unknown, and the fourth, Gasman, they say they're innocent. >> The thing that also I find interesting. is that these two admit to being in the. room, admit to taking the jewelry,

but they're asked specifically who are. the other two members of the gang, and Motorbike says, "I can't give an. answer at this stage, but I will when we. get to court for the verdict.". And that for me is extraordinary. >> Now, this reporting, it also covers the. hours right after the heist. It says. that just as Gasman's lawyer, Menia, had. told me, there was a kind of robber. rendezvous in a garage in Aubervilliers. At that garage, Motorbike had reportedly.

been seen on CCTV handing over the. jewels to the mastermind, including a. tiara that had belonged to Empress. Eugenie. According to these reports, this. mastermind had been unhappy and thought. the thieves could have taken more. Motorbike reportedly said that they'd. simply run out of time because getting. into the gallery had taken longer than. expected. >> Let's just come on to the. where are the jewels now? Because that. is obviously the big question everybody.

wants to know. >> [music]. >> These reports are so interesting and. it's fascinating to learn more about. what might have happened that day. But do you know what they don't say? They don't say where the jewels are now. Both suspects pinpoint the last moment. they saw the eight pieces of the missing. French crown jewels. in the hands of the mastermind. According to these reports, the. mastermind told motorbike he was going.

to sell the jewels and that in that. garage, as motorbike handing them over. to him, there was another group there. waiting in the distance to whisk them. away. >> Just from a filmic point of view, the idea that there was this other group. across the road in this car park. somewhere, standing and waiting in the. distance. to see what had happened from the theft. I just think that is. just so vivid. You know what I mean?

>> Absolutely, yeah. >> Now, we should say we reached out to the. French investigators about this episode. and all the details on these suspects. including these reported interviews, but. they didn't respond to our request for. comment. And honestly, all of this leaves us with. a whole load of new questions. >> One of the big big things that I'm. thinking about now, there is a chance that the other two. people that police have in custody are. not the right two. It's like who the mastermind was,

is that person in custody? If not, where. is he? >> To be honest, after this chat with. Aisha, I'm left wondering maybe there. are two masterminds. One who was at the Louvre that day and. and that waited for their arrival in. Aubervilliers, the one that motorbike. reportedly handed the jewels to. And of course it is still possible that. this mastermind doesn't even exist at. all, that a group of small-time. criminals concocted this plan. themselves. If that is the case, then.

you've still got to wonder, are there. others on the outside hiding the jewels? >> Or another option was that like a art. collector who was fascinated by Napoleon. and. who specifically wanted this. >> But that's a possible I mean he might be. he or she might be the customer. So the customer. >> That's where we're going in our next and. final episode. What does all of this.

mean for the crown jewels? >> Aisha, as ever I love speaking with you. and yeah I'll see you. >> Next time, [music] I'll be following the. routes the jewels might have taken after. the heist, tracing their possible paths. through legal and illegal hands until. one day they might end up [music] in. yours. >> Is there a chance that they come through. Antwerp? >> At a certain point, yes.

>> That's one of the flaws in their logic. is they think well the heat's going to. die off and nobody's going to be. looking. No, no, [music] we're we keep. looking. >> [music]. >> Heist at the Louvre is a production of. ABC Audio hosted by me, James Longman, produced by Madeleine Wood, Aisha El. Hamar Castana, edited by Nora Ritchie, our supervising. producer is Suzy Lu, mixing by Evan. Viola. Special thanks to Katie Dendus, John.

Capodineus, [music] Indra de Lay Saham, Iman Varouqua, Michelle Margolis and. Suzanne de Canto. >> [music]. >> Josh Cohan is our director of podcast. programming, Amon McNiff is our. executive producer. >> [music].